Did you miss that 1800 people died yesterday from this in our country and we are not near the peak yet?
Of course I'm aware of the severity of the situation. I'm not saying this health crisis is overblown, but the sanctimonious judgment of anyone who might have any contact with anyone for any reason is a bit much.
THESE PEOPLE AREN'T BEING JUDGED FOR GROCERY SHOPPING!!!
Do I need to say it louder?
They are being judged for willingly exposing other people because of completely pointless and unnecessary reasons. Play dates aren’t fucking essential.
Did you miss that 1800 people died yesterday from this in our country and we are not near the peak yet?
Of course I'm aware of the severity of the situation. I'm not saying this health crisis is overblown, but the sanctimonious judgment of anyone who might have any contact with anyone for any reason is a bit much.
No one is judging anyone who "might come in contact with anyone for any reason", and you know that, we are judging parents who cant tell poor little Susie that she cant go out and play with her friends.
sdlaura, it's not actually my situation. I'm tired and probably should have just stayed quiet.
We are both essential employees with the ability to work from home. We pulled our kids from daycare ("voluntarily" - daycare is still open for essential workers). We do not have parents geographically close enough to get childcare help from nor do we have any friends we feel comfortable partnering with. We are muddling through this with a 4 yo and an almost 2 year old who needs active supervision. We are making it work and we are fortunate that we have so far been able to do so.
We are definitely not playing with the neighbors.
H and I are both still working full-time jobs, from home. I have also taken on full-time time care of DS (age 8) during working hours (and often later into the evening) because of the nature of H's job.
Would it be easier if we partnered with a neighbor? Yes. Are we doing it? Fuck no. It's not safe.
Listen, working from home with both kids is slowly killing me. Trust me when I say I am not cut out for multiple days on end at home with my kids. And trying to work from home is just the topping on a shit sundae, but if you can honestly read some of the threads on here and in the news and still do a playdate with neighbors then you need a serious reality check.
Fathers are dying alone in hospital beds. Best friends are missing the funerals of their loved ones. Brothers are dying alone in a hospital and saying goodbye over facetime. Fathers are missing the births of their children.
But your 3 kids are bored and must play with the neighbors? So sorry for them.
My kids have played with our neighbor's kid. The dad in that household and my husband both work together as firefighters. They work in the same station, responding to the same calls, eating from the same kitchen, using the same bathroom, etc for 24 hour shifts at a time. They're exposed to the same germs.
Our households are operating with the assumption that the husbands will be/have been exposed and have exposed our own families. Their kid is exposed to the germs the dad brings home, which are the same germs DH brings home to our kids. They live directly across the street from us. We don't see the harm in letting the kids ride bikes together.
That said, we're not going out in public. Both myself and the other wife are working from home full time, kids are home. We're not seeing grandparents, going for groceries, letting the other neighborhood kids join our kids, etc. We're just acting as though my family of 4 and their family of 3 have have the virus and are self isolated, other than when the guys leave to go to work.
No one is judging anyone who "might come in contact with anyone for any reason", and you know that, we are judging parents who cant tell poor little Susie that she cant go out and play with her friends.
I hear you.
I'm just saying don't be so quick to judge. I have seen SO much judgment here and in neighborhood groups when people don't truly know why other families have made the decisions they have made. Let's give people some benefit of the doubt. Let's not always assume people are being stupid and careless.
Perhaps there are essential workers who have no other options for childcare. Perhaps someone is struggling with mental health or addiction, so limited contact with another family is more of a necessity for them. Perhaps two families have agreed to quarantine together and are taking every other precaution possible in order to do so.
My point is we don't always know the full story. Also, keep in mind that the rules are different in different parts of the country. And in some areas, the shelter in place is brand new and people are still learning and adjusting and trying to figure out how to do this.
People are not all blatantly ignoring the rules just for fun. Sure, some people are, but I think for the most part people are trying.
I......So what is your excuse? You said you are playing with two different families right? Why?
Post by minniemouse on Apr 9, 2020 10:51:24 GMT -5
I...am amazed that anyone thinks they have special circumstances. There are no excuses for play dates. None. I don’t care if you have trouble working from home with the kids there - so do I!! I am by myself with 2 kids and a demanding full time job. We are ALL struggling. I don’t care if you think you are in the same risk pool as another family due to jobs or whatever else. It is not ok.
