Israel at war after surprise attack

[cap]

I’m so sorry for those of you that are feeling especially fearful today.

[dcrunnergirl52]

Oct 13, 2023 8:10:14 GMT -5 @villainv said:

Oct 13, 2023 6:43:45 GMT -5 dcrunnergirl52 said:

My (Jewish) mom is flying from Boston to DC this morning, which she does every 6 weeks, and she said BOS is very heavily armed this morning--tons of "guards." She didn't say if it is police/military but just lots of men with "very big guns."

Guns as in firearms, or guns as in biceps?

Men with large firearms (rifles?) at an airport seems a bit weird, considering the news is saying there haven’t been any specific or credible threats.

Firearms for sure

[AJL]

Here’s the thing about being Jewish: we’re always on guard. We are always aware of antisemitism and of the possibility being harmed. “Global jihad”? Same shit, different day. When Israel acts a fool, the Jews in the diaspora prepare for an uptick in hate against us.

I wish non-Jews understood this. It may seem like there is a rise in antisemitism because of course there is. There always is. It is just a part of how we live every day. We know that we are hated and we live with the possibility of real harm all the time.

[sonrisa]

Stay safe, everyone. I am worried about local bigots coming out of the woodwork today.

[wawa]

A lot of love for those feeling extra fear and stress today with all of this.
I hate that anti-Semites will use this as an excuse to ramp up their bullshit. I hope you have the love and support you need in the face of that truth.

[breezy8407]

I'm very sorry for all those that are hurt, scared, angry, and sad.

[Deleted]

I found this to be really well written. Good article

jewishcurrents.org/we-cannot-cross-until-we-carry-each-other

[Deleted]

What on earth?

[AJL]

From my rabbi and it is a message extended to ALL people right now. Though Shabbat may not be your holy day, I invite you to rest for these 24 hours. Step away from social media. Engage in compassion and loving kindness for one another. Be close to your people.

“Shabbat begins tonight. It happens every week, regardless of what’s happening in the world, regardless of the weather, regardless of your birthday or anniversary, regardless if you’re tired and weary and can’t go on any longer. Shabbat happens to remind us that we need rest. It commands us to take a break, to rejuvenate our souls and replenish our bodies. Shabbat brings a special holiness that is unlike any other.

This week has been heavy, painful, intense, exhausting, brutal, horrifying, awful. It has filled my being with anguish and despair. So, so many of us are struggling to comprehend and move forward, like we’re stuck in thick, oozing mud. My brain is foggy, my heart is broken, my body is so very tired.

But tonight, we will gather as a community, actually as a family, to sing, to pray, to smile, to rejoice, and to be with one another for Shabbat. We will create holiness by being together. We will stop time for even a brief moment to remember this special period of escapism. We will pray and hope and hold on to the dream of peace. We will offer words of healing. We will not let violence and oppression and brutality win. We will let our love shine brightly and fiercely. We will cry, and hug, and comfort one another, hoping that will extend out into the world.

This week drained us. It attempted to consume us. The pain of our siblings in Israel cries to us, and we respond with love, so much love it cannot be contained. Our prayers for peace will fill our space and fill our souls. And perhaps, those prayers will reach every corner of the earth.

May God hear our prayers and bring the dream of peace to reality. May our mourning turn to dancing, may our tears flow from joy, and may we hold one another in love.”

[jackie011]

Oct 13, 2023 9:18:56 GMT -5 AJL said:

Here’s the thing about being Jewish: we’re always on guard. We are always aware of antisemitism and of the possibility being harmed. “Global jihad”? Same shit, different day. When Israel acts a fool, the Jews in the diaspora prepare for an uptick in hate against us.

I wish non-Jews understood this. It may seem like there is a rise in antisemitism because of course there is. There always is. It is just a part of how we live every day. We know that we are hated and we live with the possibility of real harm all the time.

Ditto
I work in the Jewish community and today is business as usual, as much as anything has been this week. We have more security on campus, yes, however there still has been no credible information and we’re just doing this day. I’ve received questions, mainly from non-Jewish employees and patrons, but it’s interesting to see who didn’t even question and came to work.

I haven’t posted on this topic yet, as the last week has been such an emotionally gut wrenching experience and I’m having such a hard time even expressing myself to my own family. I pray for peace, and soon. 😔

[bronxgirl]

Thank you so much to everyone offering support. It means a lot. Tomorrow I will go to synagogue with my family and pray for peace. I don't believe in "the power of prayer" as something that can have any affect on actual events, but as a comfort and a coping skill when I feel so powerless.

@@@@@@@@@
My daughter goes to school in Times Square and NYPD worked closely with nearby schools to keep children safe when leaving school. Tomorrow evening my daughter is going to a youth group party with 500 teens all over the greater NYC area. I know some people were afraid to send their kids and canceled(which I understand), but I feel stronger than ever about her going and being around so many Jewish peers.

