And now Pence has documents too

[penguingrrl]

Until this NYT article popped up I had legit forgotten about Pence’s existence. He found classified documents in his IN home…

Gift link: www.nytimes.com/2023/01/24/us/politics/mike-pence-classified-documents.html?unlocked_article_code=WNdUpmFrOzAgzS8zyQtSnut-yjPQLySq4lJX-IT6RzSn4sKyNCxCrg0USpCKL0LyntiXfbF_BJV90L5Vz3qeW76vpWcodbYcKBv3zzVDEagldR7V8NXbTGKwuU3HtW6crnFZLvRpYc-r2nGUGhuHcJZ-cN7f7ZJXDu5aTcUWe-W4I9G5XExhk2e37RV6nkEiEtCI1kWLN9nqbxc-vlO11XYpuHhgc65Zvv4g9KgN-UO4K678O2W1OBH_jOJ7b80xyyLyrz-riKT8fOVule3lQV99ifbOC9wa2A0ECOXRHEanLPpaOTyTp1RGEqgEN9fjJkwufbkDks30e5QDrVH98qk1IWG0Yy_XsgaDeioD&smid=share-url

[cattledogkisses]

Good grief. This is clearly a systemic problem on both sides of the aisle.

[mrsd2006]

Who doesn't have any classifed documents at their house?

[SwimDeep]

You know what, my company mandates yearly training for every employee to ensure data and documents are labeled and managed correctly. I'm not saying that government should be run like a business, but maybe some basic "How to know your doc is classified" type training is needed here... because clearly keeping hard copies in folders labeled TOP FUCKING SECRET isn't enough 😵

[cattledogkisses]

Apparently everyone needs some remedial classes on how to handle classified documents.

[icedcoffee]

I'm curious why so much shit is printed out in hard copy? It's 2023. Flip through it on your ipad like the rest of America.

[noodleoo]

Stephen Colbert had a good joke about this last week. Basically around the idea that they could invent some new technology to barcode the documents and maybe a card that could be scanned when you check them out that keeps track of who has them, when they are due, and maybe charges a fine when they are overdue. LOL

But seriously, how hard would it be to barcode the docs and have them signed in and out from wherever they are coming from?

Or yes, have them read electronically?

[pixy0stix]

Jan 24, 2023 14:09:06 GMT -5 icedcoffee said:

I'm curious why so much shit is printed out in hard copy? It's 2023. Flip through it on your ipad like the rest of America.

I wonder if some of it is so top secret they don't want digital transmission. 

[Scout'sHonor]

Jan 24, 2023 14:04:13 GMT -5 SwimDeep said:

You know what, my company mandates yearly training for every employee to ensure data and documents are labeled and managed correctly. I'm not saying that government should be run like a business, but maybe some basic "How to know your doc is classified" type training is needed here... because clearly keeping hard copies in folders labeled TOP FUCKING SECRET isn't enough 😵

We do though! At least my agency does, it's a yearly records management training.

[notreal]

It's crazy that Marvel movies and Star Wars keep better track of their scripts than the government does of its private documents.

[Velar Fricative]

Jan 24, 2023 13:56:20 GMT -5 mrsd2006 said:

Who doesn't have any classifed documents at their house?

This is so contagious that I probably do.

[icedcoffee]

Jan 24, 2023 14:22:30 GMT -5 pixy0stix said:

Jan 24, 2023 14:09:06 GMT -5 icedcoffee said:

I'm curious why so much shit is printed out in hard copy? It's 2023. Flip through it on your ipad like the rest of America.

I wonder if some of it is so top secret they don't want digital transmission. 

But surely the government can work on a secure way of viewing files, right?  I mean...the online passport renewal website is so secure I legit can't get in and had to do it by mail.  LOL

[lilac05]

I think some of it may be so top secret, but also, it’s pretty crazy all of the things that can be labeled “Classified.” Things like published newspaper articles can be classified, and phone messages, even ones that aren’t necessarily important. The podcast “Here’s Where It Gets Interesting” has a good episode on it.

Considering how quickly things go from business as usual to “NEXT!!” at inauguration, it’s not really a surprise to me that some things end up in the wrong place…especially when we’re talking about such a wide range of things!

