@@The White Flight from Football

[wanderingback]

Very good article. I’ve thought about these issues for awhile - Black bodies being put in danger for white gaze and white people making money. It’s said systemic issues like poverty has led to this, starting at an early age. The NFL is trash and to be honest I don’t understand how people who are somewhat in the known about CTE, racism, etc still continue to support it.

www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2019/02/football-white-flight-racial-divide/581623/

“While black boys are disproportionately getting channeled into a violent sport, white people are making the most money off of it. Seventy percent of NFL players are black, but only 9.9 percent of managers in the league office are. The NFL was just 52 percent black in 1985. Only two people of color are majority owners of NFL franchises: Shahid Khan, the Pakistani American owner of the Jacksonville Jaguars, and Kim Pegula, a Korean American businesswoman who is a partial owner of the Buffalo Bills.”

"Last year, the NFL expanded its Rooney Rule, which was first implemented in 2003 and seeks to diversify teams’ coaching and front-office staff. Still, the gladiatorial overtones are hard to overlook. Players who want to get recruited by NFL teams must attend the NFL Scouting Combine, a week-long showcase in which they perform mental and physical tests. Athletes’ hand size, arm length, and wingspan are measured during this event, and players are asked to stand naked but for their workout shorts so that team recruiters can see how they are built, according to Edwards, who also works as a consultant with the San Francisco 49ers. NFL and team executives, mostly white men, are evaluating the bodies of black players, deciding whether to make an investment."

[penguingrrl]

I’m sadly not surprised to read that white folks are the ones profiting the most off of football despite players being disproportionately black. This all heartens to the slave trade in a really scary way, putting black men at such enormous unnecessary risk. I hate football with a passion and always have, and my moral issues with the NFL confirm that it’s a really exploitative sport. I’ve never watched a pro or college football game in my life and have no interest in doing.

@@@ I got to our HS games every week because my oldest child is in marching band and the band performs at the games in addition to other performances. I would love if marching band were entirely decoupled from football so I didn’t have to go to the games in order to support my musician, but that’s the system. I never stay past halftime because the game upsets me too much. Every single time there is a tackle my heart stops until the child gets up. And I’ll admit I judge the hell out of parents who allow their kids to play knowing what we do now about how massive the risks are.

[jlt19]

This is really interesting and I don’t know why it never “dawned” on me before why it was such a predominantly black sport. The other 3 major league sports kind of make sense in the diversity due to costs and availability.

Basketball: cheap equipment and can practice anywhere, even alone
Hockey: Either you’re from a frozen tundra or have a lot of $ for ice time
Baseball: probably the most diverse, but now with teams setting up “camps” in Latin American countries, along with the pure insanity of youth sports in the US,, I think we’ll be seeing less black men make it

But really, aren’t the majority of all of them for the pleasure and fortune for white men?

[circa1978]

One of the stories from that article is basically ours. My FIL and my H both played high school and college football, both as linemen. @they are both 100 percent against DS and my nephew playing. DS plays soccer, golf and tennis. I don't think my nephew plays any sport; both are built exactly like FIL/H; on track to be over 6 foot tall and built like well, a linebacker.@

But H got so many concussions he's part of some class action lawsuit; his knees are wrecked. He and FIL were encouraged to bulk up but no one taught them how to do that in a healthy way; both of them have been close to 300 pounds at their highest weights. They both regret that DH walked away from baseball to play football; they were very pressured for H to play by coaches due to his body type.

It's always been interesting to me that people who in theory should "love" the sport (players) are so harmed by it. FIL and DH backed away from football totally; no playing it, no watching it. But that's a luxury and scholarships and financial aid are always going to be a lure until something is done to the system.

[Velar Fricative]

That was a sobering read. It's a few years old but highly relevant now, and especially after the controversy from last night's NFL game where a player who got injured on Sunday got injured again last night.

