I believe Shia LaBeouf – a person doesn’t have to be likable

[wawa]

So...I suspect this is not something I can safely google at work. what exactly WAS this IAMSORRY performance that it somehow would have "lead to rape."

[madisen]

I haven't read anywhere that the collaborators confirmed he was raped. They stated something happened that led to them going in and asking a woman, presumably her, leave but it was unsure at the time what had happened and they didn't elaborate from there.

[ringstrue]

How horrible. Was this 100% private or were people watching the room or was it video taped? Why didn't someone stop her?

[laurenpetro]

i hate performance art.

[josieposy]

OMG that is horrible!

[hopecounts]

Dec 3, 2014 9:53:50 GMT -5 @soudesafinado said:

I hope this doesn't come across as victim blaming but why was he so committed to this performance art thing that he didn't stop this woman?

See Catlawdy 's comment about mental illness.
I believe he isn't mentally healthy and that interfered with his ability to advocate for himself in the moment it was happening.

[hereigo]

[hopecounts]

Dec 3, 2014 10:00:29 GMT -5 @majorwife said:

Dec 3, 2014 9:57:34 GMT -5 Catlawdy said:

I'm not being facetious when I say I think the reason is b/c this guy is seriously mentally ill. 

i think that is a little much.

this is not the first performance art that the artist didn't stop when participants tried to hurt them.

as for why? IDK. im not an artist. i dont understand a lot of it.

if he didn't have a history outside of this that indicates mental health issues I'd agree but given the evidence outside of this I think his mental health almost certainly played into it.

[wawa]

Dec 3, 2014 9:53:50 GMT -5 @soudesafinado said:

I hope this doesn't come across as victim blaming but why was he so committed to this performance art thing that he didn't stop this woman?

because, mental illness aside, people who do performance art are fucking weird.  I mean, why was he sitting in a room with a bag over his head having people come in to interact with him in the first place?  Obviously this form of expression was something he felt strongly about - so I'm assuming he felt strongly enough to persevere with the performance despite this woman's actions.

I have no explanation for doing the piece in the first place, so I can't really comprehend carrying on with it - but people do. 

We had a guy who dressed as a lobster and lived in a treehouse on my college campus as a performance piece.  A group of frat guys beat the shit out of him, but he kept on with it.  Carrying on despite assault/pain/threat isn't really that out of the norm for people into this sort of art.

[foundmylazybum]

I don't question that it happened, I only question the circumstances.

Like, there were hundreds of people in line and only one person gets to come in at once--and the lady was in the room alone with him for at least 10 min?


That's just poor planning on the exhibition's part. It's such poor planning that it makes me question the logistics of HOW this happened.

[josieposy]

Does the venue have any liability in this?

[gottadobe]

Dec 3, 2014 10:02:46 GMT -5 @soudesafinado said:

And also, if the premise of the performance art was that people could do ANYTHING they wanted to him and this is what she wanted to do...and he didn't stop her...is it rape?

I'm just wondering here, again, I don't mean to victim blame.

I guess we'd have to use the "reasonable person" defense.  Would a reasonable person expect to be raped when saying "I'm sitting in a box, come in and feel free to do whatever you want".

And, also, there are situations in which consent cannot be given, e.g. passed out drunk.

I guess what I am uncomfortable with is the idea that we are supposed to side with alleged victims at the mere mention of rape without the alleged rapists getting their day in court.  I'm not talking about the most recent cases, just in general.

[sugarglider]

Dec 3, 2014 10:02:46 GMT -5 @soudesafinado said:

And also, if the premise of the performance art was that people could do ANYTHING they wanted to him and this is what she wanted to do...and he didn't stop her...is it rape?

I'm just wondering here, again, I don't mean to victim blame.

I think consent is always a tricky issue in rape cases, in part because of the dispute between whether the victim had to say "no" or just not say "yes" (whether through words or actions).

Here, though, the argument would be that he DID say yes, by consenting to let strangers do ANYTHING they wanted with him. So, did he affirmatively consent?

[kadams767]

Dec 3, 2014 10:08:45 GMT -5 @majorwife said:

i guess i am not comfortable labeling his behavior as mental illness.

from what i understand his parents were fucking weird and raised him that way. do we call lena dunham mentally ill or do you have to have run-ins with the law for that to be considered?

maybe i am too much of a shia apologist. lol

And maybe I am too much of an asshole, but I don't think it's a stretch to suggest that Lena Dunham is also mentally ill in some manner.  The excerpts from her book that I've seen posted online are kind of frightening.

[wawa]

Dec 3, 2014 11:07:03 GMT -5 asdfjkl said:

At this point, can I have the like I'm 5 on Shia. I know nothing about him and his decline.

His name means the beef.
He was in transformers.
And then he started wearing a paper bag on his head in public.  (and apparently during performance art)

This is all I know.

[meshaliuknits]

Is Shia LaBouf the dude who keeps plagiarizing things?

[pixy0stix]

Dec 3, 2014 11:07:03 GMT -5 asdfjkl said:

At this point, can I have the like I'm 5 on Shia. I know nothing about him and his decline.

He blatantly plagiarized a work from another artist. When he was caught, he went into this downward spiral of #IAMSORRY. In an effort to prove just how sorry he is, he's put a bag over his head, and this performance artwork.

At this point I'm teetering on "He's a giant fucking asshole who is not sorry, but is trying to capitalize on this to further his fame" and "OMG he finally fell off the edge of insanity."

