20+ years in FL. The canal we lived near regularly had gators, we watched them on our walk to school. Afraid of them, but we were aware of them and warned how to deal with them, much like driving in NY when deer are around (hit them head on, don't swerve).
If there were no swimming signs, the parents were negligent. However, if they are not Floridians they might just not have known the danger. I can't say I hope that was the case...gators in swimming areas is terribly scary though. The whole situation is awful.
There are multiple signs along the shore line saying that you are not allowed to swim, to which I took to mean, to stay out of the water period.
This is just so sad. H got very upset reading the article because we were just there. Our girls were just playing on that beach.
20+ years in FL. The canal we lived near regularly had gators, we watched them on our walk to school. Afraid of them, but we were aware of them and warned how to deal with them, much like driving in NY when deer are around (hit them head on, don't swerve).
If there were no swimming signs, the parents were negligent. However, if they are not Floridians they might just not have known the danger. I can't say I hope that was the case...gators in swimming areas is terribly scary though. The whole situation is awful.
I'm from Illinois, no gators even close to the area, and if it's a body of water in FL that's bigger than a puddle, I assume it has a gator in it.
This is not me victim blaming, btw. I feel horrible for these parents and can't even begin to imagine what they're going through.
20+ years in FL. The canal we lived near regularly had gators, we watched them on our walk to school. Afraid of them, but we were aware of them and warned how to deal with them, much like driving in NY when deer are around (hit them head on, don't swerve).
If there were no swimming signs, the parents were negligent. However, if they are not Floridians they might just not have known the danger. I can't say I hope that was the case...gators in swimming areas is terribly scary though. The whole situation is awful.
There are multiple signs along the shore line saying that you are not allowed to swim, to which I took to mean, to stay out of the water period.
This is just so sad. H got very upset reading the article because we were just there. Our girls were just playing on that beach.
Do we know that they were actually IN the water? I have read a few articles and they aren't all clear. I have seen gators chase people.
There are multiple signs along the shore line saying that you are not allowed to swim, to which I took to mean, to stay out of the water period.
This is just so sad. H got very upset reading the article because we were just there. Our girls were just playing on that beach.
Do we know that they were actually IN the water? I have read a few articles and they aren't all clear. I have seen gators chase people.
All news reports (not local, but within a 2-ish hour drive of Orlando) and the press conference said that they were wading in the water. Not very deep at all, but yes, in the water.
There are multiple signs along the shore line saying that you are not allowed to swim, to which I took to mean, to stay out of the water period.
This is just so sad. H got very upset reading the article because we were just there. Our girls were just playing on that beach.
Do we know that they were actually IN the water? I have read a few articles and they aren't all clear. I have seen gators chase people.
It sounds as though they were in the water. The water has reeds and other stuff growing close to the shore and you cannot see the bottom. I can see how a gator would be able to go undetected.
I had to turn the news off this morning when they started talking about it; so horrific, I can't even imagine.
Can't wait to read the unwashed internet masses start blaming the "negligent" parents for this one, too.
I've seen news articles on fb and people are already blaming he parents. You can't win.
I get so exhausted and frustrated by people's need to always place blame. I admit I am extra sensitive since our state is going through such a heartbreaking time right now, but do we have to point fingers? It was a terrible, tragic ACCIDENT. A two-year old is dead. A lot of people (both the family and Disney) are likely feeling terrible guilt over it. FFS, no further speculations are needed, just prayers and sympathy.
Post by themysteriouswife on Jun 15, 2016 8:30:46 GMT -5
FIL lives in a homestead in FL. They have alligators show up randomly on their property often. They had a momma lay eggs a few years ago. There was nothing they could do. They had to keep all of there animals inside at all times. She stayed nearly 6 months and had 4 babies.
Alligators cannot be kept out. They are a protected species. This is no ones fault, but nature.
I've seen news articles on fb and people are already blaming he parents. You can't win.
I get so exhausted and frustrated by people's need to always place blame. I admit I am extra sensitive since our state is going through such a heartbreaking time right now, but do we have to point fingers? It was a terrible, tragic ACCIDENT. A two-year old is dead. A lot of people (both the family and Disney) are likely feeling terrible guilt over it. FFS, no further speculations are needed, just prayers and sympathy.
I know, I agree. Those poor parents, the last thing they need is to be blamed right now during this horrific time. Some people were replying to the articles that they wouldn't have let go of the alligator or would have wrestled it. I'm sure the parents tried their hardest to get their child. It makes me sick to my stomach thinking about what they are going through.
I get so exhausted and frustrated by people's need to always place blame. I admit I am extra sensitive since our state is going through such a heartbreaking time right now, but do we have to point fingers? It was a terrible, tragic ACCIDENT. A two-year old is dead. A lot of people (both the family and Disney) are likely feeling terrible guilt over it. FFS, no further speculations are needed, just prayers and sympathy.