I'm not Black and I don't live in a rural area, but if both of those applied to me, I can understand why the mother featured is pro-football. She's worried about other risks to her sons' lives and if you think about it, tackle football seems like the best choice out of crappy choices. Much of rural white America is big into football too, but there's the added element of what other options there are for Black boys versus white boys.

[eddy]

Football to my limited knowledge is also one of the few sports that can be picked up without spending thousands and thousands of dollars on travel teams for price of entry onto a high school team.  It is a sport that you can still enter into and excel without going the travel team route at a very early age. The teams are big. There will be room for you to join in and learn the skills on a public school team. That is not the case for baseball, basketball or the other money making sports. If your high school team is good, it is understood there will be no room for you unless you have spent years on travel teams starting before 10.  Again to my knowledge that is not as much the case with football. From a finance perspective it is still approachable. 
So it would make sense that affluent parents have just floated away and instead are flooding the system in other sports with their wealth. 

[Michelle]

I will have to come back to read the article, but it seems to me this discussion was on here by our former black board members. If it wasn't them, it was some women in my IRL circle.

When CTE first started getting attention, I had just learned about it around a year or so prior from a presentation Dr. Ann McKee gave at my friend's charity event for ALS awareness. My friend was 20 when diagnosed with ALS. He lived with it until we were 36. His 10 year anniversary of passing away was last week. She told me at the time that she was blown off by some of the ALS greats in the world like Dr. Stanley Appel, who diagnosed my friend.

At that time, football was compared by ... someone... as the old gladiator days, where the rich and upper classes would make the poor and prisoners fight to the death for entertainment. Football was given the same comparison. I was never a huge fan, but since then, I feel sick to my stomach watching it.

@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@



I decided if i ever had a son, there is no way in hell I'd support him playing. I have wondered if the Brigance Brigade might help deter young black kids from playing as well, but since i don't follow the sport, i don't know if his example is giving anyone pause.

[georgeglass]

A few years ago, H and I went to a wedding in Oxford, MS, home of Ole Miss. We went to the Grove, where the football team marches through the tailgaters on the way to the game. (There wasn't a game or tailgating while we were there, but you could envision it). All I could think of was the "Are you not entertained?" scene from Gladiators - a bunch of rich, white people watching bloodsport.

[Deleted]

Sept 30, 2022 12:50:03 GMT -5 wanderingback said:

The NFL is trash and to be honest I don’t understand how people who are somewhat in the known about CTE, racism, etc still continue to support it.

so much this. 

the average nfl player is in the league about 3 years. The vast majority do not make enough money to never work again yet the toll on their bodies is insane. Yet so many people still support this awful league/sport. 

[cap]

@@@

This is basically playing out right now in my community. Our school district just cancelled the rest of the varsity football season. There were basically no seniors on the team to begin with and early season injuries meant a lot of sophomores were playing varsity, which then led to even more injuries. Our school district is relatively affluent and highly educated due to our extremely close proximity to a huge university. We actually are pretty racially diverse, though (again, likely due to the proximity to the university).

Football is not a school-sponsored sport until high school. There is a youth community football program, but no school funding goes to support it, to the point that they have to rent the high school football stadium to use it. There group of parents created a GoFundMe to raise money for the program and posted on FB. Of course, I checked out the GoFundMe when I saw the post and it's not raising all that much money.

I wouldn't be too surprised if our school district doesn't have a high school football program for much longer.

[seeyalater52]

Sept 30, 2022 14:51:02 GMT -5 Velar Fricative said:

That was a sobering read. It's a few years old but highly relevant now, and especially after the controversy from last night's NFL game where a player who got injured on Sunday got injured again last night.

I'm not Black and I don't live in a rural area, but if both of those applied to me, I can understand why the mother featured is pro-football. She's worried about other risks to her sons' lives and if you think about it, tackle football seems like the best choice out of crappy choices. Much of rural white America is big into football too, but there's the added element of what other options there are for Black boys versus white boys.

