If you live in a house with a covid + person who is NOT in self-isolation and is interacting with family members, the family members 14-day quarantine (or 7 day post-exposure testing window) does not start until the day 10 of the covid+ person's illness...when they are considered no longer contagious!
Huh? FWIW, we are going through this. Person A was exposed Jan 8. Asymptomatic. Tested on Jan 16. Test comes back positive Jan 19. Persons B-E in household begin exhibiting symptoms by Jan 18. Contact Tracing says to stay home for 10 days since the last person with symptoms started to feel sick.
In your timeline, family member 14 day quarantine wouldn’t start until Jan 26. Maybe your timeline is correct if no symptoms and negative tests?
Are there people who are asymptomatic in the house or has everyone had symptoms and tested positive? I believe the count for each symptomatic/tested positive person would begin at that date (test/symptom) for them and count forward.
If you have a never infected person in the house as well, that poor person is basically on eternal isolation since their count doesn't start until the last isolation day of the last infected household member (unless they can isolate from everyone before that point).
1900 doses of moderna destroyed when a cleaner unplugged the freezer in Boston. Do they not have alarms on these things?!?
:::faints:::
Wow. They do have alarms, at least the health dept where my friend worked. That is just some sickening negligence. I guess they have to keep this vaccine under guard at all times.
I almost wonder if it was done on purpose. Vaccines are so expensive never mind the fact that this one is hard to get right now. I thought most offices had alarms and backups in place. 😬
1900 doses of moderna destroyed when a cleaner unplugged the freezer in Boston. Do they not have alarms on these things?!?
:::faints:::
Wow. They do have alarms, at least the health dept where my friend worked. That is just some sickening negligence. I guess they have to keep this vaccine under guard at all times.
They definitely should. I mean, the technology in the university greenhouses I direct is woefully out of date, but we even have an old-school temperature monitoring system in each greenhouse section (there are about 125) that calls out when the temps fall out of spec. It's pretty inexpensive to purchase new, better systems than what we have.
I’m wondering if in the future, the Covid vaccine will be combined with a regular flu vaccine? Isn’t that what happened with the H1N`? @wandering or other medical people?
That's something I've been wondering, too. A lot of vaccines are combos - TDaP, MMR - already. But then I wonder if fewer people would get it b/c so many people think the flu vaccine doesn't work.
Fauci said something during his press conference yesterday that I think needs to be messaged very loudly and clearly, both for COVID and influenza. That as the number of vaccinated/immune people increases, the virus will be circulating less, and will then be mutating less, which protects the efficacy of the vaccine. This is something that is a "no duh" to someone like me (PhD in plant breeding and genetics), but likely isn't something that occurs to the general population. I really wonder how much more effective the flu vaccine would be if 80+% of people would get vaccinated. My guess is that it could be modeled, but I've not taken the time to look for studies.
Wow. They do have alarms, at least the health dept where my friend worked. That is just some sickening negligence. I guess they have to keep this vaccine under guard at all times.
They definitely should. I mean, the technology in the university greenhouses I direct is woefully out of date, but we even have an old-school temperature monitoring system in each greenhouse section (there are about 125) that calls out when the temps fall out of spec. It's pretty inexpensive to purchase new, better systems than what we have.
@
I bought a $15 alarm for my garage freezer when I lost an insane amount of breastmilk 10 years ago. So, if they DON'T have alarms, they're pretty dumb. That's like the easiest way to prevent disaster (but also probably the easiest thing to sabotage...).
Post by mrsukyankee on Jan 22, 2021 8:30:46 GMT -5
link Around 1 in 35 people in London had Covid last week, ONS estimates
The latest ONS statistics are in. Here are some of the key findings:
During the week ending 16 January 2021, London had the highest percentage of people testing positive, with an estimated 2.89% of people in the capital having had Covid-19, equating to around 1 in 35 people.
In England, the percentage of people testing positive for Covid-19 remained high but decreased slightly in the week ending 16 January 2021. The ONS estimates that 1,023,700 people within the community population in England had the virus, equating to around 1 in 55 people.
In Wales, the percentage of people testing positive levelled off over the week ending 16 January 2021. The ONS estimates that 44,000 people in Wales had the coronavirus, equating to around 1 in 70 people.
In Northern Ireland, the percentage of people testing positive increased in the week ending 16 January 2021, while in Scotland the percentage of people testing positive levelled off.
I’m wondering if in the future, the Covid vaccine will be combined with a regular flu vaccine? Isn’t that what happened with the H1N`? wanderingback. or other medical people?
