Yeah, it never would have occurred to me to say that to someone.
On 9/11/01 my family and I went to eat at an Afghan restaurant in our area to show our support for the idea that not all brown people are terrorists - because it was pretty apparent that that was going to me our next National past-time. There were other people there doing the same thing. Our waitress actually cried she was so touched. I don't think it's that weird. I think when there are crimes or events that appear to divide people along racial or ethnic lines, it's a nice gesture to reach out and say, "I'm not part of this."
Going out to eat at a business is a lot different than randomly offering sympathy to a guy at the gas station.
Yeah, I don't understand how compassion is a bad thing - even if the guy was offended, he would still know it came from the right place. Its a bit weird to just randomly offer condolences, but then, its a bit weird to randomly try to save peoples souls, or believe in scientology, or wear a cowboy hat to a supermarket, or think monster trucks are cool, or really care about football, or many many other things, depending on where you stand.
If you want to pride yourself on being socially awkward, more power to you.
I would say that those who would be offended, weirded out or angered by a stranger expressing sympathy and support are the socially awkward ones. You all are just pulling your opinions out of thin air - I actually had the experience of the guy being concerned once hearing the news, and reading quotes from prominent Sikhs about appreciating the outpouring of support from strangers and how this tragedy affects Sikhs everywhere.
You don't see any measure of how this could be stereotyping at all?
No, I don't. He was clearly Sikh, and given that Sikhs have a history of being targeted, and this was the worst case, I thought it was pretty same to assume (which seems to be backed up by his reaction and the quotes in the news from Sikhs) that most Sikhs would be saddened by this tragedy, and would appreciate a kind word from someone acknowleging this tragedy and saying it's awful.
If you want to pride yourself on being socially awkward, more power to you.
I would say that those who would be offended, weirded out or angered by a stranger expressing sympathy and support are the socially awkward ones. <b> You all are just pulling your opinions out of thin air - I actually had the experience </b> of the guy being concerned once hearing the news, and reading quotes from prominent Sikhs about appreciating the outpouring of support from strangers and how this tragedy affects Sikhs everywhere.
Compassion isn't a bad thing but coming on to share how you offered it is weird. And the bolded is totally "you don't know my life" material.
I would say that those who would be offended, weirded out or angered by a stranger expressing sympathy and support are the socially awkward ones. <b> You all are just pulling your opinions out of thin air - I actually had the experience </b> of the guy being concerned once hearing the news, and reading quotes from prominent Sikhs about appreciating the outpouring of support from strangers and how this tragedy affects Sikhs everywhere.
Compassion isn't a bad thing but coming on to share how you offered it is weird. And the bolded is totally "you don't know my life" material.
I shared the experience because I felt bad that he didn't know and the news clearly upset him, and that what I meant to be a nice gesture likely resulted in him being upset for the rest of the evening. I didn't share it to say "wow, I am such a wonderful person".
And what you tried to bold isn't "you don't know my life", it's saying that I actually had the experience and my intentions are backed up by real Sikhs commenting in the news, whereas the rest of you are basically making up this offense.
So I'm a mean girl? I didn't call anyone names; I just don't agree with you.
You know what, I apologize to you. Many times you are a mean girl on here so I read your posts with that frame of mind. However I just re-read your responses, and you are correct, you just disagreed and you weren't offensive. However, some of your comments were still very strange re: pushing boundaries and potentially angering someone by expressing concern.
Yeah, I don't understand how compassion is a bad thing - even if the guy was offended, he would still know it came from the right place. Its a bit weird to just randomly offer condolences, but then, its a bit weird to randomly try to save peoples souls, or believe in scientology, or wear a cowboy hat to a supermarket, or think monster trucks are cool, or really care about football, or many many other things, depending on where you stand.
You had me, till you got to the Cowboy hat part. Nothing random about that.
Check out my facebook picture. He wears it always. Has a summer and a winter one.
I was in Europe on 9/11, and I had tons of people go up to me on the street and in bars & restaurants to offer their sympathy and compassion to me as an american. I actually was totally touched and found it to be really nice. I was with a group of other american students and we had people buying us free beer, approaching us on the street, etc. I was studying abroad at the time.
It's clearly perceived here as 'weird' of you to say this to him. That can be understandably brushed aside as just an unpopular choice. I think what makes it stand out is the perception of your bragplainty post here. As if you wanted us to see your compassion - and such an action generally negates whatever compassion there may have been. Trying to pat yourself on the back for being 'nice'.
I think it's pretty safe to assume most people of any group would be saddened by yet another act of violence perpetrated against members of their group just because of who they are. And this man was very saddened to hear of the attack.
I apologize. You are right, casmgn. Please let me be the first to express my condolences that an act of violence was perpetrated against members of your group yesterday when a gunman shot at people in a Sikh temple in Wisconsin.
It's clearly perceived here as 'weird' of you to say this to him. That can be understandably brushed aside as just an unpopular choice. I think what makes it stand out is the perception of your bragplainty post here. As if you wanted us to see your compassion - and such an action generally negates whatever compassion there may have been. Trying to pat yourself on the back for being 'nice'.
I wasn't trying to brag at all. But if you perceive it that way, perhaps that says more about you than it does me.
It's clearly perceived here as 'weird' of you to say this to him. That can be understandably brushed aside as just an unpopular choice. I think what makes it stand out is the perception of your bragplainty post here. As if you wanted us to see your compassion - and such an action generally negates whatever compassion there may have been. Trying to pat yourself on the back for being 'nice'.
I wasn't trying to brag at all. But if you perceive it that way, perhaps that says more about you than it does me.