I do not follow football because the NFL is indeed trash for this and so many other reasons, but I did see some discussion about last night’s controversy today and do hope that hopes to change at least some of the material reality for players even though obviously the racism and structural issues will continue as long as this sport continues to receive support.

[Poeticxpassion]

I agree that the NFL is trash. Is anyone following the concussion talk about the Dolphins quarterback? Those videos are terrifying!

[erbear]

Sept 30, 2022 13:08:13 GMT -5 penguingrrl said:

I’m sadly not surprised to read that white folks are the ones profiting the most off of football despite players being disproportionately black. This all heartens to the slave trade in a really scary way, putting black men at such enormous unnecessary risk. I hate football with a passion and always have, and my moral issues with the NFL confirm that it’s a really exploitative sport. I’ve never watched a pro or college football game in my life and have no interest in doing.

@@@ I got to our HS games every week because my oldest child is in marching band and the band performs at the games in addition to other performances. I would love if marching band were entirely decoupled from football so I didn’t have to go to the games in order to support my musician, but that’s the system. I never stay past halftime because the game upsets me too much. Every single time there is a tackle my heart stops until the child gets up. And I’ll admit I judge the hell out of parents who allow their kids to play knowing what we do now about how massive the risks are.

The first episode of the Colin Kaepernik documentary juxtaposes slave auctions with the NFL combine and it’s powerful. I hadn’t thought of it that way and now I can’t unsee it.

[penguingrrl]

Sept 30, 2022 19:02:07 GMT -5 erbear said:

Sept 30, 2022 13:08:13 GMT -5 penguingrrl said:

I’m sadly not surprised to read that white folks are the ones profiting the most off of football despite players being disproportionately black. This all heartens to the slave trade in a really scary way, putting black men at such enormous unnecessary risk. I hate football with a passion and always have, and my moral issues with the NFL confirm that it’s a really exploitative sport. I’ve never watched a pro or college football game in my life and have no interest in doing.

@@@ I got to our HS games every week because my oldest child is in marching band and the band performs at the games in addition to other performances. I would love if marching band were entirely decoupled from football so I didn’t have to go to the games in order to support my musician, but that’s the system. I never stay past halftime because the game upsets me too much. Every single time there is a tackle my heart stops until the child gets up. And I’ll admit I judge the hell out of parents who allow their kids to play knowing what we do now about how massive the risks are.

The first episode of the Colin Kaepernik documentary juxtaposes slave auctions with the NFL combine and it’s powerful. I hadn’t thought of it that way and now I can’t unsee it.

That’s horrifying. Until seeing this article I had never heard of how the NFL does these things since I avoid football related info, but that juxtaposition is awful, and all too real.

[Deleted]

Sept 30, 2022 18:21:36 GMT -5 Poeticxpassion said:

I agree that the NFL is trash. Is anyone following the concussion talk about the Dolphins quarterback? Those videos are terrifying!

We are Dolphins fans and watched both games. From what I understand, Tua was assessed after the hit he took on Sunday, by both a team doctor and an independent doctor who specializes in concussions, and he met the criteria to be allowed back in the game on Sunday. Then he took a bad hit last night and went to the hospital, where he has since been released. The assumption is concussion.

This is concerning because a) if he met the criteria to be allowed back into Sunday’s game, perhaps the criteria aren’t stringent enough, and B) suffering a second concussion when not recovered from the first can cause all kind of compounding problems beyond what one would normally see with two concussions spaced further apart.

Obviously ANY concussions are bad, but as a quarterback he should never get hit hard enough to end up with a concussion anyway (the play on Sunday was called a penalty, the play on Thursday was not). The whole enterprise of football has tried to reduce the number of concussions by changing rules of what kinds of hits are allowed, utilizing helmet technology, etc, but clearly it hasn’t been nearly enough.

FWIW, my sister is a sports medicine doctor who specializes in concussions and wouldn’t dream of letting her kids play football.

[Poeticxpassion]

@villainv, thank you for the additional information. I appreciate it!

