The historical context here is definitely important. Jews have been accused of being greedy money hoarders for hundreds of years (see Shakespeare's Shylock character in The Merchant of Venice) and that's been used to justify violence against us. We have an evil global cabal that controls everything et cetera. Any kind of implication from a non-Jew that Jews are all rich and privileged is loaded with meaning.
And I can definitely see that if you are black and growing up in a country that literally said your people were property and 3/5 of a person, being called a princess would rightfully evoke a "damn right!"
I am sorry for the confusion
Oh you don't need to apologize! I'm not offended at all. We are all learning here (I recently saw a comment elsewhere on the internet about how people writing anti-princess books and articles haven't stopped to consider how playing princess might hold different meaning for a child of color, and that was something that as a white person I hadn't thought about until then.)
Really?! Its pretty pervasive. When i was a little kid someone gave me a nameplate necklace that said "princess" and a star of david dotted the i. My father threw it away.
and here I spent the better part of my life not knowing it was a slur. I only found out maybe 10 years ago? all of my jewish friends (ie: everyone I went to camp with in Rockland) wore it with pride in the big-hair days.
oh, 1989... how times have changed.Â
When I was in school, it was about the same level as calling someone a slut -- it was tossed around often. Nowhere near level of n-word or k.
and here I spent the better part of my life not knowing it was a slur. I only found out maybe 10 years ago? all of my jewish friends (ie: everyone I went to camp with) wore it with pride in the big-hair days.
oh, 1989... how times have changed.
Jews are SO self-depricating, its very much a cultural defense mechanism (is that a thing? I mightve made it up), so i could see that.
it was probably young kids being dumb. we were at the prime age for repeating shit and not getting it yet (10-12 ish?). I remember hearing someone years and years later get REALLY pissed about being called a J-- and I was like "oh! ok, so that's not a good thing. good to know."
I remember not knowing that being called a wop was a bad thing. it was an odd thing to be called but I was like, "uh, ok. whatever."
this is the first time in nest history that i have seen a slur i didnt know before.
Really?! Its pretty pervasive. When i was a little kid someone gave me a nameplate necklace that said "princess" and a star of david dotted the i. My father threw it away.
Wtf? The parents of that kid were assholes. I wonder if the kid now understands what they did.
May I ask for help identifying resources? My husband is Jewish, but not religious, and we do not live close to his family (or mine). Being Jewish is important to him, and it's important to him that our children know and understand who they are. My kids are nearly 7 and nearly 3.
What can I read/do/share with them and for myself to help them, in the absence of the natural sort of education that happens when you have generations of family and friends nearby? Books? Shows? Other resources?
If it helps, we live very close to about 4 or 5 synagogues and Jewish community centers.
Obviously my husband knows plenty and shares with them, but I want to educate myself as well as my children.
Really?! Its pretty pervasive. When i was a little kid someone gave me a nameplate necklace that said "princess" and a star of david dotted the i. My father threw it away.
Wtf? The parents of that kid were assholes. I wonder if the kid now understands what they did.
Honestly, i dont even know who gave it to me. I was like 5 or 6. But my dad was fuming.
May I ask for help identifying resources? My husband is Jewish, but not religious, and we do not live close to his family (or mine). Being Jewish is important to him, and it's important to him that our children know and understand who they are. My kids are nearly 7 and nearly 3.
What can I read/do/share with them and for myself to help them, in the absence of the natural sort of education that happens when you have generations of family and friends nearby? Books? Shows? Other resources?
If it helps, we live very close to about 4 or 5 synagogues and Jewish community centers.
Obviously my husband knows plenty and shares with them, but I want to educate myself as well as my children.
For your children, you can sign up for PJ Library and they'll send free Jewish children's books pjlibrary.org/Home
I'll be back with more. Baby is trying to electrocute herself
May I ask for help identifying resources? My husband is Jewish, but not religious, and we do not live close to his family (or mine). Being Jewish is important to him, and it's important to him that our children know and understand who they are. My kids are nearly 7 and nearly 3.