Yes H1N1 was just a different variant of the influenza type A that year that caused more people to get sick. It was realized too late after the regular flu vaccine was already developed so that’s why it was a separate injection that year. Going forward though every year they determine which forms of influenza might he most prevalent and make the vaccine and that can easily included H1N1.
No clue what will happen with the covid vaccine. There are still dozens of trials for other vaccines being studied and tested. And of course we still don’t know how long immunity from the vaccine will last. Maybe covid19 will just be like a regular cold like other coronaviruses once we have worldwide herd immunity, who knows what the future holds 10 years from now!
So not only is my 76yo dad expected to navigate a website to sign up for his vaccine appointment, but he lives in RURAL RURAL RURAL NH with shitty satellite internet, so after he input all his info, the internet froze on him.
I called him and got him all signed up to get an email to make an appointment (WTF - I told him to forward the email to me).
So not only is my 76yo dad expected to navigate a website to sign up for his vaccine appointment, but he lives in RURAL RURAL RURAL NH with shitty satellite internet, so after he input all his info, the internet froze on him.
I called him and got him all signed up to get an email to make an appointment (WTF - I told him to forward the email to me).
What a shitshow.
I’m going through this with my dad in MO right now. In his 80s, living by himself in an extremely rural area. Tried to schedule through his doctor, hospital system, VFW, etc. through the phone - can’t do it because no one knows when doses will be available. He doesn’t have internet, so I keep checking the county/state online and it’s just a map of CVS locations and a smattering of vaccine administrators not in his area with no way to sign up.
I don't mean to be overly simplifying, but for age-only qualifiers why can't it be like "come to X location on Wednesday through Friday last name A-G with proof of residency and age to receive your vaccination." Then publicize in newspapers, radio, billboards, etc.
Why appointments? Why on the internet? I get that there is better verification and control of flow that way, but this isn't a targeted process. The idea is blanket the country with vaccines. So the "cost" of someone showing up at the wrong day is less.
Post by Patsy Baloney on Jan 22, 2021 9:14:49 GMT -5
cville that would be so much easier for people like my dad. Most people his age seem to be in some kind of assisted living and would likely get their vaccination there. He’s not, and super rural with no internet access, so he’s at the mercy of the luck of a well-timed phone call.
Seriously, if they put on the 6 o’clock news or an ad in the paper “be here at x time with x identification,” he’d be there with bells on.
So not only is my 76yo dad expected to navigate a website to sign up for his vaccine appointment, but he lives in RURAL RURAL RURAL NH with shitty satellite internet, so after he input all his info, the internet froze on him.
I called him and got him all signed up to get an email to make an appointment (WTF - I told him to forward the email to me).
What a shitshow.
I am also struggling with this for my dad. He is 84 and lives in Phoenix so not even a rural area. But he still has to drive (which is really hard for him right now) and wait in a very long line in his car. He is worried he won't be able to make the drive and is worried that he is not going to be able to wait the length without using the bathroom. We should 100% have home visits for vaccination of the elderly IMO OR at least be giving it to his dr (close to his house and he feels like he can drive there).
My parents and grandma are in FL and got their first dose by showing up to somewhere that was doing vaccines without an appointment. The appointments I had scheduled for them in March had been automatically cancelled due to lack of vaccine. My mom made other attempts to get appointments and they all went terribly--the online systems were getting jammed due to high levels of traffic. If it had been up to my dad or my grandma they wouldn't have even gotten as far as she had.
Post by Velar Fricative on Jan 22, 2021 9:18:53 GMT -5
I assumed the appointments were to ensure there would be enough supply so you don't have a bunch of vulnerable people waiting on a line only to be turned away. BUT, even here the lines are still ridiculous even with appointments and they've run out early, so ultimately I guess it doesn't matter.
Or also having information in the computer is helpful for record-keeping? I know when I was getting mine, I had to fill out the online form while I was there and it had a bunch of questions that I assumed were for gathering statistics (profession, race, languages spoken, etc.). You could have staff do that for people when they get there, but that slows down the process.
So not only is my 76yo dad expected to navigate a website to sign up for his vaccine appointment, but he lives in RURAL RURAL RURAL NH with shitty satellite internet, so after he input all his info, the internet froze on him.
I called him and got him all signed up to get an email to make an appointment (WTF - I told him to forward the email to me).
What a shitshow.
I feel for you - I'm so sorry, this is so tough. I'm so thankful my parents got notified of their turn for the vaccine in other ways (my mom through her PT job and my dad thru his cancer doc? maybe? he was unclear). Neither of them had to navigate a crappy online system. Which is good news for me b/c I live 6 hours/3 states away and they would have been calling me in a panic to help them over the phone. I understand why doing this online makes sense in theory, but in practice, it just makes it harder for those who are in the groups who are currently able to get it.
