@@ August Covid

[fortnightlily]

So anyone want to make any predictions for their district for the Fall? I'm hoping we continue to trend toward a more 'normal' year. I think my DS finally won't have to haul a Chromebook back and forth daily 'just in case' of a closure. I kind of expect any semblance of accurate case reporting to fall by the wayside, curious if they'll continue to automatically test symptomatic kids. The agreement with the teachers' union for extra pay for specific Covid-quarantine/sick days expired and was not renewed, so will be curious to see the fallout from that.

Overall I'm choosing to be optimistic. I think the general case numbers are becoming less relevant, as long as hospitalizations and deaths don't spike. And I'm hopeful about the reformulated booster.

I really hope teachers have an easier time of things this year, too, that some of the behavioral challenges will subside, etc.

[ssmjlm]

COVID aside and maybe this is flameful, but a lot of parents these days are just so entitled and really don't pay attention to school stuff in general. They can't follow directions and either don't read and comprehend or don't read at all.

Just as a PTA officer the amount of times we've had to reiterate to parents rules and regs made me wonder how anyone is still in the teaching profession.

Maybe COVID made that more apparent from a science stand-point, but I think parents have just become enemies of public education instead of allies.

I still remember last year the school board had voted at least 6 months prior to move up the school year by a week (and it was discussed the year before, but COVID pushed that). I was in the office doing PTA stuff and a mom was yelling at the secretary because she had no idea school started in a week and where was that published and she had a Disney vacation planned for then so what did she need to do to have her kid not miss work. After she left, the secretary told me she wasn't the first parent to note the school calendar change that was published 6 months ago.

[erbear]

I just read a Q and A with Dr. Wen, who I have been following closely this whole time (she has young kids). She basically said, for her family, she’s comfortable letting them return to pre- pandemic life, even during a surge. She isn’t asking them to mask at school and is allowing sports, play dates, etc as usual.

I’m not sure what my school is doing. We have been following cdc guidelines the whole pandemic so I assume that’s what we’ll do. I think masking with be optional, and it doesn’t seem like we’re taking the precautions we’ve seen the last two years (for example, the cafeteria seems like it will be open - we will encourage but not require kids to eat outside. That’s new).

[erbear]

Aug 2, 2022 8:46:47 GMT -5 ssmjlm said:

COVID aside and maybe this is flameful, but a lot of parents these days are just so entitled and really don't pay attention to school stuff in general. They can't follow directions and either don't read and comprehend or don't read at all.

Just as a PTA officer the amount of times we've had to reiterate to parents rules and regs made me wonder how anyone is still in the teaching profession.

Maybe COVID made that more apparent from a science stand-point, but I think parents have just become enemies of public education instead of allies.

I still remember last year the school board had voted at least 6 months prior to move up the school year by a week (and it was discussed the year before, but COVID pushed that). I was in the office doing PTA stuff and a mom was yelling at the secretary because she had no idea school started in a week and where was that published and she had a Disney vacation planned for then so what did she need to do to have her kid not miss work. After she left, the secretary told me she wasn't the first parent to note the school calendar change that was published 6 months ago.

My school has actually started addressing this. We just got a letter (I think as parents — I get everything since I’m both a parent and a teacher at the same school) that said basically that for the last two years, we have (appropriately) bent over backwards for families. We’ve made a ton of individual decisions and accommodations that parents have asked for and it was the right decision at the time. And now we’re in a place where we really are looking for get back to the idea of care for community and the common good, and that’s going to be an adjustment for some kids and families so have that conversation now. I appreciated it.

It’s not flameful, it’s true. Covid has revealed just how selfish many people are — they want what’s right for THEM, everyone else be damned. It’s been eye opening to hear just how many parents think I work for them…I’ve always known there was a subset of parents who think this but I’ve been surprised by the sheer number of absolutely ridiculous things that have been expected of me from parents these last two years.

[Velar Fricative]

One thing I'd like to see change in NYC public schools is allowing under-5s to do test-to-stay as was allowed for all kids 5 and older instead of quarantining them for at least 10 days. I will never get over having to solo parent during the day in June after I tested positive and was sick as a dog for a few of those days because my kid was 10 days shy of turning 5 while my older kid and husband were able to go to work and school. The DOE didn't even require DD1 and DH to test each morning, they just did because duh (I can't even remember if they were required to mask up at that point, but they did). Also at that point, the under-5s still had to wear masks in school - that mandate was lifted on June 13th, the day she was able to return from quarantine lolsob, and the day before she got her first dose. Even if they don't change that rule, it will thankfully no longer apply to DD2 but it's still a crappy situation for everyone else!