The whole system obviously needs a complete overhaul. I wouldn’t be shocked if every single former president & VP had at least one classified document in their possession. Not because they intentionally took it, but just because something got mixed in with other stuff and has been living in boxes ever since.

[mrsd2006]

Jan 24, 2023 14:32:57 GMT -5 Velar Fricative said:

Jan 24, 2023 13:56:20 GMT -5 mrsd2006 said:

Who doesn't have any classifed documents at their house?

This is so contagious that I probably do.

Knock knock

Who's there 

The FBI 

[cous0226]

Am pretty sure pence was out there all over Biden about his documents. He should have looked in his garage first too.

[cous0226]

I also heard an analyst say that this is probably very common but it never makes the news but now because of dumpster fire, everything has to be covered.

[smock]

Jan 24, 2023 14:32:57 GMT -5 Velar Fricative said:

Jan 24, 2023 13:56:20 GMT -5 mrsd2006 said:

Who doesn't have any classifed documents at their house?

This is so contagious that I probably do.

BRB, gotta check the garage (next to the Corvette). 🤪

[Bad Dingo]

www.axios.com/2023/01/24/mike-pence-classified-documents?utm_source=newsletter&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=newsletter_axiospm&stream=top

I just hurt myself rolling my eyes:

"Rep. James Comer (R-Ky.), who chairs the House Oversight and Accountability Committee, said in a statement Tuesday that Pence had reached out concerning the documents' discovery.

"He has agreed to fully cooperate with congressional oversight and any questions we have about the matter. Former Vice President Pence’s transparency stands in stark contrast to Biden White House staff who continue to withhold information from Congress and the American people," Comer said.

Earlier this month Comer said that the committee would not investigate Trump over his handling of classified documents, though the committee has announced that it would investigate Biden's handling of documents."

[NewOrleans]

I think I am the only person without classified documents at home.

[rupertpenny]

To those of you with regular records management training: how is compliance?

In my experience, everyone thinks records management policies don't apply to them, their documents are different. And records managers rarely have the authority to enforce the rules, especially before someone shoves classified documents in the corner of their garage.

[VillainV]

Jan 24, 2023 16:30:42 GMT -5 rupertpenny said:

To those of you with regular records management training: how is compliance?

In my experience, everyone thinks records management policies don't apply to them, their documents are different. And records managers rarely have the authority to enforce the rules, especially before someone shoves classified documents in the corner of their garage.

Granted I’m in the military, but we get a million reminders until we do it, and eventually we could get punishment if we refuse to comply.

[rupertpenny]

And everything is on paper because these are OLD MEN we are talking about here, but there are also legit advantages to keeping paper records over electronic.

[livinitup]

Oh, Pence. Always trying so hard to be like your hero.

“Pay attention to me, too! Me, too!”

Always failing.

[rupertpenny]

Jan 24, 2023 16:35:43 GMT -5 VillainV said:

Jan 24, 2023 16:30:42 GMT -5 rupertpenny said:

To those of you with regular records management training: how is compliance?

In my experience, everyone thinks records management policies don't apply to them, their documents are different. And records managers rarely have the authority to enforce the rules, especially before someone shoves classified documents in the corner of their garage.

Granted I’m in the military, but we get a million reminders until we do it, and eventually we could get punishment if we refuse to comply.

I am glad to hear the military cares! 

I've worked in higher ed and the response is usually more like "lol, you and your cute little rules, it's adorable you think you have any say at all!" Not to mention that the university I work for now DOESN'T EVEN HAVE A RECORDS RETENTION SCHEDULE. 

I previously worked as a records manager in the Senate and it was the same. No official rules and no authority to encourage best practices. I know the executive branch is different because NARA is involved, but what is a records analyst working in the Executive Office Building going to do when the VP decided to take home government owned files to review? Not to mention get the VP to bring the documents back to work? Absolutely nothing besides complain about it on the internet and perhaps develop an ulcer or other stress related health condition. 

I find all of this to be very much NOT OK but it has never been surprising to me. 

[SwimDeep]

Jan 24, 2023 16:30:42 GMT -5 rupertpenny said:

To those of you with regular records management training: how is compliance?

In my experience, everyone thinks records management policies don't apply to them, their documents are different. And records managers rarely have the authority to enforce the rules, especially before someone shoves classified documents in the corner of their garage.

