Trayvon Martin Autopsy Report

[MrsAxilla]

May 17, 2012 17:54:36 GMT -5 @bumppkathleen said:

It's not Zimmerman's job to prove himself innocent, it's the state's job to prove that he is guilty

Are you sure about this? I got an A in crim law, but that was ten years ago, and I have zero familiarity of FL law. He's already admitted that he killed Trayvon. Doesn't the burden of proof shift to Zimmerman to prove his affirmative defense? It's absurd to also make the state prove Z had no defenses.

[fernane]

Yes, it's the states job to prove ZM guilty. Casey Anthony ring a bell? Guilty as sin, but walked bc the state sucked at their jobs of convincing the jury. Innocent until proven guilty, not vice versa. Although what you hear sounds incriminating, since noone actually SAW what went down, I don't think he will be found guilty as there's no way to prove beyond a reasonable doubt I don't think.
As for all these hair comments, since when does a person need long hair, or any hair at all, to hit the back of their head on the ground? I would think that if someone pushed you over from the front, your head would hit the ground. If this happened over concrete, there's your head abrasion.
Black eyes aren't always an immediate thing either. My best friend fell on her face on some marble stairs not long ago and there was swelling that night but her eyes werent completely black until the next day. No doubt the defense will go over all this extensively. That's why I think he will walk or do minimal time. Not enough there to seriously convict no matter how anyone feels about either side. Feelings don't win cases, proof does.

[ttt]

May 17, 2012 21:35:40 GMT -5 fernane said:

Yes, it's the states job to prove ZM guilty. Casey Anthony ring a bell? Guilty as sin, but walked bc the state sucked at their jobs of convincing the jury. Innocent until proven guilty, not vice versa. Although what you hear sounds incriminating, since noone actually SAW what went down, I don't think he will be found guilty as there's no way to prove beyond a reasonable doubt I don't think.
As for all these hair comments, since when does a person need long hair, or any hair at all, to hit the back of their head on the ground? I would think that if someone pushed you over from the front, your head would hit the ground. If this happened over concrete, there's your head abrasion.
Black eyes aren't always an immediate thing either. My best friend fell on her face on some marble stairs not long ago and there was swelling that night but her eyes werent completely black until the next day. No doubt the defense will go over all this extensively. That's why I think he will walk or do minimal time. Not enough there to seriously convict no matter how anyone feels about either side. Feelings don't win cases, proof does.

Wait, Casey Anthony claimed she killed her daughter in self-defense?

[MrsAxilla]

May 17, 2012 21:35:40 GMT -5 fernane said:

Yes, it's the states job to prove ZM guilty. Casey Anthony ring a bell? Guilty as sin, but walked bc the state sucked at their jobs of convincing the jury. Innocent until proven guilty, not vice versa. Although what you hear sounds incriminating, since noone actually SAW what went down, I don't think he will be found guilty as there's no way to prove beyond a reasonable doubt I don't think.
.

Well, since he ADMITTED he shot Trayvon, it's pretty easy to prove he shot Trayvon.

[StrawberryBlondie]

May 17, 2012 10:30:12 GMT -5 niemand88f said:

May 17, 2012 10:03:22 GMT -5 sailorette said:

So that means that Zimmerman's doctor can produce a big ol' xray of a broken nose, riiiiiiight? (Yeah, I'm guessing not).

Or if he did have all these injuries, he did them to himself. If they were real, how else could these injuries not appear on the police video, but suddenly have them the next morning? He had plenty of time to think about his situation and realize that documented injuries would help his case.

This was my thought as well. Or that he got in an actual fight with someone later.

[basilosaurus]

fernane, did you even read any of this thread? Casey Anthony is a completely different case than this. Like, not even in the same time zone (although, technically, I guess they are, being the proud products of FL).

You must not have read the comment about grabbing someone's hair to slam their head. Or you simply have no reading comprehension skills. Either way, I'm probably wasting my breath.

[StrawberryBlondie]

May 17, 2012 21:15:31 GMT -5 MrsAxilla said:

May 17, 2012 17:54:36 GMT -5 @bumppkathleen said:

It's not Zimmerman's job to prove himself innocent, it's the state's job to prove that he is guilty

Are you sure about this? I got an A in crim law, but that was ten years ago, and I have zero familiarity of FL law. He's already admitted that he killed Trayvon. Doesn't the burden of proof shift to Zimmerman to prove his affirmative defense? It's absurd to also make the state prove Z had no defenses.

I haven't done any criminal defense in about 3 years, but I'm positive you have to prove your affirmative defenses.

[MrsAxilla]

May 17, 2012 21:58:44 GMT -5 StrawberryBlondie said:

May 17, 2012 21:15:31 GMT -5 MrsAxilla said:

Are you sure about this? I got an A in crim law, but that was ten years ago, and I have zero familiarity of FL law. He's already admitted that he killed Trayvon. Doesn't the burden of proof shift to Zimmerman to prove his affirmative defense? It's absurd to also make the state prove Z had no defenses.

I haven't done any criminal defense in about 3 years, but I'm positive you have to prove your affirmative defenses.

Yeah, that's what I thought. But that FL law is whacked, so it's possible it shifted the burden of proof. Doubtful, though.