To the letter of the question: yes. The spirit? No.
H is an essential, front-line worker. One of his co-workers is a single mom, POS ex, no local family. When she works, her kids come to our house, since I’m usually home. She and H are going to primarily be exposed to the same germs and same patients, the therefore our kids are, too.
Only kink in this is that I’ve been called in to work 2x over the past week (OT, covering for ill— non-Covid— coworker). Then my sister has watched the kids, so expanding that exposure...not ideal, but both H and I as well as co-worker feel like this is a better option than sending the kids to the daycares that are still open (for essential workers only) since lord knows what germs are going around there, or what germs our kids could bring to all those kids.
Did you miss that 1800 people died yesterday from this in our country and we are not near the peak yet?
Of course I'm aware of the severity of the situation. I'm not saying this health crisis is overblown, but the sanctimonious judgment of anyone who might have any contact with anyone for any reason is a bit much.
GTFO with your whining about "sanctimonious judgement."
My kids have played with our neighbor's kid. The dad in that household and my husband both work together as firefighters. They work in the same station, responding to the same calls, eating from the same kitchen, using the same bathroom, etc for 24 hour shifts at a time. They're exposed to the same germs.
Our households are operating with the assumption that the husbands will be/have been exposed and have exposed our own families. Their kid is exposed to the germs the dad brings home, which are the same germs DH brings home to our kids. They live directly across the street from us. We don't see the harm in letting the kids ride bikes together.
That said, we're not going out in public. Both myself and the other wife are working from home full time, kids are home. We're not seeing grandparents, going for groceries, letting the other neighborhood kids join our kids, etc. We're just acting as though my family of 4 and their family of 3 have have the virus and are self isolated, other than when the guys leave to go to work.
I hate to break it to you but you’re still exposing you and your family to unnecessary risks. I guarantee that your H and his coworker don’t go to the bathroom together, wash hands together, use the same amount of hand sanitizer, shower together, etc every single minute of every single day. In addition, everyone’s body and immune system works differently. So they could both be exposed to the exact same germs/viral load (which is highly likely anyway) and yet only one might get sick and yet only one might be a carrier. So you can certainly decide that you want to expose yourself and your kid to unnecessary risk, but it is certainly an extra risk.
My kids have played with our neighbor's kid. The dad in that household and my husband both work together as firefighters. They work in the same station, responding to the same calls, eating from the same kitchen, using the same bathroom, etc for 24 hour shifts at a time. They're exposed to the same germs.
Our households are operating with the assumption that the husbands will be/have been exposed and have exposed our own families. Their kid is exposed to the germs the dad brings home, which are the same germs DH brings home to our kids. They live directly across the street from us. We don't see the harm in letting the kids ride bikes together.
That said, we're not going out in public. Both myself and the other wife are working from home full time, kids are home. We're not seeing grandparents, going for groceries, letting the other neighborhood kids join our kids, etc. We're just acting as though my family of 4 and their family of 3 have have the virus and are self isolated, other than when the guys leave to go to work.
I hate to break it to you but you’re still exposing you and your family to unnecessary risks. I guarantee that your H and his coworker don’t go to the bathroom together, wash hands together, use the same amount of hand sanitizer, shower together, etc every single minute of every single day. In addition, everyone’s body and immune system works differently. So they could both be exposed to the exact same germs/viral load (which is highly likely anyway) and yet only one might get sick and yet only one might be a carrier. So you can certainly decide that you want to expose yourself and your kid to unnecessary risk, but it is certainly an extra risk.
Thank you for this response. I really respect your input.
I'll tell DH I'm not comfortable with this set up. Our decision came from a place where we felt really resigned to the fact that the PPE our husbands have access to is fairly minimal (here's a mask and a baggy. Make it work for as long as humanly possible) and felt like it was inevitable that we were all exposed. We really felt like we should just act as though we're all sick.
Did you miss that 1800 people died yesterday from this in our country and we are not near the peak yet?
Of course I'm aware of the severity of the situation. I'm not saying this health crisis is overblown, but the sanctimonious judgment of anyone who might have any contact with anyone for any reason is a bit much.