So not only is my 76yo dad expected to navigate a website to sign up for his vaccine appointment, but he lives in RURAL RURAL RURAL NH with shitty satellite internet, so after he input all his info, the internet froze on him.
I called him and got him all signed up to get an email to make an appointment (WTF - I told him to forward the email to me).
What a shitshow.
I am also struggling with this for my dad. He is 84 and lives in Phoenix so not even a rural area. But he still has to drive (which is really hard for him right now) and wait in a very long line in his car. He is worried he won't be able to make the drive and is worried that he is not going to be able to wait the length without using the bathroom. We should 100% have home visits for vaccination of the elderly IMO OR at least be giving it to his dr (close to his house and he feels like he can drive there).
There needs to be more of an effort to get vaccines out to those who don't drive. I would guess at least 30% of those in my parents' retirement community don't drive and people are not necessarily willing to carpool right now.
There also needs to be a big push to vaccinate people who don't have reliable methods of transportation. There are a ton of essential workers and their families who struggle to get to regularly scheduled doctor's appointments because they have to rely on public transit, catching a ride, or borrowing a car. It would be great if they could set up vaccine centers at transit hubs.
We have had to fight to get out industry in 1B like down to individual health departments. For example, we now have a list of 5 county health department where we are included. I assume it will grow but- le sigh.
Everyone says there aren’t enough vaccines but then they say they have leftovers that they have to throw out? So which one is it? And why don’t they have a list of people to call before they throw it out or a facility to go to?
How are people in 1B getting appointments? We aren’t in 1B until Monday and I registered with the county that includes my industry in 1B. I live right next door and they said they will do that. But still no news from anyone in the state about making appointments.
I don't mean to be overly simplifying, but for age-only qualifiers why can't it be like "come to X location on Wednesday through Friday last name A-G with proof of residency and age to receive your vaccination." Then publicize in newspapers, radio, billboards, etc.
Why appointments? Why on the internet? I get that there is better verification and control of flow that way, but this isn't a targeted process. The idea is blanket the country with vaccines. So the "cost" of someone showing up at the wrong day is less.
I agree with this. To make sure they have enough on hand they could do what they do with jury duty and have you call the night before to verify if your "number has been called". Whatever they're doing now is a cluster.
ETA: And they could do a standby at the end of the day of a few younger folks if they have any extras they need to use.
My city reopened indoor and outdoor dining as of today. I have zero interest in indoor dining but I am excited to freeze my ass off at our local brewery tonight. They had been handling things really well with distancing, cleaning, and mask enforcement.
The thing that makes little sense to me is the city has mandated a one hour time limit on visits to these places. This seems so counterintuitive! It will encourage bar hoping, increase the need (and potential breakdown) of cleaning between guests, and cause staff to come into contact with more people.
I don't mean to be overly simplifying, but for age-only qualifiers why can't it be like "come to X location on Wednesday through Friday last name A-G with proof of residency and age to receive your vaccination." Then publicize in newspapers, radio, billboards, etc.
Why appointments? Why on the internet? I get that there is better verification and control of flow that way, but this isn't a targeted process. The idea is blanket the country with vaccines. So the "cost" of someone showing up at the wrong day is less.
For my hospital, we were able to release around 6,800 appts to 80,000 age qualified patients this week. The online system prevents all those vulnerable bodies from showing up at the same place and the same time hoping for a turn. Even with online scheduling, people were anxious and showed up very early. If we know we have tremendous mismatch between supply and demand, I like the idea of stricter age requirements rather than randomly selecting a lower risk (younger) person based on alphabetical order. There are certainly equity concerns. I like the idea of mass vaccination stations (that allow for distancing) and mobile vaccine clinics deployed to specific areas; I’m excited to see more up and running over the coming weeks and months.
I still can’t get my FL grandparents a damn appointment anywhere. They’re in their 80s and 90s with cancer (grandma) and a pacemaker (grandpa). New appts opened at 3am my time and I sat on the Publix website for their home (Citrus) and surrounding counties, refreshing once a minute, from 3-5am hoping to get through. Nada. I’m really grateful they don’t have to go stand in a line somewhere each week, only to be turned away. They can’t physically do that.
I don't mean to be overly simplifying, but for age-only qualifiers why can't it be like "come to X location on Wednesday through Friday last name A-G with proof of residency and age to receive your vaccination." Then publicize in newspapers, radio, billboards, etc.