[MrsAxilla]

Dec 3, 2014 11:08:35 GMT -5 wawa said:

Dec 3, 2014 11:07:03 GMT -5 asdfjkl said:

At this point, can I have the like I'm 5 on Shia. I know nothing about him and his decline.

His name means the beef.
He was in transformers.
And then he started wearing a paper bag on his head in public.  (and apparently during performance art)

This is all I know.

He was Indiana Jones and the Crystal Skulls.  That's the only reason he's on my radar.

[foundmylazybum]

Dec 3, 2014 11:07:03 GMT -5 asdfjkl said:

At this point, can I have the like I'm 5 on Shia. I know nothing about him and his decline.

He was in the movie "holes" which was actually really good and really cute.

I think he was also on a Disney show.

He was in Indiana Jones and the Crystal Skull.

He's been in other movies too like Transformers and a movie with Michael Douglas where he was an investment banker.

He got busted for drunk driving and I'm pretty sure the car he was driving was a Saturn lol.

[pixy0stix]

ALSO, it should be noted that MW has the hots for him. Which is why she knows all the movies he's been in.

[jeaniebueller]

Dec 3, 2014 11:11:26 GMT -5 @soudesafinado said:

Dec 3, 2014 11:08:35 GMT -5 wawa said:

His name means the beef.
He was in transformers.
And then he started wearing a paper bag on his head in public.  (and apparently during performance art)

This is all I know.

He started out on Project Greenlight. That's when I first was introduced to him. He was a curly headed precocious kid who wanted to be an actor. He had an odd mom. 

The Battle of Shaker Heights. I kind of remember the director being kind of a douche. Don't ask why I remember that. What ever happened to Project Greenlight, anyway?

[msmerymac]

Dec 3, 2014 11:09:55 GMT -5 meshaliuknits said:

Is Shia LaBouf the dude who keeps plagiarizing things?

That's Rand Paul. 

Just kidding, it's also Shia. Shia has also had some DUIs and weird shit going on.

[msmerymac]

Dec 3, 2014 10:29:37 GMT -5 gottadobe said:

Dec 3, 2014 10:02:46 GMT -5 @soudesafinado said:

And also, if the premise of the performance art was that people could do ANYTHING they wanted to him and this is what she wanted to do...and he didn't stop her...is it rape?

I'm just wondering here, again, I don't mean to victim blame.

I guess we'd have to use the "reasonable person" defense.  Would a reasonable person expect to be raped when saying "I'm sitting in a box, come in and feel free to do whatever you want".

And, also, there are situations in which consent cannot be given, e.g. passed out drunk.

I guess what I am uncomfortable with is the idea that we are supposed to side with alleged victims at the mere mention of rape without the alleged rapists getting their day in court.  I'm not talking about the most recent cases, just in general.

Why? Especially in a case like this where the rapist's name is never mentioned, or possibly even known? I guess I don't understand why, taking this case as an example, Shia's possible pain and victimization is equivalent to the emotional state of the faceless woman who may or may not have raped him?

[pixy0stix]

Dec 3, 2014 11:45:56 GMT -5 @lcap said:

Dec 3, 2014 11:38:14 GMT -5 toledo said:

Also, why would a bunch of people stand around if they thought someone was being raped? 

Bystander effect

[pixy0stix]

Dec 3, 2014 11:49:53 GMT -5 @lcap said:

Dec 3, 2014 11:47:53 GMT -5 pixy0stix said:

Bystander effect

What about the people running the exhibit? What about his entourage? His "handlers"? No one thought to tell her to gtfo? Or call the police? I'm not saying it didn't happen. I'm saying the reports that have been issued are missing a lot of pertinent details that would make it make more sense.

They were probably waiting for him to confirm what happened, but he was so deep into his role of "performance art" that he didn't say anything. Even after his girlfriend asked.

[rosiedozie]

Dec 3, 2014 11:26:02 GMT -5 pixy0stix said:

ALSO, it should be noted that MW has the hots for him. Which is why she knows all the movies he's been in.

I do, too. 


It started to wane when he went off the deep end, but then I saw this interview on Jimmy Kimmel in October and he seems to be his same charming self. 

[laurenpetro]

Dec 3, 2014 11:27:30 GMT -5 jeaniebueller said:

Dec 3, 2014 11:11:26 GMT -5 @soudesafinado said:

He started out on Project Greenlight. That's when I first was introduced to him. He was a curly headed precocious kid who wanted to be an actor. He had an odd mom. 

The Battle of Shaker Heights. I kind of remember the director being kind of a douche. Don't ask why I remember that. What ever happened to Project Greenlight, anyway?

i'm pretty sure they're doing a new one now.

[ajj]

This topic is admittedly upsetting me. I'm just going to say, rape doesn't make sense. I will never understand why someone would do that to another person. I will also never understand why a person who has been raped gets so many questions and basically put on trial, even in the most obvious of cases.

[rosiedozie]

Dec 3, 2014 11:56:08 GMT -5 Dig Ophelia said:

Dec 3, 2014 11:51:03 GMT -5 @lcap said:

Then who are these people who are able to confirm that he was raped? Either they saw it or heard it happening. Why didn't they go in there and stop it? Would most people just stand around idly with their heads up their ass? This story is insane.

As with other forms of assault, a lot of people do, yes. 

Especially the assault of a man by a woman. 

[heyjude]

I think lying about rape is like voter fraud. Sure it happens but on such a small scale. Thus if someone claims they were raped I give them the benefit of the doubt until I hear otherwise.

But like MW, I also have the hots for Shia....