[goldengirlz]

I need to say something. Some of you may have noticed that I’ve been very angry at @iceblink and feel triggered by her.

I finally figured out why.

First, the context:

I have spent this entire week so deeply grief stricken for my people. And I mean that literally: I know so many people (so many people) who have been first-degree affected by this massacre.

I’m also grieving because I have so much sorrow about what will come next. @@@ I grieve with the Palestinian mothers who are burying their children; I grieve with the Israeli mothers whose children are Hamas hostages. @@@ I can recognize that life is not a neat little narrative of Good vs. Evil.

Nearly every other person on this board has tried to approach this topic with sensitivity. They recognize that if you are not Jewish, you HAVE NOT walked in our shoes. But if there were a word for “gentile-splaining,” that is what IceBlink has been doing this entire week.

I posted this before and I will post this again. History is not black and white. There’s no simple narrative of “oppressed” and “oppressor” in this situation. There is just tragedy.

No one on this board has to agree with Israel’s tactics right now. But jumping on Jewish posters, talking down to them, equating Netanyahu to all of Israel, posting an opinion piece from the Jewish press that criticizes Israel as Jews are here talking about their very valid fears about the rise in antisemitic attacks — I just think she’s been vile, insensitive, and a person who is not an asset to this community.

[Deleted]

Oct 15, 2023 1:00:37 GMT -5 goldengirlz said:

I need to say something. Some of you may have noticed that I’ve been very angry at @iceblink and feel triggered by her.

I finally figured out why.

First, the context:

I have spent this entire week so deeply grief stricken for my people. And I mean that literally: I know so many people (so many people) who have been first-degree affected by this massacre.

I’m also grieving because I have so much sorrow about what will come next. @@@ I grieve with the Palestinian mothers who are burying their children; I grieve with the Israeli mothers whose children are Hamas hostages. @@@ I can recognize that life is not a neat little narrative of Good vs. Evil.

I agree, and the article put into words my thoughts and feelings of grief for everyone which is why I shared it. It was not a Jews criticizing Jews article and if that’s what you got out of it that’s not my intent or my fault.

Nearly every other person on this board has tried to approach this topic with sensitivity. They recognize that if you are not Jewish, you HAVE NOT walked in our shoes. But if there were a word for “gentile-splaining,” that is what IceBlink has been doing this entire week.

I posted this before and I will post this again. History is not black and white. There’s no simple narrative of “oppressed” and “oppressor” in this situation. There is just tragedy.

It’s not black and white but you’re literally telling me it should be black and white in what is acceptable to you for people to post right now. How does that work?

No one on this board has to agree with Israel’s tactics right now. But jumping on Jewish posters, talking down to them, equating Netanyahu to all of Israel, posting an opinion piece from the Jewish press that criticizes Israel as Jews are here talking about their very valid fears about the rise in antisemitic attacks — I just think she’s been vile, insensitive, and a person who is not an asset to this community.

I do not believe I have jumped on, or talked down to anyone if anyone personally feels that way I apologize to them. I have definitely not equated Netanyahu as all of Israel -where??

It feels like the entire world is being gaslit by the media and by their government on what if happening right now and this is just wild.

I don’t feel comfortable speaking out on the situation with my Jewish family and never have and none of them are saying anything either (besides my husband who we have the same feelings). I hoped I had found a space to speak here but it seems there isn’t space for it.

[erbear]

I think what you’re missing is that you want to have an intellectual conversation (debate? argument?) about something that is deeply emotional for some of us. I, for one, am not in a place for that, and I imagine others are feeling a similar way, so when you come in hot like you did here, you can’t be surprised that people aren’t willing to engage right now.

[Deleted]

Oct 15, 2023 9:35:25 GMT -5 erbear said:

I think what you’re missing is that you want to have an intellectual conversation (debate? argument?) about something that is deeply emotional for some of us. I, for one, am not in a place for that, and I imagine others are feeling a similar way, so when you come in hot like you did here, you can’t be surprised that people aren’t willing to engage right now.

I don’t want to have an anything. I’m just making posts. I don’t care if no one engages with me? I’m not shouting or telling everyone they must listen to me or converse with me.

But I care if I’m told I shouldn’t be making the posts I have done, or that they are not ok to make and that im being an insensitive troll. I’m not surprised is no one wants to engage, I’m surprised I’m not allowed to post what I want.

[goldengirlz]

Oct 15, 2023 7:50:31 GMT -5 @iceblink said:

I don’t feel comfortable speaking out on the situation with my Jewish family and never have and none of them are saying anything either (besides my husband who we have the same feelings). I hoped I had found a space to speak here but it seems there isn’t space for it.

I think this part speaks volumes. Maybe reflect on why you can’t talk to Jewish people (and they can’t talk to you) IRL.