On 9/11/01 my family and I went to eat at an Afghan restaurant in our area to show our support for the idea that not all brown people are terrorists - because it was pretty apparent that that was going to me our next National past-time. There were other people there doing the same thing. Our waitress actually cried she was so touched. I don't think it's that weird. I think when there are crimes or events that appear to divide people along racial or ethnic lines, it's a nice gesture to reach out and say, "I'm not part of this."
Unless you were the one that pulled a gun and shot up the temple, I wouldn't assume you were "part of this". The best way to prove that you don't see them as an "other" is to treat them exactly the same way you'd treat anybody else on the street. Not to single them out for some reason.
If a white guy went into a black church and shot it up because they were all black, and somebody rolled up on me all "I'm so sorry for your loss" I would side-eye the fuck out of them. Yes, it's sad, but saying "it really sucks people are so goddamn stupid and ignorant" is TOTALLY DIFFERENT than expressing "condolences" on a personal level to somebody who has no personal connection to a particular tragedy other than the fact that he belongs to the same religion.
Also, Cas, you need to slow down because you sound batshit crazy and are morphing into a "GBCNGBCN and also I feel sorry for your husbands you evil hags!!!1111" parody. Chill. Damn. Not everyone has to agree with you.
If you read, I didn't say "I'm sorry for your loss", I said "I'm sorry about the terrible tragedy today at the Sikh temple in Wisconsin, that is terrible".
And I'm not GBCNGBCN, nor did I say I feel sorry for your husbands - I imagine they understood what they were getting into when they married you I'm just sorry that some of you live in a world where it's offensive and strange to reach out to a stranger in the wake of a tragedy.
I think a lot of people are bothered by the thinly veiled self congratulatory nature of the act
Except I wasn't congratulating myself, I was expressing how I was disappointed that what I meant to be a kindness ended up likely worrying this guy for the rest of his shift. If the exchange had been different because he did already hear of it, I never would have a posted about it because the intent was not to "brag".
Except I wasn't congratulating myself, I was expressing how I was disappointed that what I meant to be a kindness ended up likely worrying this guy for the rest of his shift. If the exchange had been different because he did already hear of it, I never would have a posted about it because the intent was not to "brag".
I am the closest thing to an ally you have in this thread. You should find someone else to disagree with.
And I don't think you were congratulating yourself when you spoke to the store clerk. I think you're doing it in this thread.
I'm not being mean to you?
Perhaps having to defend my initial post and my actions make it look like I'm congratulating myself, but that is not my intent. I'm defending the idea that offering words of kindness to someone in the wake of a tragedy affecting others in their religious group (a group that has been the victim of hate crimes for over a decade) is not offensive or strange.
I wasn't trying to brag at all. But if you perceive it that way, perhaps that says more about you than it does me.
Would it fucking kill you to stop trying to push everything off on other people and just admit that maybe it was a bit odd or at least that you understand not everyone would do what you did?
Would it kill you to admit that this is a tragedy affecting the Sikh community as a whole, and that in fact the opinions of prominent Sikhs who have expressed that it is meaningful to have other Americans stand with them and express their thoughts might be more valid than yours?
If you read, I didn't say "I'm sorry for your loss", I said "I'm sorry about the terrible tragedy today at the Sikh temple in Wisconsin, that is terrible".
And I'm not GBCNGBCN, nor did I say I feel sorry for your husbands - I imagine they understood what they were getting into when they married you I'm just sorry that some of you live in a world where it's offensive and strange to reach out to a stranger in the wake of a tragedy.
Good God you are unbelievably obnoxious. I'm very glad you're more concerned with expressing your apologies to someone for something that had nothing to do with them than acting like a normal, rational human being instead of an uppity, patronizing little twat.
FWIW, I was also perplexed by the pile-on. I think that maybe the gesture was a bit off, but I sort of side eye people who say they absolutely cannot fathom people doing anything like this. If somebody did so to me (baed on something about my outward appearance), I might find It weird, but still acknowledge The kindness of the gesture.
I do have to say, Cas, you're not doing yourself any favors getting personal and defensive. here's some advice you didn't ask for--let this die down and perhaps try to hear what more moderate voices are trying to say about stereotyping.
Post by karinothing on Aug 6, 2012 11:21:24 GMT -5
I see nothing wrong with what you did. I mean sure you could have gotten egg on your face if the person hadn't been Sikh but hopefully they would have understood you were coming from a good place. Since it was a targeted attack on a certain class of people that the man happened to belong to, I think your sympathy was warranted.
From my many years on the Nest and now GBCN I feel like these boards have a general feeling that one should mind their own business in every single situation. For fear of offending someone or stepping on toes or whatever. But whatever, sometimes a kind word to someone can really make someone feel better and sometimes that is worth taking a minimal risk (as it seems it was in this case) that you might offend someone.
suggest that we recognize there is a larger cultural and ethnic component to this act. For me, it's *that* that makes OP's conduct WNL. If some random Sikh had been shot in a home invasion or something, then I'd think it was weird that OP was offering her condolences to a completely unrelated random person who also happened to be Sikh. But when a portion of your community is attacked because of their ethnicity, race, religion, whatever, you do internalize that and feel it as an attack on a part of yourself. Therefore, for someone else to say, "I'm so sorry this has happened to your people" - I find that really just not that weird. A little awkward, but again, I do think it's a lot like the outpouring of support people offered to Americans abroad in the wake of 9/11.
The most I can say is that OP posted this thread so that everyone would tell her what a fabulous person she actually is, which is a little But I'm confused by the immediate vitriol and the insistence that the reaching out to the Sikh himself is somehow actually problematic. I just don't think it is.
Thank you.
And although you don't believe me, I expected the responses to be along the lines of "poor guy, that sucks", not "wow casmgn you are such a fabulous person".