I do hope they continue to send shitloads of free tests home. I felt like I had an entire warehouse full of tests when I tested positive and then you realize just how fast it goes when you have to test four people daily for about two weeks or so. Free tests are still available at community centers, libraries, and other places though. But it's helpful to get them from schools too.

[cherryvalance]

The road from parents who just wanted schools reopened to "schools are indoctrination camps" is super evident where I live.

Granted, I'm in a very red part of blue Jersey, but I think most people around here are generally apolitical/don't vote regularly types. There was a ton of uproar over out state's mitigation plans at every step and parents organized "fresh faces" groups. Some of the louder ones would do FB lives that gradually turned into, "There's porn in the schools" (this is before our new sex ed curriculum came out), transphobia, etc. So all these people who joined because they were anti-mask were suddenly becoming radicalized.

One thing about conservatives, they are good at messaging and fear mongering.

[InBetweenDays]

Aug 2, 2022 8:17:36 GMT -5 macmars45 said:

Aug 1, 2022 9:24:58 GMT -5 Patsy Baloney said:

I’m getting tired of the narrative that kids have been locked out of schools for years and years. It is happening here, too.

Nope. We lost April and May of 2020.

August of 2020, kids were back in schools on a modified schedule, almost back to normal in winter/spring 2021, fully normal 2021/2022.

Shut the fuck up and home school, Janet, I’m tired of your shit.

This varies state to state and city to city. In my city they went back to school on a modified schedule in Oct 2020 and back to regular schedule by January 2021. In western WA they did virtual school until March/April (ish) 2021 or longer.

April 19, 2021. And even then it was only 2 afternoons a week in person. And it was no where near normal even this past school year. I agree with devonpow that most of this was due to bad decisions based on good intentions. But honestly it seemed at times the district would just throw their hands up and say "sorry, COVID" rather than trying to make creative adjustments.

I think it's dangerous to not address/acknowledge people's legitimate concerns with how school was handled in many parts of the country and how that has affected our kids and families. (Not saying people here are doing that).

[eddy]

If I were to predict what my school district will do- it will be normal operation besides the 5 day quarantine with positive test. I think everything else will be completely normal. Obviously masks welcomed but not mandatory. That is where we landed by the end of last year.

I think a lawsuit was resolved that now doesn't allow school districts to mandate masks in our state. It was back and forth all last year. Even without the lawsuit I think our district is so exhausted that they would give up on the mandating part. I am perfectly fine with them not taking on this huge thankless role anymore. They were very valiant in their effort especially in a red state.

[hermione]

Aug 2, 2022 8:49:15 GMT -5 erbear said:

I just read a Q and A with Dr. Wen, who I have been following closely this whole time (she has young kids). She basically said, for her family, she’s comfortable letting them return to pre- pandemic life, even during a surge. She isn’t asking them to mask at school and is allowing sports, play dates, etc as usual.

I think I read the same article. It was relieving to have a doctor say out loud that she is making the same choices for her family that I am making for mine. 

[abs]

There is no mention of Covid at all on our district’s website.

Last year it was basically the honor system. If you reported it you had to stay home 10 days and then it switched to 5 from first day of symptoms after the CDC change.

I am fine with it being treated as a normal illness at this point. I accept all flames. I don’t want to rehash what schools did/didn’t do in 2020 and 2021. That doesn’t go well and there is no point. How we went from I don’t know about the Covid vaccine to all vaccines are bad I don’t know. That leap happened for sure and is one of the scariest fall out pieces for me.

[pixy0stix]

Y'all can do whatever you want now that my kid is vaccinated. It was when everyone decided that covid didn't matter anymore with their older kids that could trickle down to mine that I gave a shit. The best we're ever going to do is protection with vaccines. I'm going to reserve my judgement for those people that are continually letting their kids be exposed without vaccine protection.

[Velar Fricative]

Aug 2, 2022 8:55:33 GMT -5 cherryvalance said:

The road from parents who just wanted schools reopened to "schools are indoctrination camps" is super evident where I live.