[RitzyHeifer]

@@@
We (white parents) do not let our biracial son play football despite his wanting to and pressure from the (all white) local jr high and high school coaches. Aside from aaaall the concussion and CTE concerns, the HS coaches routinely give the players smelling salts an energy drinks/pre-workout without prior consent or knowledge of the parents.

And the school offers additional insurance for athletes if you don’t have health insurance. It’s free for all sports except football, for which it’s $700/season. If that isn’t telling about the physical dangers of the sport…

[lilac05]

Sept 30, 2022 14:36:26 GMT -5 circa1978 said:

One of the stories from that article is basically ours. My FIL and my H both played high school and college football, both as linemen. @they are both 100 percent against DS and my nephew playing. DS plays soccer, golf and tennis. I don't think my nephew plays any sport; both are built exactly like FIL/H; on track to be over 6 foot tall and built like well, a linebacker.@

But H got so many concussions he's part of some class action lawsuit; his knees are wrecked. He and FIL were encouraged to bulk up but no one taught them how to do that in a healthy way; both of them have been close to 300 pounds at their highest weights. They both regret that DH walked away from baseball to play football; they were very pressured for H to play by coaches due to his body type.

It's always been interesting to me that people who in theory should "love" the sport (players) are so harmed by it. FIL and DH backed away from football totally; no playing it, no watching it. But that's a luxury and scholarships and financial aid are always going to be a lure until something is done to the system.

I could have written this almost word for word, minus the lawsuit. 5 knee surgeries (likely more to come) and 2 back procedures (likely more to come) and a lifelong battle with weight. My FIL actually had a head injury that put him in the hospital for awhile & ended his playing days. We live in a big college football area and often feel like we’re the only ones who don’t watch. I just can’t.

I’m glad the NFL is at least trying to address concussions instead of pretending it doesn’t exist. They’re still not doing enough. When I was in grad school in early 2000s, I was learning about concussions/brain injuries. My H was still drinking the football Koolaid. He was just SURE that the NFL was taking care of their players…and college teams were, too. Thankfully he accepted reality. I think a lot of people are living in denial.

[Jalapeñomel]

Thanks for sharing. The NFL and the football pipeline is really trash, and it’s something that’s brushed under the rug because it’s such a huge part of the culture.

[sent]

Football is big money. I can't see anything taking it down without the government stepping in and saying "No more." And we can all see how the different layers of the government and medical science advances completely clash at every level in making progress in our society. I know in the two towns I am involved with in NJ (one higher income, one leans blue collar), we don't have youth football anymore. The boys have all moved over to baseball and soccer.

Add me to the group that has always thought football and the fanaticism that follows it is garbage. I know it cost me a major loss of cool points when I interviewed for residency at universities with enormous college football pride and I had no idea what the fuss was about. My husband is a big fan, but I'm trying to keep my kids away from getting too steeped in that. 

[basilosaurus]

I have just learned that kids in some areas start playing tackle football as young as 7! WHY?!!!!! I was never particularly into football, and the only time I've been to pro games was as a guest probably 20 years ago,

Also, the Rooney rule was at the center of a case on last week's Good Fight. TV is so educational.

[Poeticxpassion]

Oct 1, 2022 9:55:17 GMT -5 basilosaurus said:

I have just learned that kids in some areas start playing tackle football as young as 7! WHY?!!!!! I was never particularly into football, and the only time I've been to pro games was as a guest probably 20 years ago,

Also, the Rooney rule was at the center of a case on last week's Good Fight. TV is so educational.

There is a woman I use to work for that allows both her sons (8 and 9) to play tackle football. They are located in Florida. Both kids have been playing for several years. She posts videos and the kids are rough on each other!

[foundmylazybum]

I think I read this article awhile back, and Real Sports has done some very good reporting on white flight from football, but how the sport continues to be popular in Black communities and the NFL funds coaching education, camps etc in targeted communities and it creates a marketed "party line," that many of the youth coaches sell. Including that the NFL is a leader in CTE research and they are coaching safely.