I hate to break it to you but you’re still exposing you and your family to unnecessary risks. I guarantee that your H and his coworker don’t go to the bathroom together, wash hands together, use the same amount of hand sanitizer, shower together, etc every single minute of every single day. In addition, everyone’s body and immune system works differently. So they could both be exposed to the exact same germs/viral load (which is highly likely anyway) and yet only one might get sick and yet only one might be a carrier. So you can certainly decide that you want to expose yourself and your kid to unnecessary risk, but it is certainly an extra risk.
Thank you for this response. I really respect your input.
I'll tell DH I'm not comfortable with this set up. Our decision came from a place where we felt really resigned to the fact that the PPE our husbands have access to is fairly minimal (here's a mask and a baggy. Make it work for as long as humanly possible) and felt like it was inevitable that we were all exposed. We really felt like we should just act as though we're all sick.
This virus is certainly scary but it certainly is not inevitable that everyone is going to be exposed and get sick. So anything you can do to limit that extra risk is worth it. I’m taking care of stable covid patients in the outpatient setting, plus I’m in the city with the most cases and so far I’m fine. Some of my coworkers have tested positive and have mild courses. So everyone is different. My SO went back to our house in another city, but if he were still here I wouldn’t be ok with him hanging out with another exposed healthcare worker just because he’s already getting exposed via me. That certainly makes no sense in my mind. Most healthcare workers I know that don’t have to send their kids to daycare are isolating their kids as much as possible, not letting them play with other kids.
Thank you for this response. I really respect your input.
I'll tell DH I'm not comfortable with this set up. Our decision came from a place where we felt really resigned to the fact that the PPE our husbands have access to is fairly minimal (here's a mask and a baggy. Make it work for as long as humanly possible) and felt like it was inevitable that we were all exposed. We really felt like we should just act as though we're all sick.
This virus is certainly scary but it certainly is not inevitable that everyone is going to be exposed and get sick. So anything you can do to limit that extra risk is worth it. I’m taking care of stable covid patients in the outpatient setting, plus I’m in the city with the most cases and so far I’m fine. Some of my coworkers have tested positive and have mild courses. So everyone is different. My SO went back to our house in another city, but if he were still here I wouldn’t be ok with him hanging out with another exposed healthcare worker just because he’s already getting exposed via me. That certainly makes no sense in my mind. Most healthcare workers I know that don’t have to send their kids to daycare are isolating their kids as much as possible, not letting them play with other kids.
My husband and I are both hospital based healthcare workers in NYC. Luckily we are able to manage care for our daughter at home so she doesn't have to leave the house or be exposed to others. it seems like my coworkers are managing to do the same. I know most, if not all of the care centers set up by the DOE for children of healthcare workers have been closed due to lack of demand. I guess people are able to figure something out.
I hate to break it to you but you’re still exposing you and your family to unnecessary risks. I guarantee that your H and his coworker don’t go to the bathroom together, wash hands together, use the same amount of hand sanitizer, shower together, etc every single minute of every single day. In addition, everyone’s body and immune system works differently. So they could both be exposed to the exact same germs/viral load (which is highly likely anyway) and yet only one might get sick and yet only one might be a carrier. So you can certainly decide that you want to expose yourself and your kid to unnecessary risk, but it is certainly an extra risk.
Thank you for this response. I really respect your input.
I'll tell DH I'm not comfortable with this set up. Our decision came from a place where we felt really resigned to the fact that the PPE our husbands have access to is fairly minimal (here's a mask and a baggy. Make it work for as long as humanly possible) and felt like it was inevitable that we were all exposed. We really felt like we should just act as though we're all sick.
I liked this post because I really appreciate your calm and responsible response. That's so refreshing in the midst of all the "you don't know my lyfe!" BS.
We are not and have not been in basically a month. It has been really hard as most have not been that stringent. My kids didn’t want to go out front to play because they could hear the neighbors playing at another house and laughing and swimming together.I don’t really know if that has slowed down or not. I know one kid told mine that he “feels bad for them because their mom won’t let them do anything.” So that’s great! Today my 5th grader had a zoom call with his class and the daughter of the neighbor behind was on the call with her friend from next door.. The neighbor behind us is a police officer and the wife is a nurse, their neighbor is in food services and i think the wife is working from home. I’m just so shocked that this is still going on.
