Post by Velar Fricative on Aug 20, 2014 10:15:21 GMT -5
I don't think your DH is crazy necessarily, but $30K a year (to me at least) is a LOT. That would absolutely affect our future family planning, ability to pay for college, etc. Hell, we just wouldn't even have the money to pay that, so it would affect our family's livelihoods *now*, so forget about the future lol.
Education is important to me but I feel that a motivated kid with parents who do their best to be involved in their child's schooling is going to be fine no matter what. I'm not saying that means send your DS to a terrible school, but I'd be far more inclined to aim for the better public education opportunities and then opt for private school if the public school options that are satisfactory to you are not available.
We're in a similar situation, with the roles reversed. The elementary school closest to us reopens in a few weeks after a huge remodel, and is looking very promising (great principal, programs, etc.), but as of right now the boundaries put us at a different school (we miss "good school" by literally a block). Boundaries change, wavers happen, etc., so I'm trying not to stress yet, but I definitely am leaning toward private school if E can't attend "good school." H is on the fence.
I will say that in our case, the private elementaries I'm interested in are ~$10-14k a year, and we would likely utilize YMCA after-school care, so the total annual cost would be more like $20k.
I don't necessarily disagree with your DH either, but I also would not be able to afford $30k for ELEMENTARY school. We're concerned enough about college as it is. Whatever $$ we have needs to go towards that.
I live in an area w/ a LOT of private schools, but it also has great public schools. So we're lucky on that front. But being surrounded by so many people who went to private, DH and I are both starting to think "well... maybe for high school?"
But then I remind myself - THIS is why we moved to this area. Good public schools!! It's the same area where I grew up and went to school!
I think if you stress education, support your child, show interest - that will do a lot to fuel your child's desire to do well and hopefully end up at the good public schools.
We live in a major city where the schools are mostly bad but there are some awesome exceptions for G&T kids. Our plan is to get our oldest tested to see if he qualifies for the G&T lottery. If he doesn't, we'll move to the suburbs. We may move to the burbs before then anyway. I won't even consider private schools. I know too many people who attended private schools and have done nothing with their lives to make me feel like it's worth it. I hope my kids will be happy and contributing members of society. But I'm not going to wager $30K a year on it. College is a different story. That I am willing to spend $$$ on for private schools because I think it's worth it.
We're taking a try it and see approach. Our public schools are good, though classroom size is very large. If K or first grade doesn't go well we'll go parochial or private and while we'll be more limited in our choices I still think we can find something. I love my kid deeply but I can't really justify $20K-$30K a year if public school is viable alternative. Even with public school out year round childcare costs will be ~11K with camp and after school.
We have to children to consider as well. If I only had one I might be making very difference choices.
No way could I stomach that bill for private school. I'd plan on being very generous with sports, activities, and tutors (if needed) and go public. I'm not from a place where private school is valued, though. I don't believe there even is one in my city of 250K people.
$30K is a lot of money. I would be leaning toward public schools/magnets/g&t.
And I agree with you. I went to private school (not a fancy $20K a year school; it was around $20K for 4 of us kids about 15 years ago). In retrospect, it was a lot of upper-middle-class kids whose parents were keeping them out of some poor public school districts. I probably got a better academic education than if I had gone to the local public school, but I also think it puts you out of touch with reality. You end up with friends from a small pool of people who are a lot like you, and have families a lot like yours, and similar incomes...it's a very small way to view the world. (I feel bad typing this because I know my parents were choosing what they thought was best, and we did get an excellent education, but it also warps your view of what's "normal".)
Post by lurknomore on Aug 20, 2014 10:26:03 GMT -5
IMO, which may not mean squat, I'm in favor of public at this point. Having taught at a private boarding school, the consensus among the teachers there was that the education wasn't that much better, but you were able to make it so that kids didn't slip through the cracks. We were expected, and did, bend over backwards to help kids with LD, social issues, etc. who would have not received such attention in public school. Classes were smaller, so we were able to do a lot of things that public schools couldn't. Obv, at 18 mo you aren't going to know if your kid has learning differences, etc such that private school will be helpful down the road. We have a similar set up here. The public schools are ok but are great if you're in the advanced classes. We are starting our girls in public school and they will stay there at least through elementary. There are lots of private schools here that don't start until high school, which obv opens them up at a later time. And there are always spots open (esp if you're paying full price out of pocket with no aid...) even though they may be harder to come by. We will visit the private school discussion when we know we may need it (kid who needs extra help, who is super ambitious, or we decide through our experience, not the state's grading and experiences of others) that one of the kids need it. There is no way I would put private school though over having more kids, over doing the things our family wants to do, etc. unless the schools where I lived were terrible. And we chose our town based in large part on making sure that wasn't the case.
I also think nature and parental involvement and enrichment activities (which we'd have money for if he goes to public) school can make up any gap. TIA!