What I’m hearing is that you’re using this space to say the things you would never feel comfortable saying to an actual Jewish person in the flesh. Maybe that’s why your delivery is not going over that well, to put it mildly.

Also, nice working in the Jewish family card! Nothing says “I’m not a bigot” like letting everyone know you have friends and family in the affected group.

[pixy0stix]

Oct 15, 2023 10:03:19 GMT -5 @iceblink said:

Oct 15, 2023 9:35:25 GMT -5 erbear said:

I think what you’re missing is that you want to have an intellectual conversation (debate? argument?) about something that is deeply emotional for some of us. I, for one, am not in a place for that, and I imagine others are feeling a similar way, so when you come in hot like you did here, you can’t be surprised that people aren’t willing to engage right now.

I don’t want to have an anything. I’m just making posts. I don’t care if no one engages with me? I’m not shouting or telling everyone they must listen to me or converse with me.

But I care if I’m told I shouldn’t be making the posts I have done, or that they are not ok to make and that im being an insensitive troll. I’m not surprised is no one wants to engage, I’m surprised I’m not allowed to post what I want.

Unsure who you think is restricting you. As with most things, there's always consequences to what you (general) post. Also, per a previous comment, your initial posts did not read as respectful.

[Deleted]

Oct 15, 2023 10:37:36 GMT -5 goldengirlz said:

Oct 15, 2023 7:50:31 GMT -5 @iceblink said:

I don’t feel comfortable speaking out on the situation with my Jewish family and never have and none of them are saying anything either (besides my husband who we have the same feelings). I hoped I had found a space to speak here but it seems there isn’t space for it.

I think this part speaks volumes. Maybe reflect on why you can’t talk to Jewish people (and they can’t talk to you) IRL.

What I’m hearing is that you’re using this space to say the things you would never feel comfortable saying to an actual Jewish person in the flesh. Maybe that’s why your delivery is not going over that well, to put it mildly.

Also, nice working in the Jewish family card! Nothing says “I’m not a bigot” like letting everyone know you have friends and family in the affected group.

Lol honestly this place is pathetic.

The uncomfortableness is a sentiment I’m hearing from a lot of people online. And not it’s not a reflection on them it’s because straight out the bat you’re called a bigot. That’s insane, what the actual fuck?

I’m a bigot because I’m saddened that a government is committing genocide right this moment, and it’s being paid for and supported by my own government. That is not bigoted.

Like no fucking shit terrorism is bad, who doesn’t know that? Who is questioning that terrorist commiting murder is a horrific occurrence. Everyone is well aware. But the silence in the murder of the people of Gaza is deafening.

Fuck this place.

[aurora]

This board is absolutely not silent about the murder of innocent Palestinians in Gaza. Are you skipping all of the posts about that, like the whole other thread?

The vast majority of posts here have sympathized with innocent people being killed and facing terrible fears on both sides.

[AJL]

Oct 15, 2023 10:45:29 GMT -5 @iceblink said:

Oct 15, 2023 10:37:36 GMT -5 goldengirlz said:

I think this part speaks volumes. Maybe reflect on why you can’t talk to Jewish people (and they can’t talk to you) IRL.

What I’m hearing is that you’re using this space to say the things you would never feel comfortable saying to an actual Jewish person in the flesh. Maybe that’s why your delivery is not going over that well, to put it mildly.

Also, nice working in the Jewish family card! Nothing says “I’m not a bigot” like letting everyone know you have friends and family in the affected group.

Lol honestly this place is pathetic.

The uncomfortableness is a sentiment I’m hearing from a lot of people online. And not it’s not a reflection on them it’s because straight out the bat you’re called a bigot. That’s insane, what the actual fuck?

I’m a bigot because I’m saddened that a government is committing genocide right this moment, and it’s being paid for and supported by my own government. That is not bigoted.

Like no fucking shit terrorism is bad, who doesn’t know that? Who is questioning that terrorist commiting murder is a horrific occurrence. Everyone is well aware. But the silence in the murder of the people of Gaza is deafening.

Fuck this place.

You are free to exit this board at any time. 

[konapoppy]

A reminder that you can block members for your own sanity.

[origami]

Like no fucking shit terrorism is bad, who doesn’t know that?

You, maybe? Did you actually condemn Hamas before or after you called an accurate but pro-Israel take “insane”? I must have missed it during your barrage of posts calling out Israel for genocide

[AJL]

I hear the term "genocide" a lot when it comes to Israel and Palestinians. Genocide is a very specific term that a) requires deliberate intent and b) is for very specific reasons related to immutable features of a population such as religion, race, or ethnicity. 

Israel's intent is not to kill Palestinians wantonly. It is not to kill Palestinian civilians at all if it can be avoided. What we know is that it can't be avoided unless there is no bombing whatsoever of the occupied territories (which I think is what we all want. No bombing.) Those of us who support Israel do not want civilians killed at all. I honestly don't want anyone killed, not even Hamas. I want Hamas combatants captured so that can't hurt anyone anymore. 