Why appointments? Why on the internet? I get that there is better verification and control of flow that way, but this isn't a targeted process. The idea is blanket the country with vaccines. So the "cost" of someone showing up at the wrong day is less.
I can only speak for my area but appointments for now because we have so few doses available for people that are eligible that standing in line for hours, especially for the elderly, wouldn’t be a good idea.
I’m pretty sure people would end up just needing to come day after day after day for many weeks. Now once there is wide spread availability, at least in my area, yes they’re planning to do it more like that with pop up places, walk-in places, going more in to the community, etc much more readily available.
They’ve tried to help here with appointments by having a call center as well, but yes overall it is a difficult system to navigate. Hopefully once more vaccines are available it’ll be much better.
I don't mean to be overly simplifying, but for age-only qualifiers why can't it be like "come to X location on Wednesday through Friday last name A-G with proof of residency and age to receive your vaccination." Then publicize in newspapers, radio, billboards, etc.
Why appointments? Why on the internet? I get that there is better verification and control of flow that way, but this isn't a targeted process. The idea is blanket the country with vaccines. So the "cost" of someone showing up at the wrong day is less.
Yeah, this is all so tough. I understand there are problems with supply right now that must prevent this from being feasible in all places, but the technology-based approach is also super limiting and failing to reach so many people, I'd imagine.
Anecdote, but I'm in a major metropolitan area and in order for my husband's 94-year old grandmother to get the vaccine, she needed to sign up online for the opportunity to make an appointment (there was a phone-based system, but it crashed) and provide an email address and phone number where she could receive text messages. Then, she was contacted via email to actually make an appointment for the vaccine online, and when she showed up at her appointment, she had to check in via text and then wait for a reply text to go into the building. She's a super smart lady, but not technologically savvy. Fortunately we're local so my husband was able to do all of this for her. When he took her to the appointment (at a county government vaccination site), he said the vast majority of the elderly folks there were accompanied by a younger person (relative, he assumed) apparently helping them with the technology aspect, which for obvious reasons isn't going to be possible for a lot of people. We're thrilled she was able to get vaccinated, but it shouldn't be this hard, and I really worry about the people who don't have the help to do this.
I agree with you in theory but I wonder how it would actually go. I am imagining that without appointments, people would get in lines hours early to be there before the daily allotment runs out. It seems like the waiting lines could actually turn into super spreader events for older people.
i know the internet is a problem, but just showing up is also a problem. I’m not sure why there can’t just be a phone bank to call and make an appointment.
I’m not trying to be flippant, but we JUST finished an election season where pollsters were able to gather every bit of data on our voting habits and then call the desirable group to ask for donations on a daily basis. I can’t believe a similar system can’t be set up to robo call people of a certain demographic. When they answer the phone, it switches to a human coordinator who helps set up an appointment. The technology exists in other applications, why can’t we convert it for this use?
‘eta: nevermind, I’ve continued to think this one through. I realized this idea favors people who would be on “the list” because they are in a better position in life, for lack of a better phrase. The marginalized people who are most at risk would be least likely to receive a robo call. Answered my own question.
I agree with you in theory but I wonder how it would actually go. I am imagining that without appointments, people would get in lines hours early to be there before the daily allotment runs out. It seems like the waiting lines could actually turn into super spreader events for older people.
i know the internet is a problem, but just showing up is also a problem. I’m not sure why there can’t just be a phone bank to call and make an appointment.
I’m not trying to be flippant, but we JUST finished an election season where pollsters were able to gather every bit of data on our voting habits and then call the desirable group to ask for donations on a daily basis. I can’t believe a similar system can’t be set up to robo call people of a certain demographic. When they answer the phone, it switches to a human coordinator who helps set up an appointment. The technology exists in other applications, why can’t we convert it for this use?
‘eta: nevermind, I’ve continued to think this one through. I realized this idea favors people who would be on “the list” because they are in a better position in life, for lack of a better phrase. The marginalized people who are most at risk would be least likely to receive a robo call. Answered my own question.
Do you know how your country is going to do vaccinations? I saw that they’re waiting to approve AZ and hope to start vaccinating next month. Do you think it’ll be a smooth roll out?
I don't mean to be overly simplifying, but for age-only qualifiers why can't it be like "come to X location on Wednesday through Friday last name A-G with proof of residency and age to receive your vaccination." Then publicize in newspapers, radio, billboards, etc.
Why appointments? Why on the internet? I get that there is better verification and control of flow that way, but this isn't a targeted process. The idea is blanket the country with vaccines. So the "cost" of someone showing up at the wrong day is less.