Non-mom here who's interested in this thread re: my possible future predicament. I found myself physically nodding to this point, & think that it's a very important argument for your position.
I agree with you. $30k/yr? I'm sorry, but I'm not sacrificing that much for my child *just* for education. Education is important-but a lot of education comes from involved parents who care about their child's education, progress, etc. I am not willing to sacrifice my happiness (vacations, career change, etc.) for education.
Post by carolinagirl831 on Aug 20, 2014 10:30:01 GMT -5
I am for private schools, having gone to them K-12, BUT my private school tuition was 6K a year, not 20! 20-30-K a year is more than my Big 10 education cost! Soo yeah I'm kinda of with you. I think you need to have a serious discussion if this really will impact your ability to have a second child and maintain your lifestyle. Could he really not go to public for grade school and then try private for HS? Surely, there are other kids that do this.
Our town has good public schools but some of the schools in our county are less good. I am concerned though mainly about the lack of diversity in our public schools here (I think the HS is 8% minority - total - AA, asian, hispanic. Thats a really small percentage).
So our current options are somewhat similar to yours (for our 2 year old, lol): send to public school and give it a shot; send to a good private now and just commit ourselves to that for the next 12 years, or send to public for elementary school and maybe middle, knowing we could go private for HS if we had to. We also have the option of moving one county over, which has much better schools (but also overall is a higher socioeconomic class, so then you have a different battle on your hands).
Our current plan is try to the public school. We don't have the issue with the lottery etc that you have, so that would make me pause a bit more, but I figure I may be pleasantly surprised by the public school (like I said, ours are good but I'm worried about the lack of diversity and I also worry a bit they may teach creationism...) so nothing ventured, nothing gained.
I wouldnt' want to get bogged down in 20k a year plus the other costs involved just because you don't think he'll get into a good public school. so basically I'm team you.
Are there other private school options that are cheaper? Here we have the private schools and the catholic schools, and while catholic schools arent cheap, they are a lot cheaper than the private. so that could be an option if the public schools really do stink?
I will say I went to one of the worst schools in the country and am a pretty darn successful attorney who didn't go top 10 but did go top 25 for law schools, and on paper have a better career than most of my fancy elementary - high school friends. Based on my experiences, I just can't limit my family size or commit that kind of money to have the best of the best for elementary school.
Post by carolinagirl831 on Aug 20, 2014 10:31:58 GMT -5
DH and I have been talking about this alot because we both went to private school k-12, however we live next to good public schools and I think i'd rather save all that money towards college, as that will seriously impact our lifestyle. I love traveling and that would impact it alot. I think travel, activities and experiences are an important form of education too, not just formal schooling.
This isn't necessarily worth $20k+ a year to me, LOL, but another "pro" for private schools in my mind is the later middle/high school start times. I absolutely believe that teens are not meant to be in class, ready to learn at 7:15 AM, but that's when my public high school started. My high school boyfriend, OTOH, went to a private school that started around 8:45. That is a huge difference! Since thus far public school districts do not seem to be responding to the mounting research showing that circadian rhythms dictate an earlier elementary start time and a later middle/HS time (e.g., swap the start times...), the difference between private and public is definitely important to me.
This is s constant battle for DH and I. Texas school systems are one of the worst. But to me I would rather invest in a good college then spend a shit ton on grade school or high school. We go round and round. Currently we trying out a Montessori private school/daycare because getting DD into preK is not a option. Next year I am pushing for public school.
Reading through the replies what strikes me is that if he goes to a private school he will learn in a smaller world -- fairly homogeneous group of students, limited ability to travel as a family, no siblings etc. Whereas if he goes to public he will learn in a bigger world -- presumably more diverse student body, family travel, possible siblings, etc. I *think* I would opt for the latter. All that said, as a publicly educated person, I've always wondered about the connections people make in a fancy private school and the opportunities that offers to them later in life.
We chose to do private school for ds, starting in pre-k (which is 4, although his school has a 3 year old program, although that is not considered pre-k). I know at his school they have 1 3 year old class, 3 pre-k, 4 kindergarten. So you could still get in at the K level if you don't start in pre-k, but it is easier to get in at the pre-k level for sure.
I would check to see if the schools have after school programs, which would lower the cost of what you are assuming a babysitter would cost. Most schools offer after care along with enrichment classes (ballet, soccer, golf, science, etc).
I went to public school and it was a great experience. But now, for us, we decided that other things are worth private school. More outside time. Less standardized testing. And based on what my friends kids are learning in the same grade at the public school I am positive our school is teaching at a higher level.
Now that we are in first it is close about $18k a year. In pre-k, with a half day, it was less, and in K it was less.
OK, one last thought: as of right now, we have no desire to move to the suburbs. I have done some initial research and discovered that by the time we pay the higher property taxes and deal with longer commutes that require driving, plus increased driving for errands that are currently walkable from us, the difference between the cost of living in a "good" public school district and sending E to private school is not huge.