My 3 kids are still playing with 2 neighbors. One family has 3 kids and the other has 4 kids. 2 days ago another neighbor yelled at them and told them they should not be playing together and that their parents should read the law book. I get it, and she has a point, but she should talk to us, the parents, if she has an issue, not yell at the kids.
Yes, her yelling at your kids that they shouldn't be playing together during this time instead of talking to the parents is TOTALLY th problem in your scenario; it's not a giant group of unrelated kids from separate households playing together. How exactly is she supposed to do that while socially distancing? So now you have forced her into a position where she has to get close enough to have a conversation and personally convince her neighbors to follow the damn rules? Don't want your kids yelled at? KEEP THEM AT HOME AND AWAY FROM THE NEIGHBOR CHILDREN.
At the very beginning, we let DD see one friend and her cousins once each but it was before the Stay Home directive was in place here. She hasn't played with another kid in weeks. She's only child. If she can do it, your freaking THREE kids can do it, too. We are far enough into this, you know what you should be doing.
FFS! YES! My DD left this at my table seat a week or two ago. If she can handle being lonely, so can your three fucking kids.
I go to the grocery and to get take out. That feels risky enough. My kids haven’t play with another kid in over 3 weeks. It sucks. We have a park on our block and it’s often filled with kids. My kids are so sad I won’t let them play but too bad.
We use the basketball hoop or the soccer net at the park if it’s empty. Otherwise we play in our yard.
This weekend is going to totally suck. We always have Easter with my bff and her kids. The kids are already crying about missing our annual Easter egg hunt. I keep reminding myself there is nothing so important that I’m willing to risk their lives of mine so we stay inside.
GET OVER YOURSELVES. You are not alone in being tired. You are not alone in having kids that are bored, or sad, or overwhelmed, or sad about not playing. We are all in the same fucking boat. It sucks for all of us. The sooner we see that and woman the fuck up and lock shit down, it'll improve.
Of course we need to grocery shop. Of course some people need to work. THOSE ARE ESSENTIAL THINGS. Playdates are not. Neither DD or I have been anywhere besides a walk in FOUR FUCKING WEEKS. I have sent H and only H to get groceries the entire time. It's calling limiting risk.
It really blows my mind that people think even partnering with one other family is okay. Stay away from people. Seriously unless they live in your house you shouldn’t be seeing them.
With a couple of brazen exceptions, I think the reason that some people are offering differing viewpoints on this topic is that if you take the viewpoint above, then that doesn't allow for any kind of contact like the type that bronxgirl mentioned:
"My husband and I are both hospital based healthcare workers in NYC. Luckily we are able to manage care for our daughter at home so she doesn't have to leave the house or be exposed to others. it seems like my coworkers are managing to do the same. I know most, if not all of the care centers set up by the DOE for children of healthcare workers have been closed due to lack of demand. I guess people are able to figure something out."
Presumably, if all these essential workers have figured out how to have their kids cared for at home, many of them are likely involving some kind of caregiver or grandparent, or possibly one other family.
I think nearly all reasonable people should agree by this point that letting your kids play with other kids in the neighborhood because they're bored or jealous is a really bad idea. But I don't think everyone who has contact with people outside their household for every reason (like childcare for essential workers) is a villain.
Post by lolalolalola on Apr 9, 2020 14:04:25 GMT -5
There are two things being discussed in this thread, both are quite different (playing with the neighbors vs expanding your ‘family). Both seems to be met with the same level of outrage, which seems odd to me. But maybe that’s just the “no tolerance” stance that needs to be taken in times like this.
There are two things being discussed in this thread, both are quite different (playing with the neighbors vs expanding your ‘family). Both seems to be met with the same level of outrage, which seems odd to me. But maybe that’s just the “no tolerance” stance that needs to be taken in times like this.
You put this more succinctly than I did - thank you
There are two things being discussed in this thread, both are quite different (playing with the neighbors vs expanding your ‘family). Both seems to be met with the same level of outrage, which seems odd to me. But maybe that’s just the “no tolerance” stance that needs to be taken in times like this.