What can I read/do/share with them and for myself to help them, in the absence of the natural sort of education that happens when you have generations of family and friends nearby? Books? Shows? Other resources?
If it helps, we live very close to about 4 or 5 synagogues and Jewish community centers.
Obviously my husband knows plenty and shares with them, but I want to educate myself as well as my children.
My DS1 went preschool at the JCC and learned a ton of things even though we're not Jewish. There are Sunday school programs or camps available for older kids. He went to summer camp there and they still have Shabbat every Friday. I think it's an awesome way for kids who are not familiar to be introduced to Jewish traditions. PM me if you have questions, I think we live in the same city.Â
I agree with this. A lot of synagogues have a Tot Shabbat program
Post by mrsdewinter on Sept 20, 2016 16:34:56 GMT -5
PJ Library will send free Jewish-themed books or music for kids every month and they email you about local events too. Local synagogues/JCCs are a great resource too and will have lots of programs and events. So much of my Jewish identity came from growing up at the JCC.
Kveller is a Jewish parenting website that discusses many religious and secular topics.
For anyone who wants to read Jewish perspectives on a variety of topics, I recommend following Tablet Magazine.
May I ask for help identifying resources? My husband is Jewish, but not religious, and we do not live close to his family (or mine). Being Jewish is important to him, and it's important to him that our children know and understand who they are. My kids are nearly 7 and nearly 3.
What can I read/do/share with them and for myself to help them, in the absence of the natural sort of education that happens when you have generations of family and friends nearby? Books? Shows? Other resources?
If it helps, we live very close to about 4 or 5 synagogues and Jewish community centers.
Obviously my husband knows plenty and shares with them, but I want to educate myself as well as my children.
I would reach out to your local community center and inquire what kind of free programming they offer. Our daughter goes to the local JCC for preschool and there is so much open to the public programs for kids and family.
Also I feel like camp is a really big thing among Jews. I would look into summer camp or sleep away camp when your kids are older.
We are not religious Jews but my daughter LOVES all of the Judaism she has been exposed to at school. There are so many lovely traditions/music/holidays that are fun for young kids.
May I ask for help identifying resources? My husband is Jewish, but not religious, and we do not live close to his family (or mine). Being Jewish is important to him, and it's important to him that our children know and understand who they are. My kids are nearly 7 and nearly 3.
What can I read/do/share with them and for myself to help them, in the absence of the natural sort of education that happens when you have generations of family and friends nearby? Books? Shows? Other resources?
If it helps, we live very close to about 4 or 5 synagogues and Jewish community centers.
Obviously my husband knows plenty and shares with them, but I want to educate myself as well as my children.
For your children, you can sign up for PJ Library and they'll send free Jewish children's books pjlibrary.org/Home
I'll be back with more. Baby is trying to electrocute herself
Thanks for this link. When I entered DD's info, it said "child is too old for this community," (she's 8), but I was able to enter DS's info.
PJ Library will send free Jewish-themed books or music for kids every month and they email you about local events too. Local synagogues/JCCs are a great resource too and will have lots of programs and events. So much of my Jewish identity came from growing up at the JCC.
Kveller is a Jewish parenting website that discusses many religious and secular topics.
For anyone who wants to read Jewish perspectives on a variety of topics, I recommend following Tablet Magazine.
Thanks everyone! I really appreciate it. I want to be proactive educating myself and my kids, while being respectful and not just barging in someplace all "teach me about being Jewish."
Thanks everyone! I really appreciate it. I want to be proactive educating myself and my kids, while being respectful and not just barging in someplace all "teach me about being Jewish."
I have no idea where you live, but in my area, there is a "progressive Jewish congregation" (per their web site) that hosts kid-centered celebrations of various Jewish holidays. They are very welcoming of families of all kinds. I found out about them through our neighborhood list serve.
"You don't even look Jewish!", from another mother at DD's preschool. Yeah, thanks. It's always fun to be told I don't fit into the community.
Yeah. I've gotten that. At a recent birthday party, a group of the Jewish moms were chatting about something Jewish, like Challah bread or Purim. I chime in and one of the moms interrupts and asks me, do you even know what challah bread is? As if I couldn't participate because she thought I wasn't Jewish.