Granted, I'm in a very red part of blue Jersey, but I think most people around here are generally apolitical/don't vote regularly types. There was a ton of uproar over out state's mitigation plans at every step and parents organized "fresh faces" groups. Some of the louder ones would do FB lives that gradually turned into, "There's porn in the schools" (this is before our new sex ed curriculum came out), transphobia, etc. So all these people who joined because they were anti-mask were suddenly becoming radicalized.

One thing about conservatives, they are good at messaging and fear mongering.

And really good at finding the next moral panic quickly. Once covid was deemed "over," they knew they had to move onto something else super scary, like...talking about race in schools. Or sex education. Or the fact that LGBTQ+ kids exist. They know how to rile people up, including (clearly) people who might not otherwise have been inclined to vote for Rs. 

[cherryvalance]

Aug 2, 2022 10:01:26 GMT -5 Velar Fricative said:

Aug 2, 2022 8:55:33 GMT -5 cherryvalance said:

The road from parents who just wanted schools reopened to "schools are indoctrination camps" is super evident where I live.

Granted, I'm in a very red part of blue Jersey, but I think most people around here are generally apolitical/don't vote regularly types. There was a ton of uproar over out state's mitigation plans at every step and parents organized "fresh faces" groups. Some of the louder ones would do FB lives that gradually turned into, "There's porn in the schools" (this is before our new sex ed curriculum came out), transphobia, etc. So all these people who joined because they were anti-mask were suddenly becoming radicalized.

One thing about conservatives, they are good at messaging and fear mongering.

And really good at finding the next moral panic quickly. Once covid was deemed "over," they knew they had to move onto something else super scary, like...talking about race in schools. Or sex education. Or the fact that LGBTQ+ kids exist. They know how to rile people up, including (clearly) people who might not otherwise have been inclined to vote for Rs. 

YES.

I follow the local group just to stay abreast of their bullshit, and they are SO organized. They post upcoming BOE meetings and people are immediately signing up to speak. Meanwhile, in my progressive group there's all this hand-wringing and "I *would* go, but little Timmy wants to watch Frozen for the 1847562th time, so I can't."

[osulori]

Aug 2, 2022 8:46:47 GMT -5 ssmjlm said:

I still remember last year the school board had voted at least 6 months prior to move up the school year by a week (and it was discussed the year before, but COVID pushed that). I was in the office doing PTA stuff and a mom was yelling at the secretary because she had no idea school started in a week and where was that published and she had a Disney vacation planned for then so what did she need to do to have her kid not miss work. After she left, the secretary told me she wasn't the first parent to note the school calendar change that was published 6 months ago.

Our district has had to adjust start/dismissal times by ~10 minutes all all levels (elementary, middle, high school) starting this year so they are in compliance with a state law that limits the amount of time students are at school before the first bell.  This likely change was first announced last fall and the exact plan for new start/end times for each school was finalized in maybe February.  Since then it's been communicated in various forms of media more times than I can count so that parents can plan accordingly but yeah I can guarantee there are going to be similar situations to what you described with parents flipping out on school staff because "OMG NO ONE TOLD ME!!11!!1!" 

[Patsy Baloney]

Aug 2, 2022 11:15:05 GMT -5 cherryvalance said:

Aug 2, 2022 10:01:26 GMT -5 Velar Fricative said:

And really good at finding the next moral panic quickly. Once covid was deemed "over," they knew they had to move onto something else super scary, like...talking about race in schools. Or sex education. Or the fact that LGBTQ+ kids exist. They know how to rile people up, including (clearly) people who might not otherwise have been inclined to vote for Rs. 

YES.

I follow the local group just to stay abreast of their bullshit, and they are SO organized. They post upcoming BOE meetings and people are immediately signing up to speak. Meanwhile, in my progressive group there's all this hand-wringing and "I *would* go, but little Timmy wants to watch Frozen for the 1847562th time, so I can't."

Yep. I think people feel like, “Oh, someone else will speak for me.” And then no one shows. Or, “I can’t, I’m just too nervous!” becomes a prevalent theme. I went early and often for quite some time to BOE meetings during and prior to covid (someone had to fight the dress code BS) and feel like I’m just labeled a bully or bitch by these same folks because I turn out. I also pay attention to when high school students organize and send kids to the podium and show up for them. But crickets from the local progressive groups.

