Update on page 14 - Another Malaysia Airlines 777 crashed???

[curbsideprophet]

How do they keep losing contact with their airplanes?? I feel like I should just avoid believing the details of any major story in the beginning b/c the story ends up changing so much.

[annieblah]

Interior Minister in Ukraine is saying shot down (CNN)

[heyjude]

Jul 17, 2014 11:13:34 GMT -5 curbsideprophet said:

How do they keep losing contact with their airplanes?? I feel like I should just avoid believing the details of any major story in the beginning b/c the story ends up changing so much.

If you are shot down, you would lose contact.

[iammalcolmx]

Why would either Russia or the Ukraine do this anyway? The people on-board were most likely not mostly Russian or Ukrainian correct? If this was a mistake this is just piss poor seeing as you can hear ATC chatter to know what airplane that is.

[heyjude]

Jul 17, 2014 11:15:21 GMT -5 iammalcolmx said:

Why would either Russia or the Ukraine do this anyway? The people on-board were most likely not mostly Russian or Ukrainian correct? If this was a mistake this is just piss poor seeing as you can hear ATC chatter to know what airplane that is.

Someone was on it?

Mistaken flight?

[Cicero]

Jul 17, 2014 11:10:16 GMT -5 v said:

Jul 17, 2014 10:58:22 GMT -5 Cicero said:

The KLM AMS-KLIA flight? KLM and Malaysian Airlines code share that route. It's entirely possible it has a MA flight number but is on a KLM plane.

It is probably this flight, right?

info.flightmapper.net/flight/KLM_KL_4103

Operated by Malaysian

Yeah, it looks like that is it.  At one point I had the schedule memorised with which carrier operated which departure because it makes a difference in terms of alcohol served onboard.  It appears that near-usless information has left my memory.

[annieblah]

Jul 17, 2014 11:15:17 GMT -5 heyjude said:

Jul 17, 2014 11:13:34 GMT -5 curbsideprophet said:

How do they keep losing contact with their airplanes?? I feel like I should just avoid believing the details of any major story in the beginning b/c the story ends up changing so much.

If you are shot down, you would lose contact.

I think the question is more over if it happened over Amsterdam and then was shot down over Ukraine. Of course, that leads me to hijacking so, possibly, the reason as well to lose contact.

[IIOY]

Jul 17, 2014 11:15:21 GMT -5 iammalcolmx said:

Why would either Russia or the Ukraine do this anyway? The people on-board were most likely not mostly Russian or Ukrainian correct? If this was a mistake this is just piss poor seeing as you can hear ATC chatter to know what airplane that is.

I hate to make any assumptions right now given that we know diddly squat, but *if* this plane was shot down, at this point it seems the most logical conclusion is that it was some yahoo separatists with an itchy trigger-finger and no way of knowing (or desire to know) they had the wrong plane.

[annieblah]

Jul 17, 2014 11:16:56 GMT -5 heyjude said:

Jul 17, 2014 11:15:21 GMT -5 iammalcolmx said:

Why would either Russia or the Ukraine do this anyway? The people on-board were most likely not mostly Russian or Ukrainian correct? If this was a mistake this is just piss poor seeing as you can hear ATC chatter to know what airplane that is.

Someone was on it?

Mistaken flight?

I heard CNN mention it could have been thought to be a miltary plane.  But they were high, and it would be obvious they were not

[Velar Fricative]

From the non-sensationalist Brits at BBC:

Analysis: Jonathan Beale, BBC News

A defence expert has told the BBC that shooting down a plane at 10,000m (9.7 miles) would have required a long- range surface-to-air missile - possibly guided by radar.

That suggests it is unlikely it could have been downed by a portable air defence missile, or Manpad, which has a much shorter range.

The only other possibility is for an aircraft at that height to be downed by a fighter carrying air-to-air missiles.

The US*** will have access to satellite imagery that should be able to identify ultra-violet plumes if a long-range surface-to-air missile was fired.


***Of course we will.

[Cicero]

Jul 17, 2014 11:12:06 GMT -5 heyjude said:

Jul 17, 2014 11:11:02 GMT -5 wanderlustfoodie said:

I've flown Malaysia Airlines a few times without incident. I don't know that these two incidents means that there's something inherently wrong with the airline. This is a major flight route and the 777 is one of the safest planes. Both crashes are incredibly tragic for the lives lost and their families as well as for the larger implications, especially if this one was actually shot down.

Regardless I bet Malaysian Airlines is over. At least in name. JMO.

I wonder if Air Asia X will bring back its long-haul flights.

[mbcdefg]

Jul 17, 2014 11:12:11 GMT -5 IIOY said:

Jul 17, 2014 11:10:29 GMT -5 mbcdefg said:

Al Jazeera America ‏@ajam

"We didn't do it," Russian Ambassador Vitaly Churkin told reporters at U.N. headquarters alj.am/1qigeEL

Russia will deny this to the end, regardless.

Of course.

And you can disregard my post anyway, because apparently the ambassador wasn't even referring to the downed MA flight:

Al Jazeera America Verified account ‏@ajam

CLARIFICATION: Russian Ambassador Churkin's comment at the UN referenced downed Ukrainian military plane, not Malaysian passenger plane

[pixy0stix]

So BBC is positing that it was a government, not separatists.