Totally rude no matter my religion or lack thereof.. But the look on her face when I told her I took my husbands last name and we are raising our Irish-looking blonde kid as a Jew.... lol
Thanks everyone! I really appreciate it. I want to be proactive educating myself and my kids, while being respectful and not just barging in someplace all "teach me about being Jewish."
I have no idea where you live, but in my area, there is a "progressive Jewish congregation" (per their web site)Â that hosts kid-centered celebrations of various Jewish holidays. They are very welcoming of families of all kinds. I found out about them through our neighborhood list serve.Â
This is the kind of temple we go as well. It's Reform and very kid focused. We are a small congregation for our area and it feels like a family.
"You don't even look Jewish!", from another mother at DD's preschool. Yeah, thanks. It's always fun to be told I don't fit into the community.
<------ all.the.DAMN.time! When DH and I got engaged, a friend of MIL's asked if she was OK that her son was getting involved in a mixed marriage (the clear assumption being that I'm not Jewish.) MIL responded with "Oh course! I'm excited to have a Sephardic daughter in law!"
I gave my friend a subscription to Lilith when she got bat mitzvahed as an adult. She loved it. Definitely on the progressive side.
As a non-Jew who went to school that was about 50% Jewish and had annual meetings with holocaust survivors, I will admit I didn't see a ton of anti-semitic sentiment. I was even called a JAP despite being nominally Christian enough that I went twice a week (not that anything would excuse the slur). I learned about pretty much every slur, both from curriculum and from survivors.
Even yet, I don't get it at a visceral level. I've been to the holocaust museum in DC. I've watched movies. I've met with survivors. I've spent entire days in school in holocaust history (yes, they excused us from all classes to attend these things). So there is no reason to not listen to people saying "this hurts us."
I do have a question, though. I'd always learned ultra-orthodox was an ok term. What is preferred? Hasidim is a specific sect. What about other ultra-sects?
"You don't even look Jewish!", from another mother at DD's preschool. Yeah, thanks. It's always fun to be told I don't fit into the community.
<------ all.the.DAMN.time! When DH and I got engaged, a friend of MIL's asked if she was OK that her son was getting involved in a mixed marriage (the clear assumption being that I'm not Jewish.) MIL responded with "Oh course! I'm excited to have a Sephardic daughter in law!"
I get it all the time too (to be fair, I was not born Jewish and converted when I was adopted). I always want to ask "oh? How so? Is my nose to small? My hair too straight? My horns too short?"
So far I just look at them oddly and say "well trust me, I am"
You're going to find it hella difficult to sort out what of these perceptions are accurate and what is black acceptance of the tired ass racist trope that Jews are greedy money grubbers.
So are you saying that it is not true (or most likely not true) that black people were saying that Jewish landlords were charging them more or that store owners were charging them higher prices? Like I said this is not something I am very familiar with. I looked it up and .2% of my county identifies as religiously Jewish (and that is rounding up). I would assume that the culturally Jewish population is not much higher, but I may be mistaken since I have only gone to Christian schools. Either way I don't like the idea of disregarding what people are saying as "racist trope" because it does not align with the common belief. I still want to do more research and I will.
There is also part of that same wiki page that discusses the racism that went from Jewish towards black people. So it is not like black people were just saying negative stuff about Jewish people and it was all because they were racist or bought into racist beliefs.
That's not at all what I'm saying but if you'd like to interpret it that way until the google or people you find black enough prove you right, you do you, boo.
"You don't even look Jewish!", from another mother at DD's preschool. Yeah, thanks. It's always fun to be told I don't fit into the community.
Yeah. I've gotten that. At a recent birthday party, a group of the Jewish moms were chatting about something Jewish, like Challah bread or Purim. I chime in and one of the moms interrupts and asks me, do you even know what challah bread is? As if I couldn't participate because she thought I wasn't Jewish.