Meanwhile, Grandma Bannon has been showing up every meeting for the past 10 years to tell us all why her grandkids are going to die of tuberculosis from masks and have been indoctrinated by the left.

I’ve tried to join local progressive groups and it’s always the same thing. Whine and complain but don’t actually do anything. I’d love an ounce of whatever civic duty drink the “satanic panic” right has.

[Susie]

I haven't seen or heard much from the district on it, but I'm expecting things to be pretty "normal" and I welcome it.  Now that my WHOLE HOUSEHOLD is finally able to be vaxxed, I've reached the point where I'm ready to open back up.  There's no milestone left for me to wait for.  The losses and missed opportunities for kids are real, so it's time for me to embrace them.

DD does summer camp and school year after-care with a group that works closely with the schools and operates within the schools.  This summer experience is 100% different than last year's.  This year they are field tripping every Friday to the town pool, every other Wed. to the nature preserve, mixing cohorts, all kinds of fun stuff.  They didn't do ANY of that last summer.  Rightfully so, as none of the kids could be vaxxed last summer, but it wasn't a fun experience.  Maybe fortunately? last summer was our first with a school age kid, so we didn't fully feel how much it was dialed back.  I don't think the genie goes back in the bottle very easily.  I am really hopeful that this is an early preview of the direction schools are going in.  

[Bad Dingo]

Connecticut just released their guidance: portal.ct.gov/-/media/Departments-and-Agencies/DPH/Communications/misc-documents/Fall-2022-Operational-Strategies-K12_08012022_FINAL.pdf

TEST-MASK-GO


Test-Mask-Go is an optional strategy designed to increase the number of days of in-person learning and care available to children. Schools, child care programs and camp operators choosing this strategy can give children and staff with mild respiratory disease symptoms -- infrequent cough, congestion, runny nose, sore throat, etc.-- the option to continue participating in-person provided:



they are fever-free (< 100°F) and feel well enough to participate

they do not live with anyone who has had COVID-19 in the past 2 weeks

they can wear a mask consistently and correctly (if facility operators require them to do so) and

they test negative for COVID-19 prior to reporting in-person on every day they have symptoms, as well as one final test on the morning their symptoms have completely resolved.


Individuals who have any respiratory disease symptoms should not use the Test-Mask-Go strategy if:



they have a fever (≥ 100°F) or feel feverish (they should not report in-person until their fever has resolved for at least 24 hours without the use of medication)

they live with a person who recently tested positive for COVID-19 (within the past 2 weeks)

Instead, these individuals should stay home until their symptoms resolve and test for COVID-19.

Anyone testing positive for COVID-19 should complete isolation according to the CDC Q/I Calculator.

[erbear]

Aug 2, 2022 13:24:07 GMT -5 Bad Dingo said:

Connecticut just released their guidance: portal.ct.gov/-/media/Departments-and-Agencies/DPH/Communications/misc-documents/Fall-2022-Operational-Strategies-K12_08012022_FINAL.pdf

TEST-MASK-GO


Test-Mask-Go is an optional strategy designed to increase the number of days of in-person learning and care available to children. Schools, child care programs and camp operators choosing this strategy can give children and staff with mild respiratory disease symptoms -- infrequent cough, congestion, runny nose, sore throat, etc.-- the option to continue participating in-person provided:



they are fever-free (< 100°F) and feel well enough to participate

they do not live with anyone who has had COVID-19 in the past 2 weeks

they can wear a mask consistently and correctly (if facility operators require them to do so) and

they test negative for COVID-19 prior to reporting in-person on every day they have symptoms, as well as one final test on the morning their symptoms have completely resolved.


Individuals who have any respiratory disease symptoms should not use the Test-Mask-Go strategy if:



they have a fever (≥ 100°F) or feel feverish (they should not report in-person until their fever has resolved for at least 24 hours without the use of medication)

they live with a person who recently tested positive for COVID-19 (within the past 2 weeks)

Instead, these individuals should stay home until their symptoms resolve and test for COVID-19.

