Right. So we should let these individuals sit, stew, become worse and then release them back onto the street to recommit.
Sounds like a plan.
This is whats wrong with the US prison system. This individual was sentenced to life, didn't mention if they had the possibility of parole or not. Its entirely possible that they'll be released at some point.
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"I was thinking about getting off on demand, but it sounds like I should be glad that I didn't"
Right. So we should let these individuals sit, stew, become worse and then release them back onto the street to recommit.
Sounds like a plan.
This whats wrong with the US prison system. This individual was sentenced to life, didn't mention if they had the possibility of parole or not. Its entirely possible that they'll be released at some point.
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"I was thinking about getting off on demand, but it sounds like I should be glad that I didn't"
Post by liveintheville on Sept 5, 2012 11:51:20 GMT -5
"Wolf noted that the Department of Correction's own medical experts testified that they believe surgery was the only adequate treatment for Kosilek."
If it's been determined medically necessary then I'm for it.
Doesn't mean I don't have sympathy for the victims or that I DO have sympathy for the convicted felon. Just means that I think this falls under the provision of necessary healthcare to inmates.
I think I agree with jaylea's assessment that typical Medicaid coverage is a good starting point for care that should be offered to prisoners. I'm not sure whether or not Medicaid covers reassignment surgery.
But I also agree with those that stated that reassignment surgery should be more widely recognized as a legitimate medical issue rather than elective.
In short, I hope it becomes more widely available but convicted murderers would not be my choice of where to start the trend.
Okay so basically, we should let prisoners suffer above and beyond incarceration just to assuage our feelings of anger and retribution?
Got it.
Let's just shut down the medical treatment aspects of the state penitentiary and leave them with a school nurse and a first aid kit.
not what I'm saying. but this just takes it too far. (imo)
I think about the ppl who just can't make life work on the 'outside' (lol) so they continue to commit petty crimes in the winter so they have food and a warm place to sleep.
Then I think about a bunch of crazies going out and murdering people b/c they will at least be able to be 'who they really are' after they get their surgery in prison.
I don't know why, but when I see the hearts poured out for prisoners, my heart pours out even harder for victims and families left behind. That has to be so hard for them, but they just have to suck it up and keep moving forward.
I just can't get behind it. I get that no one agrees, and i sound heartless, but my mind has not been changed. I see your point, but i am not convinced.
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"I was thinking about getting off on demand, but it sounds like I should be glad that I didn't"
Okay so basically, we should let prisoners suffer above and beyond incarceration just to assuage our feelings of anger and retribution?
Got it.
Let's just shut down the medical treatment aspects of the state penitentiary and leave them with a school nurse and a first aid kit.
not what I'm saying. but this just takes it too far. (imo)
I think about the ppl who just can't make life work on the 'outside' (lol) so they continue to commit petty crimes in the winter so they have food and a warm place to sleep.
Then I think about a bunch of crazies going out and murdering people b/c they will at least be able to be 'who they really are' after they get their surgery in prison.
I don't know why, but when I see the hearts poured out for prisoners, my heart pours out even harder for victims and families left behind. That has to be so hard for them, but they just have to suck it up and keep moving forward.
My heart doesn't pour out for the convicted offender at all. But in the same way I wouldn't deny an individual treatment for bipolar disorder, I wouldn't deny them treatment for this.
Whatever treatment a medical professional deems most appropriate.
Dude, my heart is not poured out for prisoners. Dude will still have to serve her time eating salisbury steak, wearing backless shoes and ugly ass prison overalls. It's not like gender reassignment surgery comes with a trip to Disney world and a backstage meet and greet with Justin Bieber.
All this does is allow this prisoner to serve their time on the same playing field as the rest of their murderous little felon friends. Bored out of the mind with some modicum of health.
Post by liveintheville on Sept 5, 2012 11:59:57 GMT -5
Just FYI. Not that I agree with the medicaid argument.
(2) The MassHealth agency does not pay for the following types of drugs or drug therapy without prior authorization:
(d) drugs related to sex-reassignment surgery, specifically including but not limited to, presurgery and postsurgery hormone therapy. The MassHealth agency, however, will continue to pay for post sex-reassignment surgery hormone therapy for which it had been paying immediately prior to May 15, 1993.
We need to stop with the "if the Average Joe on the street can't get it for free... the inmates shouldn't". Because a shitton of Americans don't have access to basic dental care. But does that mean we don't provide inmates a basic drill & fill? Because you better believe the cost to the state when the inmate gets a blood infection from the abscess will be FAR bigger. Or do you submit that we just let the blood infection go unattended as well? Where do you draw the line?
Dude, my heart is not poured out for prisoners. Dude will still have to serve her time eating salisbury steak, wearing backless shoes and ugly ass prison overalls. It's not like gender reassignment surgery comes with a trip to Disney world and a backstage meet and greet with Justin Bieber.
We need to stop with the "if the Average Joe on the street can't get it for free... the inmates shouldn't". Because a shitton of Americans don't have access to basic dental care. But does that mean we don't provide inmates a basic drill & fill? Because you better believe the cost to the state when the inmate gets a blood infection from the abscess will be FAR bigger. Or do you submit that we just let the blood infection go unattended as well? Where do you draw the line?