I like my job and want to keep it. So I'm very compliant and careful with how I handle the technical info I edit and share. I can't speak for overall compliance because I'm not in a position to know. I'd like to think it's good 🤷‍♀️

We do get a lot of cyber and physical security reminders. I know exactly what to do if my work laptop gets stolen or if I lose my phone or if I accidentally share confidential docs on Google drive (which won't happen lol).

[Pilsy]

Jan 24, 2023 13:14:53 GMT -5 penguingrrl said:

Until this NYT article popped up I had legit forgotten about Pence’s existence. He found classified documents in his IN home…

Relatable content! lol

[mpm]

Jan 24, 2023 16:49:46 GMT -5 SwimDeep said:

Jan 24, 2023 16:30:42 GMT -5 rupertpenny said:

To those of you with regular records management training: how is compliance?

In my experience, everyone thinks records management policies don't apply to them, their documents are different. And records managers rarely have the authority to enforce the rules, especially before someone shoves classified documents in the corner of their garage.

I like my job and want to keep it. So I'm very compliant and careful with how I handle the technical info I edit and share. I can't speak for overall compliance because I'm not in a position to know. I'd like to think it's good 🤷‍♀️

We do get a lot of cyber and physical security reminders. I know exactly what to do if my work laptop gets stolen or if I lose my phone or if I accidentally share confidential docs on Google drive (which won't happen lol).

Same. Every company I’ve worked for has taken this VERY seriously. My prior employer used to send out emails that said things like “Did you know that misplacing a company laptop costs the company $1 million dollars each instance?” The implication was that you’d for certain be fired, even for an inadvertent mistake.

[pumpkin]

Jan 24, 2023 14:24:57 GMT -5 Scout'sHonor said:

Jan 24, 2023 14:04:13 GMT -5 SwimDeep said:

You know what, my company mandates yearly training for every employee to ensure data and documents are labeled and managed correctly. I'm not saying that government should be run like a business, but maybe some basic "How to know your doc is classified" type training is needed here... because clearly keeping hard copies in folders labeled TOP FUCKING SECRET isn't enough 😵

We do though! At least my agency does, it's a yearly records management training.

Yep, we have annual training too. In fact, in my office you can’t even throw away a piece of paper in the trash can. It all has to go throw records management review prior to disposal.

[ellipses84]

I think I’ve told this story before. I used to work for a Gov’t Contractor and we had stressful deadlines where we had to deliver massive amounts of documents to the Gov’t by specific dates (but they weren’t national security related anything that critical). We tried to leave enough time to have the documents printed by a repro company, delivered to us so we could double check them, and then delivered to the Gov’t. One of the few times printing was going to take too long and we allowed the printer to deliver them, we got an angry call from a Gov’t employee we worked with. The printer also had to burn CDs of the documents and use our customized labels…except they ran out of blank CDs and didn’t use our labels. The only blank stack of CDs they had said Top Secret on them and they thought that would be great to use. I got yelled at by the Gov’t employee because TOP SECRET MEANS SOMETHING to the Gov’t and we had to destroy them and provide new ones. They couldn’t have top secret labeled things just floating around their office.

[chchchia]

Jan 24, 2023 16:35:43 GMT -5 VillainV said:

Jan 24, 2023 16:30:42 GMT -5 rupertpenny said:

To those of you with regular records management training: how is compliance?

In my experience, everyone thinks records management policies don't apply to them, their documents are different. And records managers rarely have the authority to enforce the rules, especially before someone shoves classified documents in the corner of their garage.

Granted I’m in the military, but we get a million reminders until we do it, and eventually we could get punishment if we refuse to comply.

I am prior mil and current fed DoD employee and my God the training we have to do.  Ugh, I was a special security officer the whole time I was in the mil and all this gives me agita.  I want to know where the classified custodian was during this whole shit show, just gundecking the fuck out of the inventory lists?  We had to eyeball each and every doc we had in our inventory.

I dealt with Top Secret/Secret/Conf SCI information and the controls that are supposed to be on that is bananas and it seems like it was for what, nothing?  Our leaders were apparently given free reign to do whatever they wanted with it.  If some lower enlisted chump did this, they'd have charges in an instant, but hey no biggie, right?