But that is not how war works. This is a war. It is a tragedy and a shanda, but it is what is happening. It is not a genocide. Israel has not sought out to destroy Palestinians because they are Palestinian or Muslim or of any number of Arab ethnicities. Israel is trying to destroy an enemy combatant: Hamas. Hamas is embedded in Gaza among the innocent, and Israel is acting in defense of its people. 

Israel has not declared death to Islam or death to Palestinians or death to Arabs and yet the original Hamas charter and the revision in 2017 both declare such things about Israel and Jews. Hamas has shown no interest in a truce with Israel. It is intent on destruction. And though I have said it over and over and over that Hamas is not Palestine, Hamas is putting Palestinians directly in harms way. 

I want the bombings to stop. I want Palestinian children and women and elderly and men to live in peace on their land. I also want Jews to have the same. And so until that is able to happen, then there will be an impasse and Israel, the people, will continue to defend itself as it has for centuries. 

[pixy0stix]

Completely sealing off a territory and not allowing civilians to leave, including foreign nationals in the area, is not a modern wartime tactic. Blinken's messaging is changing to calling for the protection of civilians - www.cbsnews.com/news/antony-blinken-calls-for-protecting-civilians-as-israel-readies-an-expected-assault-on-gaza/

The majority of humanitarian aid orgs in the area have been sounding the alarm loud and clear that this is not normal "wartime" activity. ETA Doctors Without Borders statement: www.doctorswithoutborders.org/latest/msf-calls-israel-show-humanity

UN Statement: news.un.org/en/story/2023/10/1142347

WHO statement: www.emro.who.int/media/news/evacuation-orders-by-israel-to-hospitals-in-northern-gaza-are-a-death-sentence-for-the-sick-and-injured.html

Israel has been using tactics such as leveling entire neighborhoods, which is not the usual tactic in dealing with terrorists. Per the article 3 days ago 423,000 people have had their homes destroyed - apnews.com/article/israel-palestinians-gaza-hamas-airstrikes-cabinet-beb1fa2b9e4ede6cf4568dd6c86ff11a

If we split hairs and not call it genocide, then it also is not regular wartime activities. Civilians are specifically being targeted.

[fryjack2]

Every time I share Palestinian history or experiences, it’s overshadowed and feels (to me) like it’s being negated by people sharing the history of Jewish people and their struggles. I speak as a Palestinian reading.

And the Dms I have on here, and in real life that extend support but admit they are too afraid to publicly extend it speaks to the attempt at silencing us Palestinians feel.

I truly believe everyone posting here (except marlenabell who wrote that Palestine lives don’t matter. That was a dagger to the heart for me and was what prompted me to stop posting) is pretty much on the same page about being horrified by the actions of Hamas and th current actions in Gaza but our words sometimes come out not as we intend them to. Or emotions are embedded in our words and even if they aren’t intended to cause hurt, they are painful for others who read them.

I don’t want to cause more hurt to anyone here who is hurting. There is enough of that going on right now.

pixie. I appreciate your comments in these threads. Especially the last one with humanitarian aid organization’s statements.

[bronxgirl]

I hope this doesn’t sound like a “can’t we all get along” platitude, but what always strikes me when reviewing the history of Jews and Palestinians, as well as lived experiences of Jewish and Palestinian civilians both currently and historically, is how much we both have in common. The trauma that fryjack2 has shared that her family experienced is sadly a very common experience for countless numbers of Palestinians and it mirrors the trauma that countless numbers of Jews have experienced over time. fryjack2 also mentioned earlier fearing fearful for her children’s safety, something else which is a very present fear for Palestinians and Jews throughout the diaspora. I don’t know what the solution is and when people feel scared and anxious and desperate it’s hard to see the other side’s perspective and humanity. I have no solutions to offer and I feel pretty hopeless about the situation overall, but one thing I can do myself is make a conscious decision to pause my anger to recognize the humanity and pain and pray for peace.

[Bad Dingo]

I absolutely did not write that Palestinian lives don't matter. I do not feel that way and I'm sorry that something I wrote was interpreted that way.

[fryjack2]

Oct 15, 2023 16:59:46 GMT -5 Bad Dingo said:

I absolutely did not write that Palestinian lives don't matter. I do not feel that way and I'm sorry that something I wrote was interpreted that way.

Oh my gosh!! I am so so sorry. It wasn’t you. It was Marlenabell.

I’m so so sorry.

[Bad Dingo]

Don't worry about it. This is an extra scary and sad time, we are all stressed and not ourselves. So many hugs to everyone who is suffering.

[basilosaurus]

Did anyone catch the intro to John Oliver? I think it was well done. Compassionate and balanced