[bimbi284]

I feel a little bit like this right now.


Seriously, WTF?!?!

[josieposy]

I have a link to a livejournal feed that supposedly has crash photos already. Not sure if I should link it or if the photos are even legit. Nothing gruesome (so far).

[Velar Fricative]

Jul 17, 2014 11:25:39 GMT -5 josieposy said:

I have a link to a livejournal feed that supposedly has crash photos already. Not sure if I should link it or if the photos are even legit. Nothing gruesome (so far).

I forget that LiveJournal is still very popular in the Russian-speaking world even though it is so passe here now.

[meshaliuknits]

Jul 17, 2014 11:09:32 GMT -5 cattledogkisses said:

Jul 17, 2014 11:06:29 GMT -5 pixy0stix said:

24 hour news cycle is a bitch. The last couple of times a big story has been reported roughly a quarter of each story was redacted.

Yeah. This is why I'm waiting for confirmation that what's being reported is actually accurate before I start building my underground bunker. 

I'm gonna start on the bunker anyway. If pixy0stix is right about enviromental stuff, I'm gonna need it anyway.

[ttt]

Jul 17, 2014 11:13:34 GMT -5 curbsideprophet said:

How do they keep losing contact with their airplanes?? I feel like I should just avoid believing the details of any major story in the beginning b/c the story ends up changing so much.

They can't say more than "lost contact" until they know for sure what happened (if it was shot down, hijacked, or what). 

[KateAggie]

I.....I....y'all this is fucking terrifying.

[josieposy]

Actually some of the photos on this are just now popping up on CBS right now.

[karinothing]

I feel like it is weird that all these gov officials are just tweeting about how sad they are about teh crash (or whatever). it just seems like something you should save for a press conference. Twitter is weird and dettached.

[aussiecrush]

Jul 17, 2014 11:31:33 GMT -5 pennypenny said:

Jul 17, 2014 11:13:34 GMT -5 curbsideprophet said:

How do they keep losing contact with their airplanes?? I feel like I should just avoid believing the details of any major story in the beginning b/c the story ends up changing so much.

We lose contact with planes all the time. Like dozens of times a day. Most of the time you never even know. You wouldn't notice until they are transferring to another towers control (that could be several hours). As long as they are at the correct altitude and staying on course there is no need for concern. It just so happens that the same airline had this happen and something tragic happened. Tragic coincidence. 

This isn't entirely true. Yes contact is lost all the time, some radar, some audio. Rarely both, rarely for long. You wouldn't go hours without anyone knowing.

[runforrest]

Holy shit. What the hell is going on in the world?

Between Ukraine/Russia, Israel/Gaza, South Sudan, Nigerian kidnappers, all the shit in the US...my head is going to explode and I'm about to curl up in the fetal position.

[Knight]

They're saying surface to air missile from the Russian side. It's not the first time it's happened.

[runforrest]

Jul 17, 2014 11:46:23 GMT -5 Lucy Honeychurch said:

Jul 17, 2014 11:45:15 GMT -5 runforrest said:

Holy shit. What the hell is going on in the world?

Between Ukraine/Russia, Israel/Gaza, South Sudan, Nigerian kidnappers, all the shit in the US...my head is going to explode and I'm about to curl up in the fetal position.

Don't forget the Ebola outbreak.  Shudder.

OMG.  And that brain-eating amoeba too.

I'm just going to start building that bunker now.

[lg28]

Like I needed another thing to be afraid of while flying.

[heyjude]

Jul 17, 2014 11:45:15 GMT -5 runforrest said:

Holy shit. What the hell is going on in the world?

Between Ukraine/Russia, Israel/Gaza, South Sudan, Nigerian kidnappers, all the shit in the US...my head is going to explode and I'm about to curl up in the fetal position.

Not to mention the US border crisis and whatever the hell catastrophe that is happening in Central America that is causing scared parents to send their children north by themselves!

[wanderlustfoodie]

Jul 17, 2014 11:20:50 GMT -5 Velar Fricative said:

From the non-sensationalist Brits at BBC:

Analysis: Jonathan Beale, BBC News

A defence expert has told the BBC that shooting down a plane at 10,000m (9.7 miles) would have required a long- range surface-to-air missile - possibly guided by radar.

That suggests it is unlikely it could have been downed by a portable air defence missile, or Manpad, which has a much shorter range.

The only other possibility is for an aircraft at that height to be downed by a fighter carrying air-to-air missiles.

The US*** will have access to satellite imagery that should be able to identify ultra-violet plumes if a long-range surface-to-air missile was fired.


***Of course we will.

Conspiracy-theory alert: couldn't it have also been something from inside the plane? (shudder)

[Velar Fricative]

I'd stay away from Twitter if you don't want to see graphic photos. Thankfully one I saw was blurry but that's when I decided to hightail it out of Twitter for now.

[miesl]

Jul 17, 2014 11:53:50 GMT -5 Velar Fricative said:

I'd stay away from Twitter if you don't want to see graphic photos. Thankfully one I saw was blurry but that's when I decided to hightail it out of Twitter for now.

It's not just random pics either - Reuters has some pretty vile ones.  Do we not have standards anymore?  There is a difference between news pictures and that.  Sigh.