Hey, if you need a sibling or grandparent to move in with you to watch your child because you're essential worker who still needs to work outside the home, that's fine.
It really blows my mind that people think even partnering with one other family is okay. Stay away from people. Seriously unless they live in your house you shouldn’t be seeing them.
With a couple of brazen exceptions, I think the reason that some people are offering differing viewpoints on this topic is that if you take the viewpoint above, then that doesn't allow for any kind of contact like the type that bronxgirl mentioned:
"My husband and I are both hospital based healthcare workers in NYC. Luckily we are able to manage care for our daughter at home so she doesn't have to leave the house or be exposed to others. it seems like my coworkers are managing to do the same. I know most, if not all of the care centers set up by the DOE for children of healthcare workers have been closed due to lack of demand. I guess people are able to figure something out."
Presumably, if all these essential workers have figured out how to have their kids cared for at home, many of them are likely involving some kind of caregiver or grandparent, or possibly one other family.
I think nearly all reasonable people should agree by this point that letting your kids play with other kids in the neighborhood because they're bored or jealous is a really bad idea. But I don't think everyone who has contact with people outside their household for every reason (like childcare for essential workers) is a villain.
Huh? The question is about playing with neighbors, i.e. kids playing together. Nothing in my response touches on anything even close to that. Nobody has said anything remotely close to your last sentence.
There are two things being discussed in this thread, both are quite different (playing with the neighbors vs expanding your ‘family). Both seems to be met with the same level of outrage, which seems odd to me. But maybe that’s just the “no tolerance” stance that needs to be taken in times like this.
Hey, if you need a sibling or grandparent to move in with you to watch your child because you're essential worker who still needs to work outside the home, that's fine.
But no one in this thread has described that.
I think I described something similar in another thread if it wasn’t this one. Both my household and my parents household completely isolated for 3 weeks. None of us grocery shop or go anywhere. We have taken neighborhood walks but not at times when others are outside. 2.5 weeks ago we went to see a vacant home, but that is the only place any of us have been inside. We now see each other. They help provide child care so we can work. Even when they provide childcare, we mostly do it it outside weather permitting or distancing inside the home with my husband and I doing anything hands-on (like they will sit at opposite ends of a table from my son and talk to him while he plays legos, play charades, etc). My husband or I will still prepare food, put in the car seat, etc. We don’t touch, hug, etc. I do all the grocery ordering for all of us (we get either delivery or contact free pick up where they set on a table outside and then we carry to the car), and sanitize all of our packages/ perishables (they really don’t get how to do it / pick up food and I think I’m actually decreasing their risk by doing this for them vs them trying on their own). Anything nonperishable gets stored in the garage for an additional 3-4 days and then sanitized again. We thought we might need to pick up a generator today and since we would have to go inside a building, we would have started all over again for going inside a space that isn’t either of our homes. I personally think what we are doing is less of a risk than sending someone to the grocery store once week, but I understand other people are unable to get delivery/contact free pick up. I definitely don’t think it’s the same as letting my kid have play dates with another family, but maybe I’m just being defensive. We are not sleeping in the same household, though.
Post by Velar Fricative on Apr 9, 2020 14:53:37 GMT -5
It all comes down to one question - “Is there absolutely no better option than me/my family being exposed to someone else?” In some cases, yes - the single parent essential worker is a good example. No matter how trustworthy a caregiver, there is still a risk but it is an unavoidable one. Playdates just don’t meet that threshold.
bronxgirl, I didn’t realize some of those centers were shutting down due to lack of demand. Interesting to know.
bronxgirl I was just pointing out that I think you/the essential workers you described are likely being responsible about finding care so they don’t have to use the daycare centers.
Maybe I’m reading this wrong, but plenty of people on this thread seemed to be saying that regularly interacting with anyone outside your family for any reason was inexcusable.
Honestly, I cannot understand why anyone would take any unnecessary risk at this point. The thought of my kid needing to be hospitalized and me not being allowed to stay with her is terrifying. The reality would destroy me.
Disclaimer: I’m obviously not talking about front line workers who need child care. There are very, very limited circumstances in which additional risk is necessary - and I am grateful to those carrying that burden. The very least the rest of us can do is keep our asses home to help lessen their load.