OK, one last thought: as of right now, we have no desire to move to the suburbs. I have done some initial research and discovered that by the time we pay the higher property taxes and deal with longer commutes that require driving, plus increased driving for errands that are currently walkable from us, the difference between the cost of living in a "good" public school district and sending E to private school is not huge.
HISD makes this a tricky call for me, because I agree with all your sentiments about the district.
Personally, I would probably do the private pre-k and then decide from there. You'll get a good look at the private school, won't have to worry about missing a spot for kindergarten but will still have the wiggle room to really look into the public options in the area. That also gives you time to check out any suburb school districts you might be interested in moving to. John Cooper could be worth looking at. If you guys have a serious interest in going back overseas at some point, that would edge me to a private international school for continuity.
I'm 'eh' on private schools unless they're really, really academically intense and not religious. I agree with your points that nature and parental involvement and enrichment activities could more than fill the gap if he went to public, especially at the elementary age.
I definitely think there should be a "within reason" caveat. No question. Education is important no doubt. But YOUR life is important too. You only get one shot at this, kwim? Personally, I wouldn't do it if I had to sacrifice little luxuries like nice dinners out, weekends away, vacations, shopping, expensive extracurriculars, sleep away camp, etc. I wouldn't want to do it if it meant money would be tight. And definitely NOT if it meant giving up the idea of having another child.
I can completely see the appeal if a wait and see approach. Try public school first and see how he fares. Or do you guys have any interest in moving? Maybe you could move to a district with top notch public schools? Then the decision becomes relatively easy to make.
our public school are so-so, and our private schools aren't that expensive, but we've already agreed to go public and supplement with family experiences. our private schools are currently $10-12k/year x 2 kids... thats a lot of stuff we can do as a family or money for extra classes, etc.
but then again, i'm 100% okay with my kid(s) forgoing college in favour of a trade or some other certification. i care way less about education and way more about work ethic and ambition. i realize education is incredibly important to some families though so my option may not mean much here.
We had a similar discussion/debate last year and decided that we will send DS to the public elementary and go from there. However, we did buy our house in a school district specifically for the great elementary school. Otherwise, we would not feel as comfortable. IMO, at this level, parental involvement can supplement what your kid learns in the classroom and will be just as good as any private school. I think private school matters more as you get into middle and high schools and we plan to re-evaluate then.
Also, I know that these schools tell you that it's harder to get in after Pre-K and K since classes are alreaduy full. To the general public, yes this is correct but you can find many ways to get your kid into the fancy school should you decide to enroll your child later on. I've known many families with multiple kids who had to move out of state and still get into the fancy private schools in non entrance years, like 7th grade and 10th grade, etc. These schools are all about who you know. If your child is a legacy, then even easier.
I agree with @choco. And I'm not usually a fan of charter schools, but would you consider one if there was an excellent charter option?
Are the schools in your area actually bad schools, or are they just average? Is there a special program that you are looking for?
I'm going to try to get PSB into the public Montessori program in pre-K. There is a small fee for pre-k, but it is free for K-12. It is difficult to get into through the lottery, but I'm hoping she gets in and if she doesn't that she gets into one of the foreign language immersion programs. If not, our neighborhood school is really good or she will attend the Spanish immersion program in the county I teach in.
Curious-why not usually a fan of charter schools? I've been eyeing the one going up close to where we are and am very curious to see how it does before DS gets to K.
Also, I do think it's important to factor in your overall quality of life and your ambitions with/without the private school tuition. L should get the best education that will also provide him the best opportunities outside of the classroom as well as happy parents. It's all about balance, and I think your H is seeing this a little one dimensional.
Oh and also - don't forget to factor in things like tuition increases and donations. If it's 30k/yr now, it'll probably be more like 40k by the time he is through high school.
Plus, if he makes friends with a wealthy crowd, will you be able to fund school break trips and the like? Just something to think about. You don't want to feel like the "poor kid" or the odd one out.
Post by leonard131 on Aug 20, 2014 10:57:29 GMT -5
Are you sure it is 20K starting at K? I know you probably are but our research on school around here indicates elementary is less expensive then upper school. Still, I do get the other associated costs but regardless of what school you choose you will have those fixed costs.
I am a huge public school believer but I also don't want to be a "pioneer parent" and have to be the one to have to push and push to make the school a fit for my child and still run the risk he won't get the tools and education he needs. I am not a teacher and I know I don't have the skills to supplement. I see this a lot in the DC area. M will have go to private school. We knew this before we had a child and has factored into our financial decisions. I also know H and I will need to stay at the income we are at now and couldn't afford another. All of these are not issues as I like my job and only want one.
I would be inclined to go the private school route given you have indicated there is no gurantee that he would be able to go a applicable public school.