It made me so sad for these coaches. Because they ALSO are using football as safe places, community building, teaching spaces etc. They tell worried parents, "we got this education and your sons will be safe," and that's not necessarily true, but they are only repeating messaging they were given.



I also find it interesting that so many comments from this post represent white flight from the sport in action.

[lilac05]

Oct 1, 2022 12:05:26 GMT -5 foundmylazybum said:

I also find it interesting that so many comments from this post represent white flight from the sport in action.

@@i think about this, too…but what else are people going to go? And is there a difference between refusing to let your kids play while still watching it and refusing to spend a dime or a minute on the sport regardless of who is playing?

Honestly, that’s why I stopped even watching the game. For awhile, I was OK just planning on not letting our kids play while still watching games on TV. Then I realIzed that I was watching people sacrifice their bodies & minds for the entertainment of others…and no longer have any desire to watch anything. Other than educate people on TBI/CTE/concussions, I’m not sure what else I can do to be a part of the solution. (This is an honest statement, open for ideas, not snark.)

[mirabelle]

@@@
DS 8 is in flag football this year. If he did football next year it’s tackle, so he will not be playing. We have family in the PNW and I think they have flag football leagues that are available for older ages. I’d like to see the sport move in that direction. Hockey and football are a big no for me. Flag is a good way for him to learn just the general idea of the game. Some of the parents are very intense… when it’s just a bunch of boys having fun playing flag football.

There’s already been 2 serious injuries in MN this year with high school football players and a few years back a high school hockey player sustained life altering injuries, I think about him often and follow his public engagement stuff.

[StrawberryBlondie]

Oct 1, 2022 15:05:02 GMT -5 mirabelle said:

@@@

There’s already been 2 serious injuries in MN this year with high school football players and a few years back a high school hockey player sustained life altering injuries, I think about him often and follow his public engagement stuff.

Let's actually be specific with this... they're paralyzed.

Absolutely no snark intended, I just don't want people to think that "serious injury" means, like, a badly broken leg or something.

[whattheheck]

Sept 30, 2022 19:56:22 GMT -5 @villainv said:

Sept 30, 2022 18:21:36 GMT -5 Poeticxpassion said:

I agree that the NFL is trash. Is anyone following the concussion talk about the Dolphins quarterback? Those videos are terrifying!

We are Dolphins fans and watched both games. From what I understand, Tua was assessed after the hit he took on Sunday, by both a team doctor and an independent doctor who specializes in concussions, and he met the criteria to be allowed back in the game on Sunday. Then he took a bad hit last night and went to the hospital, where he has since been released. The assumption is concussion.

This is concerning because a) if he met the criteria to be allowed back into Sunday’s game, perhaps the criteria aren’t stringent enough, and B) suffering a second concussion when not recovered from the first can cause all kind of compounding problems beyond what one would normally see with two concussions spaced further apart.

Obviously ANY concussions are bad, but as a quarterback he should never get hit hard enough to end up with a concussion anyway (the play on Sunday was called a penalty, the play on Thursday was not). The whole enterprise of football has tried to reduce the number of concussions by changing rules of what kinds of hits are allowed, utilizing helmet technology, etc, but clearly it hasn’t been nearly enough.

FWIW, my sister is a sports medicine doctor who specializes in concussions and wouldn’t dream of letting her kids play football.

I believe the doctor that cleared him has been fired. Not that that’s enough.

[goldengirlz]

This has been a conversation in our household for more than a decade, and my H stopped following football long ago. (I was never into it.) We rarely even watch the Super Bowl.

Of course, none of the safety concerns have really dampened viewership. And as long as white people will still spend money on football, all the perverse incentives remain in place, there’s little drive to make the game safer, and white people will continue to exploit Black bodies for profit.