I agree but I do think Medicaid coverage may be a good guideline. And I believe that most state Medicaid policies include at least some level of basic and/or emergency dental care.
I agree but I do think Medicaid coverage may be a good guideline. And I believe that most state Medicaid policies include at least some level of basic and/or emergency dental care.
But you are missing the point. As difficult as it may be to do so, one can find coverage outside of medicaid. One can find a job that comes with benefits, some can join the military. You could hike to canada, you could slip the border to mexico or something. Your great aunt could remember you fondly and leave you her entire fortune with which you can buy all the healthcare you wish.
A prison inmate is in the custody of the department of corrections and thus their only choice are the facilities and services the DOC deigns to provide them, usually as advised by their physicians. Therefore the onus should be on the DOC to provide those services.
I've still not heard a good reason why the state should deny a prisoner medical care here.
I agree but I do think Medicaid coverage may be a good guideline. And I believe that most state Medicaid policies include at least some level of basic and/or emergency dental care.
But you are missing the point. As difficult as it may be to do so, one can find coverage outside of medicaid. One can find a job that comes with benefits, some can join the military. You could hike to canada, you could slip the border to mexico or something. Your great aunt could remember you fondly and leave you her entire fortune with which you can buy all the healthcare you wish.
A prison inmate is in the custody of the department of corrections and thus their only choice are the facilities and services the DOC deigns to provide them, usually as advised by their physicians. Therefore the onus should be on the DOC to provide those services.
I've still not heard a good reason why the state should deny a prisoner medical care here.
I'm not missing the point. Medicaid provides comprehensive medical care to people who are not in the position to provide it for themselves. I think prisoners fall into the same category.
As I stated earlier, I DO hope that reassignment surgery becomes more widely recognized as a legitimate medically necessary procedure. And I do hope that coverage includes Medicaid - and by extension, prisoners.
But do I think prisoners deserve top-of-the-line Platinum-level medical coverage? No.
I agree but I do think Medicaid coverage may be a good guideline. And I believe that most state Medicaid policies include at least some level of basic and/or emergency dental care.
But you are missing the point. As difficult as it may be to do so, one can find coverage outside of medicaid. One can find a job that comes with benefits, some can join the military. You could hike to canada, you could slip the border to mexico or something. Your great aunt could remember you fondly and leave you her entire fortune with which you can buy all the healthcare you wish.
A prison inmate is in the custody of the department of corrections and thus their only choice are the facilities and services the DOC deigns to provide them, usually as advised by their physicians. Therefore the onus should be on the DOC to provide those services.
I've still not heard a good reason why the state should deny a prisoner medical care here.
I agree with you that the surgery should be covered. I think it should be covered on every insurance plan, frankly. That's my problem with this whole thing. But I'm rolling my eyes at "prison treatment is her only option." Yeah, because she killed her wife! She wasn't randomly plucked off the street and thrown in prison.
I'm not missing the point. Medicaid provides comprehensive medical care to people who are not in the position to provide it for themselves. I think prisoners fall into the same category.
As I stated earlier, I DO hope that reassignment surgery becomes more widely recognized as a legitimate medically necessary procedure. And I do hope that coverage includes Medicaid - and by extension, prisoners.
But do I think prisoners deserve top-of-the-line Platinum-level medical coverage? No.
How is this top-of-the-line Platinum-level medical coverage?
I am not making an assessment on the value of the procedure. It is a fact that it is not yet a widely covered procedure. I do hope that changes soon.
I haven't gotten through most of these yet, so I might be repeating, but I think doing this sets a precedent. If it's paid for by the gov't for a convicted murderer, shouldn't it also be covered by medicare and Medicaid? This person murdered someone, and though he might be uncomfortable or depressed, the condition itself isn't life threatening as cancer would be. He (at the time) showed no remorse for killing his wife,so why should he be afforded the luxury of the treatment when there are honest people more deserving?
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"I was thinking about getting off on demand, but it sounds like I should be glad that I didn't"
the "i care about the victims" argument is such a strawman. i can care about the victims and also think that prisoners are entitled to treatments deemed medically necessary by their doctors. i like my country and my constitution too much to want to go back to dungeons and lack of habeas just because people do bad things and those bad things hurt innocents.
ETA: and if she'd killed my sister, mother, bff, neighbor, i'd want any "sexual reassignment surgery" to be performed with a rusty spork on the floor of an old auto repair shop. and that is precisely why emotion for the victims should NOT be part of this assesment.
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"I was thinking about getting off on demand, but it sounds like I should be glad that I didn't"
Okay so basically, when you commit murder, you should lose access to all but the most basic of mental healthy care??
Got it.
And please don't come back and say, no no no that's not what you're saying because yes, yes, yes that's absolutely it. She killed someone and so you don't care about her mental state.
Maybe ol boy in cell block C is claustrophobic, and the cell is giving him anguish. Not my problem. He made that choice
Ol boy in cell block C is given meds and therapy to handle his claustrophobia.
Let's reiterate, all this surgery does is correct the GID. She will still be serving out her damned sentence. The only thing that changes here besides the treatment of her mental state is what she diddles when the lights go out.
That's it.
Please don't front like anyone is lobbying for early release for homegirl.