Totally rude no matter my religion or lack thereof.. But the look on her face when I told her I took my husbands last name and we are raising our Irish-looking blonde kid as a Jew.... lol
Who doesn't?!?!?! This non-Jewish woman thinks it's kind of the most delicious bread ever and everyone should eat it.
"You don't even look Jewish!", from another mother at DD's preschool. Yeah, thanks. It's always fun to be told I don't fit into the community.
Yeah. I've gotten that. At a recent birthday party, a group of the Jewish moms were chatting about something Jewish, like Challah bread or Purim. I chime in and one of the moms interrupts and asks me, do you even know what challah bread is? As if I couldn't participate because she thought I wasn't Jewish.
Totally rude no matter my religion or lack thereof.. But the look on her face when I told her I took my husbands last name and we are raising our Irish-looking blonde kid as a Jew.... lol
I must've had close to a hundred times in my life when my Irish/Scottish/Welsh/English self was thought to be Jewish. The experiences ranged from sweet - cute Jewish guys in college bummed that they couldn't take me home to their mothers - to scary - being yelled at by neo-nazis and trying to explain to a train ticket collector that I wasn't Jewish so he'd give me my passport back when backpacking alone in Poland. It's definitely been eye opening.
I'm hopping in here for a few reasons, the first of which is to say to @kirkette that after reading her responses here, in multiple other threads on race, and in the SNAP thread, how much I respect her contributions here and everywhere. I've respected you for years here and this just further reinforces my respect for your open heart and willingness to educate and damn if she hasn't earned the right to knock the shit out of a few bitches now and again. I hope you come back soon because your input is valuable to many of us. But if you stay away I totally get it. I'm glad to know you and I just want you to know that. And imobviouslystaying , love and respect to you too. And now that I'm done kissing gluteus maximus...
I started with that because I'm not sure that I can add to this thread. I have a number of Jewish friends in my life, here and back in Cleveland, but beyond conversation and a minimal amount of basic information, I'm definitely lacking in the knowledge department. And as someone who doesn't walk in your shoes, there's not much I can add, imo. It was fun times trying to balance an Israeli friend (my boss' wife, who for some reason I can't fathom absolutely adored me, was born in Israel and her family lives there) with my Palestinian daycare provider (also with a great deal of family in the region), both of whom I adored but neither of whom I could speak too deeply with regarding these topics because I would get wildly conflicting views peppered with more than a little prejudice and racism and intolerance for the opposing viewpoint. I greatly appreciate the ladies who have responded, with much patience and tolerance, to those of us who don't have the breadth of knowledge that we should or would like to have on this subject. So this thread has been very informative for me. Thank you ladies for your considered and educational responses.
The one thing that I can bring to the table, other than the knowledge that yes, racism is alive and well with regard to the community (witness the number of Holocaust deniers, for one thing, and "the Jews are running the world. I mean, banking, movies and entertainment, the law, doctors, they're all Jews." mentality) is that much of the success that the bigots and assholes hold against them as a community began because they were doing things that others considered "sinful" or simply beneath them. With regard to the entertainment business, actresses were prostitutes, actors were "less than" and so when film became the standard, it was a medium in which they saw they could survive and even thrive because it was something that wouldn't be touched (for lack of a better word) by WASP businessmen. Same with the law. The labor and employment area of the practice is heavily populated by Jewish-founded firms because 50-75 years ago, it was an area of law that big, fancy ("white-shoe") firms wouldn't touch, as "beneath them" so they would hire the Jewish attorneys to take the matters (smaller firms or individuals - the attorneys they wouldn't hire in their firms because they were Jewish). My former boss' practice started like this with his father and uncle. My husband's firm started like this (and is now one of the largest in the nation). Once L&E was seen as a money-maker as the Jewish firms flourished, and no longer "dirty" was the point that the larger firms started bringing the business in-house rather than farming it out. The banking business was already touched on up-thread. Jews are successful because racism has kept them out of the mainstream, so they made their own "streams" and supported themselves and each other in doing so. And in doing so, made these businesses successful enough that they were deemed "acceptable" by the Christian members of society, who then tried to encroach because the money was good enough.