Anyone testing positive for COVID-19 should complete isolation according to the CDC Q/I Calculator.

the “haven’t lived with anyone with Covid for two weeks” is way outside cdc guidelines (which actually don’t recommend quarantine if you’re vaccinated; my school does a 5 day out of school if a household member is positive — this has been our one break from the cdc). If that’s a rule, lots of kids will never be in school and it’s unnecessary.

[fortnightlily]

I also think if they plan to implement test-to-stay they should expect to make it really easy for families to freely or cheaply get hold of an adequate number of tests to get them through 5-10 days of symptoms.

I honestly wonder, too, if at some point the CDC is going to revise down their guidelines to say positive people (in and outside of a school context) don't have to isolate as long as they don't have a fever/feel well enough to attend and just need to wear a mask for 10 days or until a negative test.

[karinothing]

Aug 2, 2022 14:18:18 GMT -5 fortnightlily said:

I also think if they plan to implement test-to-stay they should expect to make it really easy for families to freely or cheaply get hold of an adequate number of tests to get them through 5-10 days of symptoms.

I honestly wonder, too, if at some point the CDC is going to revise down their guidelines to say positive people (in and outside of a school context) don't have to isolate as long as they don't have a fever/feel well enough to attend and just need to wear a mask for 10 days or until a negative test.

My friend is a pediatrician and she assumes they will eventually move to "24 hours fever free" like other viruses. She thinks we need to do that now, but hasn't seen messaging from the CDC that we are moving that way.

[curbsideprophet]

Aug 2, 2022 14:03:16 GMT -5 erbear said:

Aug 2, 2022 13:24:07 GMT -5 Bad Dingo said:

Connecticut just released their guidance: portal.ct.gov/-/media/Departments-and-Agencies/DPH/Communications/misc-documents/Fall-2022-Operational-Strategies-K12_08012022_FINAL.pdf

TEST-MASK-GO


Test-Mask-Go is an optional strategy designed to increase the number of days of in-person learning and care available to children. Schools, child care programs and camp operators choosing this strategy can give children and staff with mild respiratory disease symptoms -- infrequent cough, congestion, runny nose, sore throat, etc.-- the option to continue participating in-person provided:



they are fever-free (< 100°F) and feel well enough to participate

they do not live with anyone who has had COVID-19 in the past 2 weeks

they can wear a mask consistently and correctly (if facility operators require them to do so) and

they test negative for COVID-19 prior to reporting in-person on every day they have symptoms, as well as one final test on the morning their symptoms have completely resolved.


Individuals who have any respiratory disease symptoms should not use the Test-Mask-Go strategy if:



they have a fever (≥ 100°F) or feel feverish (they should not report in-person until their fever has resolved for at least 24 hours without the use of medication)

they live with a person who recently tested positive for COVID-19 (within the past 2 weeks)

Instead, these individuals should stay home until their symptoms resolve and test for COVID-19.

Anyone testing positive for COVID-19 should complete isolation according to the CDC Q/I Calculator.

the “haven’t lived with anyone with Covid for two weeks” is way outside cdc guidelines (which actually don’t recommend quarantine if you’re vaccinated; my school does a 5 day out of school if a household member is positive — this has been our one break from the cdc). If that’s a rule, lots of kids will never be in school and it’s unnecessary.

This sounds like it is referring to symptomatic people. I am okay with someone who was recently exposed and symptomatic to be required to quarantine.

School starts next week for some schools and I have heard nothing about Covid protocols. My expectations are low. I know lots of people are ready to move on, but Covid is definitely not over. I think treating it like other illnesses right now would be a mistake. Given the increased risk of long Covid and disability with each infection I am not of fan of the current let it rip mentality.

I do think kids should be in school but more could be done to keep them healthy and safe while they are there. We should be improving indoor air quality everywhere. We should all be masking indoors when transmission is high.

[akayf]

2 + years and our luck finally ran out. DH, DS2(11) and I all tested positive today. DH had allergy like symptoms after doing yard work on Sunday that went away by bedtime. Everyone was fine yesterday so we assumed allergies. Then I started cold like symptoms today and DS complained he had a headache plus he sounded a little congested. Tested the 2 of us and almost immediate positive. Then did symptoms free older DS(14) and DH. DH popped up positive within 5 minutes. DS1 was negative.