I know, I agree. Those poor parents, the last thing they need is to be blamed right now during this horrific time. Some people were replying to the articles that they wouldn't have let go of the alligator or would have wrestled it. I'm sure the parents tried their hardest to get their child. It makes me sick to my stomach thinking about what they are going through.
I know, I agree. Those poor parents, the last thing they need is to be blamed right now during this horrific time. Some people were replying to the articles that they wouldn't have let go of the alligator or would have wrestled it. I'm sure the parents tried their hardest to get their child. It makes me sick to my stomach thinking about what they are going through.
omfg people are ridiculous.
I know! I wanted to reply to so many stupid comments. Everyone else has to say what they would have done that was better and would have saved the child.
Post by sweetpea508 on Jun 15, 2016 8:39:55 GMT -5
I could see wanting to let your 2 year old splash around in water in general. I can also imagine having that feeling that you are on vacation and being more relaxed. I feel horrible for the parents. We are taking a vacation with my 2 year old to Florida in August and this just makes me so sad.
We were just there last week. The first thing my H said when we saw the water was "I bet there are alligators in there." There are a lot of signs, but these parents clearly interpreted them as being no swimming, not no wading. The baby was only ankle deep.
Absolutely horrifying. I feel so terrible for them and the boy's siblings. How do you even cope with this? A nightmare.
I think that Disney has this reputation as a utopia and as a danger-free zone. It has a certain Stepford vibe and "the happiest place on earth" is taken quite literally. They work hard to keep that image up. And like all the previous posters have said, if you are a tourist, you can really fall into that trap of thinking nothing can go wrong. I remember being worried (and later coming home and researching) deaths at Disney bc I felt like the busses went too fast and drove erratically and all these kids were unrestrained, no one wore life jackets on the ferries etc. It seemed shocking to me there were not more accidents.
The details about the attack are almost too much to bear. I cannot imagine what this poor family is going through.
this is exactly what I wa thinking. It is sort of a made up world. I could totally see relaxing, letting my guard down and not remember that this is real life.
Like they had a really nice day. It was magical. They are relaxing watching the fire works and allow their kid to get too close to the water....
Here's the thing about alligators - you don't have to be in the water to be attacked. Countless pets are lost all.the.damn.time because people walk them along the edge/shore at the park where there are lakes/ponds/bodies of water. So whether or not these people were in the water, they were NEAR the water at prime feeding time. Alligators are big, strong motherfuckers who can appear out of nowhere in seconds.
I don't fault these people one bit. It is highly unlikely they (the family AND Disney) even knew the alligator was in the water. As a Floridian, it's easy for me to say "Duh, alligators," but I certainly don't expect a family from NE to understand the same way I do.
But I bet Disney posts about a thousand signs now.
Here's the thing about alligators - you don't have to be in the water to be attacked. Countless pets are lost all.the.damn.time because people walk them along the edge/shore at the park where there are lakes/ponds/bodies of water. So whether or not these people were in the water, they were NEAR the water at prime feeding time. Alligators are big, strong motherfuckers who can appear out of nowhere in seconds.
I don't fault these people one bit. It is highly unlikely they (the family AND Disney) even knew the alligator was in the water. As a Floridian, it's easy for me to say "Duh, alligators," but I certainly don't expect a family from NE to understand the same way I do.
But I bet Disney posts about a thousand signs now.
I totally agree. While I can think "OF COURSE there are likely alligators there", I can still understand how this can happen and not think "Stupid people, it's their fault." Even being aware of the dangers, I don't think I'm immune to something like this happening. The other problem is that when alligators are in areas like this, they tend to be more aggressive than alligators found in the wild.
I get so exhausted and frustrated by people's need to always place blame. I admit I am extra sensitive since our state is going through such a heartbreaking time right now, but do we have to point fingers? It was a terrible, tragic ACCIDENT.
After the gorilla incident, I read a great article about exactly this. The basic point was that people are often quick to place blame because it makes them feel like it couldn't happen to them. Accidents can happen to anyone, but if someone can convince themselves that it wasn't a freak accident & someone is at fault, then they can convince themselves that it could never happen to them. They're not negligent parents, they watch their kids, etc.
These were both terrible accidents. Could someone have done something to lessen the chances of it happening? Sure. But that doesn't mean that anyone is at fault.
My BFF is basically a walking Disney encyclopedia and told me a few weeks ago that no one dies at Disney - apparently they will take a body off the property and then declare time of death, but they won't call it on site. I'm not sure how they even do that (or how she knows/how true it is), but if that is the case I am wondering if that's why "officials" keep saying there's still hope. Seems cruel to lead the parents on that way.
i was reading that the father DID wrestle the gator to try and save his son. the mother was in the water at the same time. i don't know what else they could have done.
that poor family. it's awful. i remember seeing the "no swimming" signs when we were there two weeks ago. i just don't think you can blame anyone in this situation, it's just terrible all the way around.