[emilyj]

Did you all see the recent reports that the autopsy also found traces of thc in Martin's blood?

m.yahoo.com/w/legobpengine/news/trayvon-martin-had-drugs-system-autopsy-found-203258665--abc-news-topstories.html?orig_host_hdr=news.yahoo.com&.intl=US&.lang=en-US


I personally have never done marijuana, but doesn't it make you mellow? This makes me LESS likely to believe Trayvon was the one doing any sort of violent attacking.

[pixy0stix]

May 17, 2012 17:00:07 GMT -5 @bananafish said:

americans reading this blog

I'm continually amazed that people can't tell the difference between a blog and a message board.

[emilyj]

May 17, 2012 22:42:18 GMT -5 pixy0stix said:

May 17, 2012 17:00:07 GMT -5 @bananafish said:

americans reading this blog

I'm continually amazed that people can't tell the difference between a blog and a message board.

Comprehension is like hard and shit.

[bumppkathleen]

Yes, self defense is ordinarily an affirmative defense. But gulit still has to be proven BARD, in spite of whatever the affirmative defense is. So even a slight showing on a affirmative defense - here, the physician's report - may be enough to create a reasonable doubt about whether he is guilty of manslaughter when the gov't can't rebut the showing with evidence of its own. (I'm also not sure self-defense is an affirmative defense in Florida). It gets complicated but bottom line is it was a huge police screw up not to have him checked out by a doctor and I think it's going to be enough to get him acquitted. Honestly, it might be enough for me to vote not guilty if I were on the jury, and I KNOW he wasn't really acting in self defense.

[bumppkathleen]

May 17, 2012 22:42:18 GMT -5 pixy0stix said:

May 17, 2012 17:00:07 GMT -5 @bananafish said:

americans reading this blog

I'm continually amazed that people can't tell the difference between a blog and a message board.

Umm, it is a talk board, mmmmkay?

[fernane]

May 17, 2012 21:44:27 GMT -5 basilosaurus said:

fernane, did you even read any of this thread? Casey Anthony is a completely different case than this. Like, not even in the same time zone (although, technically, I guess they are, being the proud products of FL).

You must not have read the comment about grabbing someone's hair to slam their head. Or you simply have no reading comprehension skills. Either way, I'm probably wasting my breath.

I wasn't bringing Anthony up to compare the cases I brought it up to remind ppl like you that it's the state's job to prove the person guilty, not for the person to prove their innocence. You obviously don't have the critical thinking capacity to link 2 thoughts even when the common link is clearly stated. Come on, that is second grade stuff.
I did read them all and a couple of ppl mentioned he couldn't have had his head slammed bc he doesn't have hair to grab..you're not wasting your breath, you in all likelihood are a waste of breath.

[ttt]

May 18, 2012 1:55:17 GMT -5 fernane said:

May 17, 2012 21:44:27 GMT -5 basilosaurus said:

fernane, did you even read any of this thread? Casey Anthony is a completely different case than this. Like, not even in the same time zone (although, technically, I guess they are, being the proud products of FL).

You must not have read the comment about grabbing someone's hair to slam their head. Or you simply have no reading comprehension skills. Either way, I'm probably wasting my breath.

I wasn't bringing Anthony up to compare the cases I brought it up to remind ppl like you that it's the state's job to prove the person guilty, not for the person to prove their innocence. You obviously don't have the critical thinking capacity to link 2 thoughts even when the common link is clearly stated. Come on, that is second grade stuff.
I did read them all and a couple of ppl mentioned he couldn't have had his head slammed bc he doesn't have hair to grab..you're not wasting your breath, you in all likelihood are a waste of breath.

Please google "affirmative defense" thx.

[bumppkathleen]

May 18, 2012 6:19:10 GMT -5 ttt said:

May 18, 2012 1:55:17 GMT -5 fernane said:

I wasn't bringing Anthony up to compare the cases I brought it up to remind ppl like you that it's the state's job to prove the person guilty, not for the person to prove their innocence. You obviously don't have the critical thinking capacity to link 2 thoughts even when the common link is clearly stated. Come on, that is second grade stuff.
I did read them all and a couple of ppl mentioned he couldn't have had his head slammed bc he doesn't have hair to grab..you're not wasting your breath, you in all likelihood are a waste of breath.

Please google "affirmative defense" thx.

Again, though the defendant bears the burden of raising facts supporting an affirmative defense that does not deprive the state of its obligation to prove their case BARD.

[ttt]

May 18, 2012 9:53:12 GMT -5 @bumppkathleen said:

May 18, 2012 6:19:10 GMT -5 ttt said:

Please google "affirmative defense" thx.

Again, though the defendant bears the burden of raising facts supporting an affirmative defense that does not deprive the state of its obligation to prove their case BARD.

Right. But here are the requirements for 2nd degree murder in Florida:

In order to convict a defendant in Florida of Second-degree murder, the State of Florida must prove the following three elements beyond a reasonable doubt:

The victim is dead;
The death was caused by the criminal act of the defendant;
There was an unlawful killing of the victim by an act imminently dangerous to another and demonstrating a depraved mind without regard for human life.


All of that seems pretty easy to prove because no one at all is disputing that Zimmerman caused Martin's death. It all hinges on whether the killing was lawful or not. And isn't that Zimmerman's responsibility now, to prove that it was lawful?