ETA: I’m not sure what the solution is, but it has to involve increasing opportunities (athletic and otherwise) for Black children beyond just this one lifeline. Sports offer a lot of positive benefits for kids, but they’ve also become a way to get into and afford college. That’s why it’s gotten like this — just look at how prominent sports were in the college admissions scandal. OTOH, white people will just put their kids in a sport like fencing, and still get the admissions benefit, but there’s no NFL counterpart for fencing (i.e. with a lot of these rich white people sports, playing professionally is generally not a carrot for participating and the leagues aren’t investing as much money into Black communities). So reforming the NFL itself also needs to be a focus.

[foundmylazybum]

Oct 2, 2022 11:11:16 GMT -5 goldengirlz said:

ETA: I’m not sure what the solution is, but it has to involve increasing opportunities (athletic and otherwise) for Black children beyond just this one lifeline. Sports offer a lot of positive benefits for kids, but they’ve also become a way to get into and afford college. That’s why it’s gotten like this — just look at how prominent sports were in the college admissions scandal. OTOH, white people will just put their kids in a sport like fencing, and still get the admissions benefit, but there’s no NFL counterpart for fencing. So reforming the NFL itself also needs to be a focus.

I work in sports and a big focus and topic of discussion is social justice and advocacy.

I think a lot about how sports but especially youth sports is *supposed* to be about all these positive values and it does provide that space, but youth sports is a huge capitalistic venture that is actually preying on those perceived idealistic values we want our kids to develop.


The NFL is a big organization that is actively engaging in youth sports in targeted communities and you are right: other sports; especially "elite" sports don't engage bc it doesn't appear to be financially lucrative.

I think its one thing to turn away from an organization like the NFL, but additionally look into the organizations we support and what advocacy or social justice work do they do to increase diversity and inclusion to communities in need so these predatory organizations aren't the only option?

[msmerymac]

Sept 30, 2022 19:56:22 GMT -5 @villainv said:

Sept 30, 2022 18:21:36 GMT -5 Poeticxpassion said:

I agree that the NFL is trash. Is anyone following the concussion talk about the Dolphins quarterback? Those videos are terrifying!

We are Dolphins fans and watched both games. From what I understand, Tua was assessed after the hit he took on Sunday, by both a team doctor and an independent doctor who specializes in concussions, and he met the criteria to be allowed back in the game on Sunday. Then he took a bad hit last night and went to the hospital, where he has since been released. The assumption is concussion.

This is concerning because a) if he met the criteria to be allowed back into Sunday’s game, perhaps the criteria aren’t stringent enough, and B) suffering a second concussion when not recovered from the first can cause all kind of compounding problems beyond what one would normally see with two concussions spaced further apart.

Obviously ANY concussions are bad, but as a quarterback he should never get hit hard enough to end up with a concussion anyway (the play on Sunday was called a penalty, the play on Thursday was not). The whole enterprise of football has tried to reduce the number of concussions by changing rules of what kinds of hits are allowed, utilizing helmet technology, etc, but clearly it hasn’t been nearly enough.

FWIW, my sister is a sports medicine doctor who specializes in concussions and wouldn’t dream of letting her kids play football.

I’m a Bills fan, and as we now know, the independent doctor was fired by the NFLPA. The issue, I guess, is no matter how independent, the doctor is being paid by the NFL, right?

I didn’t think Milano hit Tua that hard, but he went down hard/hit the back of his head, was dizzy and stumbling when he got up, and then the team spun it like he was having back spasms and had just re-injured his back like we didn’t know what we all saw. It was awful all around. I didn’t watch Thursday’s game but saw the next morning that he was hit again and taken out on a stretcher.

In boxing it’s called having a Glass Jaw when a player is easily injured and that seems to be Tua. Dude hasn’t ever played an entire NFL season. I know they’ve cracked down on roughing the passer in the last few years, but it rings hollow when 1) the goal of part of the defensive line is to stop/interrupt the pass, and 2) the rest of the game/hits are so violent.