DS 2 was getting his booster this week(I was waiting until it was closer to school starting so he would be freshly boosted ). DH and I were boosted in the fall/winter and DS2 got his booster in the spring. Hopefully this runs it’s course quickly. We have a Disney trip in 18 days! And DS1 is now missing band camp this week.

[mala]

Anyone want to talk through this?
Monday - little kid went to daycare as normal (in home daycare)
Tuesday - daycare providers husband tests positive, little kid stays home, kids arent around husband at all, though its the same household obviously
Today - provider tests positive.

How likely is it that she was contagious on Monday when the kids were there?

Little kid still isnt vaccinated, I'm about to throw rocks at her pediatrician, which is a different rant.

We have a tripped planned in a week and a half and having to cancel will be a huge blow financially (work trip).

[Velar Fricative]

Aug 3, 2022 7:32:01 GMT -5 mala said:

Anyone want to talk through this?
Monday - little kid went to daycare as normal (in home daycare)
Tuesday - daycare providers husband tests positive, little kid stays home, kids arent around husband at all, though its the same household obviously
Today - provider tests positive.

How likely is it that she was contagious on Monday when the kids were there?

Little kid still isnt vaccinated, I'm about to throw rocks at her pediatrician, which is a different rant.

We have a tripped planned in a week and a half and having to cancel will be a huge blow financially (work trip).

She was likely quite contagious but that doesn’t mean anyone else in that classroom will get infected. If you have home tests, I’d either test daily until the trip (if you have a lot) or monitor for symptoms and test if there is symptom onset and/or 5 days after last exposure.

[mala]

Aug 3, 2022 7:46:57 GMT -5 Velar Fricative said:

Aug 3, 2022 7:32:01 GMT -5 mala said:

Anyone want to talk through this?
Monday - little kid went to daycare as normal (in home daycare)
Tuesday - daycare providers husband tests positive, little kid stays home, kids arent around husband at all, though its the same household obviously
Today - provider tests positive.

How likely is it that she was contagious on Monday when the kids were there?

Little kid still isnt vaccinated, I'm about to throw rocks at her pediatrician, which is a different rant.

We have a tripped planned in a week and a half and having to cancel will be a huge blow financially (work trip).

She was likely quite contagious but that doesn’t mean anyone else in that classroom will get infected. If you have home tests, I’d either test daily until the trip (if you have a lot) or monitor for symptoms and test if there is symptom onset and/or 5 days after last exposure.

This is what I was afraid of, couldn't remember how many days before symptom onset you're considered contagious anymore. Both provider and her husband are vaccinated and double boosted due to health issues. They avoided covid for 2.5 years and get it just in time to ruin our trip. Just poor timing, not blaming them at all. The wild thing is that when it was just her husband she wasnt required to close the daycare! The health department and licencing board were fine with her being open even though he was going to be working from home. Thats out the window now that shes positive of course, amd we were going to keep Little Kid home regardless after he tested positive. It was just exposure on Monday so we're cross all our crossables.

Oof, we're supposed to see my parents on saturday, we'll swab her before we go to be safe.

[Velar Fricative]

Aug 3, 2022 8:05:20 GMT -5 mala said:

Aug 3, 2022 7:46:57 GMT -5 Velar Fricative said:

She was likely quite contagious but that doesn’t mean anyone else in that classroom will get infected. If you have home tests, I’d either test daily until the trip (if you have a lot) or monitor for symptoms and test if there is symptom onset and/or 5 days after last exposure.

This is what I was afraid of, couldn't remember how many days before symptom onset you're considered contagious anymore. Both provider and her husband are vaccinated and double boosted due to health issues. They avoided covid for 2.5 years and get it just in time to ruin our trip. Just poor timing, not blaming them at all. The wild thing is that when it was just her husband she wasnt required to close the daycare! The health department and licencing board were fine with her being open even though he was going to be working from home. Thats out the window now that shes positive of course, amd we were going to keep Little Kid home regardless after he tested positive. It was just exposure on Monday so we're cross all our crossables.

Oof, we're supposed to see my parents on saturday, we'll swab her before we go to be safe.