My BFF is basically a walking Disney encyclopedia and told me a few weeks ago that no one dies at Disney - apparently they will take a body off the property and then declare time of death, but they won't call it on site. I'm not sure how they even do that (or how she knows/how true it is), but if that is the case I am wondering if that's why "officials" keep saying there's still hope. Seems cruel to lead the parents on that way.
I just read the CNN article. They are now saying there is no way he will alive if they find him.
Wrestling the gator is akin to "I would have used my conceal and carry to shoot down the terrorist". Just STOP Monday morning quarterbacking! It's so easy to say what you would have done but the truth is you have no clue until you are in a situation and reacting a certain way, and having success (changing the outcome) is unlikely.
I read something saying Disney uses the wildlife commission "nuisance gators" from its property, so it's not like they NEVER thought there could be gators in their waters. It looks like the sign just says "no swimming"? People who have been there can clarify. I can see how people might have thought putting your feet in the water was okay.
Sorry, I don't know why I'm so intent on blaming Disney here.
It's just the mindset of trying to find some sort of reason in a tragedy. It's certainly better than blaming the poor parents (but I don't think this is Disney's fault at all).
I read something saying Disney uses the wildlife commission "nuisance gators" from its property, so it's not like they NEVER thought there could be gators in their waters. It looks like the sign just says "no swimming"? People who have been there can clarify. I can see how people might have thought putting your feet in the water was okay.
Sorry, I don't know why I'm so intent on blaming Disney here.
Probably for the reason mentioned above with the gorilla. If you can blame someone, then there can be a REASON. I think it's human nature to want there to be a reason for something like this to have happened. If there's a reason for it, if someone is at fault, it probably makes people feel safer.
With that said, if you see a pool that says no swimming you aren't going to then proceed to wade and splash around in the shallow end, are you? Or even hang your legs in the water? Again, I am definitely NOT blaming the family. I see how this could happen and I see how there could have been things that were done to lessen the risk, but I really feel like this falls into the terrible accident category.
Terrible tragedy. I just can't imagine. Those poor parents. We live in Florida as of last year and keep it in mind that alligators are around, but I'm going to be much more cautious now with the little ones. We have a retention pond in our neighborhood that we frequently take walks around and sometimes the girls run near the bank to get a close look at the ducks. There's also been other family activities we've done in Florida where we've put our feet in water-probaby where we shouldn't be thinking it was safe because of no signs or other people doing the same.
Probably for the reason mentioned above. If you can blame someone, then there can be a REASON. I think it's human nature to want there to be a reason for something like this to have happened. If there's a reason for it, if someone is at fault, it probably makes people feel safer.
With that said, if you see a pool that says no swimming you aren't going to then proceed to wade and splash around in the shallow end, are you? Or even hang your legs in the water? Again, I am definitely NOT blaming the family. I see how this could happen and I see how there could have been things that were done to lessen the risk, but I really feel like this falls into the terrible accident category.
I don't know. I think they could have been more specific. Even "Do not enter water" or "danger" or something. But again, that might hurt Disney's bottom line. No swimming means no swimming. Looking at pictures of the "beach" only further enrages me.
I think this is a fair point and I would be surprised if they didn't make these changes in the future.
To me, a "No Swimming" sign doesn't mean "stay out of the water." It means literally, do not go swimming. I probably would have let my kid wade in the pond. My 2-year old doesn't know how to swim anyway!
I mean, I get that it's Florida. But it's DISNEY. You don't think there would be a gator on a beach at the Grand Floridian, one of Disney's premiere resorts.
Same here.
"No swimming" to me would mean no swimming - not stay out of the water. Just like when beaches have red flags meaning not to go swimming but people still walk along the edge of the water, collect shells, etc
That poor baby and those poor parents. I can't even imagine. I would have never even THOUGHT about the potential of an aligator while at a resort in Disney.
To me, a "No Swimming" sign doesn't mean "stay out of the water." It means literally, do not go swimming. I probably would have let my kid wade in the pond. My 2-year old doesn't know how to swim anyway!
I mean, I get that it's Florida. But it's DISNEY. You don't think there would be a gator on a beach at the Grand Floridian, one of Disney's premiere resorts.
This is where I'm at. Non Floridian in vacation mode. I totally would have let my children put their feet in. It's no one's fault, but just so awful. My heart breaks for this poor family.
And I keep thinking about the Orlando PD and first responders. After the massacre the other night, they are searching for this baby so his Mama can hold him one more time. It's horrific for them as well- I can't even imagine.