I can only speak for my area but appointments for now because we have so few doses available for people that are eligible that standing in line for hours, especially for the elderly, wouldn’t be a good idea.
I’m pretty sure people would end up just needing to come day after day after day for many weeks. Now once there is wide spread availability, at least in my area, yes they’re planning to do it more like that with pop up places, walk-in places, going more in to the community, etc much more readily available.
They’ve tried to help here with appointments by having a call center as well, but yes overall it is a difficult system to navigate. Hopefully once more vaccines are available it’ll be much better.
Ah, that makes sense. So we need a crapton more vaccine and then we can do everything more easily.
IF ONLY 45 HAD A GODDAMNED PLAN AND NOT PASSED ON BUYING LOTS MORE VACCINE MONTHS AGO.
So not only is my 76yo dad expected to navigate a website to sign up for his vaccine appointment, but he lives in RURAL RURAL RURAL NH with shitty satellite internet, so after he input all his info, the internet froze on him.
I called him and got him all signed up to get an email to make an appointment (WTF - I told him to forward the email to me).
What a shitshow.
My parents are in rural NH too. Their internet often goes down and my mom is not always the best at navigating these things. They were not even aware that they could register. I have been keeping track of this for them and sending them updates. There is no way seniors in NH are going to be adequately vaccinated.
I can only speak for my area but appointments for now because we have so few doses available for people that are eligible that standing in line for hours, especially for the elderly, wouldn’t be a good idea.
I’m pretty sure people would end up just needing to come day after day after day for many weeks. Now once there is wide spread availability, at least in my area, yes they’re planning to do it more like that with pop up places, walk-in places, going more in to the community, etc much more readily available.
They’ve tried to help here with appointments by having a call center as well, but yes overall it is a difficult system to navigate. Hopefully once more vaccines are available it’ll be much better.
Ah, that makes sense. So we need a crapton more vaccine and then we can do everything more easily.
IF ONLY 45 HAD A GODDAMNED PLAN AND NOT PASSED ON BUYING LOTS MORE VACCINE MONTHS AGO.
Yep exactly. Right now we’re already seeing so much inequity based on lack of vaccines and ability to do outreach. It seems as though in most states that are tracking data significantly more white people are getting vaccinated, and I’m going to assume more affluent and wealthy people are getting vaccinated as well.
I think since the goal right now is to get as many people vaccinated as possible, unfortunately that has created inequities and being able to do things like going door to door because we only have a fraction of what we need.
On an individual level I don’t blame people on this board and elsewhere for getting vaccinated now even if they’re not the most "vulnerable" but it’s definitely something to continue to think about and recognize in your communities and help work towards solutions. Not getting vaccinated isn’t the solution, but looking at the systems in place.
I have found a new "calling" with helping my parents' elderly neighbors and friends secure appointments (FL).
@@@ Wednesday, I had one of my students helping me count down the seconds while I had several windows open to try to snag an appointment for my dad's 90 year old friend. When I got through and secured a spot, the whole class cheered, the kids Zooming in were like, "Did you get it?!" and they were telling their other classes about how they helped an older man get the vaccine. It shouldn't be this way, of course, but I have to try to find the bright spots.
We have had to fight to get out industry in 1B like down to individual health departments. For example, we now have a list of 5 county health department where we are included. I assume it will grow but- le sigh.
Everyone says there aren’t enough vaccines but then they say they have leftovers that they have to throw out? So which one is it? And why don’t they have a list of people to call before they throw it out or a facility to go to?
How are people in 1B getting appointments? We aren’t in 1B until Monday and I registered with the county that includes my industry in 1B. I live right next door and they said they will do that. But still no news from anyone in the state about making appointments.
So in my area, it’s definitely there’s not enough vaccines. However, as far as wasting extra doses that’s where being perfect is somewhat getting in the way of doing good.
Of course you can’t number perfectly the exact amount of vials you’ll need in one day. So where I am at the end of the day they have been trying to offer to people who are in the eligible groups. Instead of just making it a free for all for whomever is available, which will most likely be someone who is less vulnerable. Not saying I agree with that, but that’s the thinking where I am for now to try to help address inequities.
I’m hoping that once things getting moving along it’ll get better.
At my job we have a bunch of birth control pills that are expiring in a few months that I’m sure we’ll likely end up having to throw away, which is killing me! I can only imagine what it must be like to plan for millions of vaccine doses and try to get the logistics correct and have kinks in the beginning unfortunately, especially when it comes to predicting human behavior (who will show up, who will show up on time, etc).