This seems pretty standard nowadays, even in my city that took covid pretty seriously for a long time. My (cautious) employer only requires people who live with a positive case to quarantine if the employee themselves is symptomatic or has not gotten a booster shot (we have a vaccine mandate). If the employee hasn't had a booster but had covid within the last 90 days, they don't have to quarantine. But if the employee doesn't have symptoms and is up to date on their vaccinations, they can continue to work onsite but must wear a mask for 10 days. I have sensed for a while that we are long past quarantining anyone without symptoms in most cases/areas. Not to mention this virus acts in strange ways; every time someone in my house had covid they did not transmit it to any of the rest of us, for example. My presymptomatic MIL did not spread covid to anyone at a 30+ person indoor party a few months back. You just never know, so stay optimistic!

[macmars45]

I'm with curbsideprophet on this: "I know lots of people are ready to move on, but Covid is definitely not over. I think treating it like other illnesses right now would be a mistake. Given the increased risk of long Covid and disability with each infection I am not of fan of the current let it rip mentality"

It seems like a large portion of people in general don't know anyone with a life long disability or don't think it can happen to them. Life with two life long disabilities is hard in many many ways. It limits what I can do and how I can do it. Like hell do I want a third life long disability. My DS is autistic and doesn't yet know all the challenges and limitations that will come with. Like hell does he need yet another disability.

[karinothing]

Aug 3, 2022 8:39:22 GMT -5 macmars45 said:

I'm with curbsideprophet on this: "I know lots of people are ready to move on, but Covid is definitely not over. I think treating it like other illnesses right now would be a mistake. Given the increased risk of long Covid and disability with each infection I am not of fan of the current let it rip mentality"

It seems like a large portion of people in general don't know anyone with a life long disability or don't think it can happen to them. Life with two life long disabilities is hard in many many ways. It limits what I can do and how I can do it. Like hell do I want a third life long disability. My DS is autistic and doesn't yet know all the challenges and limitations that will come with. Like hell does he need yet another disability.

I understand this, but I guess my question is. Is there a possibility we will come up with vaccine that will 100% Covid (probably not given its rate of mutation, vaccines like the measles vaccine work so well because it is still the same virus it has been since the beginning of time). Will we be able to come up with a treatment that can prevent the risk of long covid or disability? I am guessing no, but I could be wrong there. I guess my question is what is the end goal for covid. I think there is certainly a chance that it will get milder. I mean more folks are getting it now than were getting it in early 2020 and we have a lot less people dying (milder virus plus better treatment/greater understanding and vaccines). But I don't think the risk of long covid/disability is ever going away.

I don't want to say that I have given up and moved on. But we are basically back to normal (but still wearing masks in crowded places). I haven't heard the CDC or anyone really say what the end goal is. What is the place we need to get to in order to move on and is it even possible to get there? We might just have to accept that we now live in a world where there is this common virus that puts us all at risk and we can only do so much to prevent it. Humanity had a really good run where we were relatively safe from disease but it probably wasn't something we could maintain forever.

ETA: I should add where we in the western privileged world were relatively safe from disease.

[sonrisa]

Aug 3, 2022 9:03:04 GMT -5 karinothing said:

What is the place we need to get to in order to move on.

sometimes norms change when the world changes.

The world has changed, and just like our hygiene norms changed when people learned germ theory or our street walking patterns changed when cars arrived, the long term norms should change with changing risks and changing information.

Some things that used to feel normal may go out of style just like cloth hand towels at public restrooms.

[karinothing]

Aug 3, 2022 10:08:49 GMT -5 sonrisa said:

Aug 3, 2022 9:03:04 GMT -5 karinothing said:

What is the place we need to get to in order to move on.

[/p][/quote]
sometimes norms change when the world changes.
The world has changed, and just like our hygiene norms changed when people learned germ theory or our street walking patterns changed when cars arrived, the long term norms should change with changing risks and changing information.
Some things that used to feel normal may go out of style just like cloth hand towels at public restrooms.[/quote]

Right and I am fine with a lot of that. But is a norm going to be isolating forever? I mean now that we know you could get covid every 28 days kids could miss a substantial amount of school and people a substantial amount of work. I don't think that is sustainable (my kids missed 5 weeks of school this year after getting covid twice). It could be a lot more this year. I don't think works are going to suddenly start having liberal sick leave or schools providing quality learning for the weeks the kids are going to be out. 

So sure, mask wearing can continue, better hygiene is always great. I just don't think the quarantine/isolation requirements are going to last forever and I am not sure it should (I am not a doctor, but don't see that as a big push from the medical community)