600$ weekly UI bonus: why?

[SusanBAnthony]

I understand in general why they wanted to increase UI during this time, which I am 100% a fan of.

However- why did they make it a 600$ bonus payment and not increase the percentage to 80% of income (or something)? 

In states with generous UI programs, it creates an incentive to stay unemployed as you make more on UI than working below a certain income.  Not sure what that threshold is, but I think it is around 25-30$/hour here.  So it is affecting a good number of people. 

Does anyone know what the reasoning is for why they set it up this way?

[phunluvin82]

I don't really know, but I am guessing an across-the-board bonus payment that is a flat rate is a lot simpler and faster to administrate. I know at least a few states had websites repeatedly crashing, phone lines tied up for days/weeks, etc. I wonder if the administrative burden of doing anything other than 'x amount for everyone every week' was just going to be impossible given the unprecedented volume of claims.

[breezy8407]

PDQ. I can only say from a personal perspective I have a lot of feelings about it. I would be making more fully furloughed because of the additional $600, than I am working at 50% pay. A lot of coworkers have been really frustrated by it. We were initially told that because we had been reduced hours, we would be eligible for the $600. In MN this isn't true. On the other hand, I am happy there are additional funds available for those who need it through UI. What I don't like is that people in some cases, are taking home more pay than they were while working. I know this is the case with many of my furloughed coworkers. Not to stay the don't deserve it. The math on it is funny to me though. 

Personally I am trying to stay positive. My hope is that working currently, I will be first in line to come back to full time when we can. We are fine for now, but I worry that when/if it comes time for me to be fully furloughed, these funds will have expired. 

[maddiepaddy]

I don’t have an answer for you as to why it was set up this way.

But, I agree that it causes issues - especially for small businesses (particularly retail and restaurants). Many need to get back to full staffing levels by the end of June to get their PPP loans forgiven, but the $600 weekly bonus is hard to compete with in some markets. They’re going to end up having to hire and train completely new staff - composed primarily by people who have been shut out of UI for various reasons.

I’m all for a safety net, but it seems unwise to be allowing a ‘windfall’ for some while others are shut out or still struggling.

I have complaints about the PPP, too. I think in general, they had to rush to get something done (both UI and PPP) and didn’t have time to think through how it would all work together and be executed.

[jlt19]

I understand people being irked by being furloughed for less than what it pays, but when it runs out in July, you'll still have a job while 30+ million will be back to making a few hundred a week on UE and competing with each other with the few jobs hiring. It's a great short term bandaid for many, yes, but this will have negative effects for far longer than July in job market.

[yogione]

I was on UI during my 1 month furlough. If I chose not to go back to work when my employer opened our offices I would not be eligible for any UI anymore. No one can choose to stay unemployed or not go back to work if their job is available and make the $600+UI

[Kristinmo]

May 12, 2020 11:50:44 GMT -5 maddiepaddy said:

I don’t have an answer for you as to why it was set up this way.

But, I agree that it causes issues - especially for small businesses (particularly retail and restaurants). Many need to get back to full staffing levels by the end of June to get their PPP loans forgiven, but the $600 weekly bonus is hard to compete with in some markets. They’re going to end up having to hire and train completely new staff - composed primarily by people who have been shut out of UI for various reasons.

I’m all for a safety net, but it seems unwise to be allowing a ‘windfall’ for some while others are shut out or still struggling.

I have complaints about the PPP, too. I think in general, they had to rush to get something done (both UI and PPP) and didn’t have time to think through how it would all work together and be executed.

If people are recalled and refuse to go back, they are no longer eligible for unemployment.

[seeyalater52]

May 12, 2020 11:56:33 GMT -5 yogione said:

I was on UI during my 1 month furlough. If I chose not to go back to work when my employer opened our offices I would not be eligible for any UI anymore. No one can choose to stay unemployed or not go back to work if their job is available and make the $600+UI

This. It isn’t actually creating a disincentive to work because the “incentive” is only available if you are unemployed or furloughed, which isn’t a choice individuals get to make.

[maddiepaddy]

May 12, 2020 11:58:28 GMT -5 Kristinmo said:

May 12, 2020 11:50:44 GMT -5 maddiepaddy said:

I don’t have an answer for you as to why it was set up this way.

But, I agree that it causes issues - especially for small businesses (particularly retail and restaurants). Many need to get back to full staffing levels by the end of June to get their PPP loans forgiven, but the $600 weekly bonus is hard to compete with in some markets. They’re going to end up having to hire and train completely new staff - composed primarily by people who have been shut out of UI for various reasons.

I’m all for a safety net, but it seems unwise to be allowing a ‘windfall’ for some while others are shut out or still struggling.

I have complaints about the PPP, too. I think in general, they had to rush to get something done (both UI and PPP) and didn’t have time to think through how it would all work together and be executed.

If people are recalled and refuse to go back, they are no longer eligible for unemployment.

I think this varies by state and needs to be actively reported by the employer, which feels like a real asshole thing to do. Luckily, I haven’t actually faced this yet, but I anticipate that I might as we get closer to fully reopening.

As a small biz owner, I would not feel good reporting a return to work refusal, especially if their stated reason was feeling unsafe, etc. If they flat out said that they like the extra $600, I’d be more inclined, but still feel squicky about it.

[smock]

The $600 federal UI is a short-term band-aid for a long term problem. When that money runs out in July, tens of millions will still be out of work.

I don't worry at all that we're giving unemployed people too much money.

[Velar Fricative]

May 12, 2020 11:54:11 GMT -5 jlt19 said:

I understand people being irked by being furloughed for less than what it pays, but when it runs out in July, you'll still have a job while 30+ million will be back to making a few hundred a week on UE and competing with each other with the few jobs hiring. It's a great short term bandaid for many, yes, but this will have negative effects for far longer than July in job market.

Exactly this. I understand the irritation, no doubt. But when that extra money runs out, I would not want to be in the job market at the same time as millions of other people. Long-term, that $600 a week until July will not be as helpful as having a steady job and benefits through this ordeal, which we all know is going to continue well after July.

[maudefindlay]

AAM addresses this in a response to a poster. Basically the system is old and there was no time to individualize and $600 was the average, so some will make more, some less.

[morecoffeeplease]

Personally, this extra $600 is really helpful for my parents who own their own business. They don't have employees and their unemployment $ per week from the state is laughable. So this $600 will help them until they can open back up. I can assure everyone that they won't not work just to get this 600 a week. They are still stressed AF and can't wait to be able to (safely) open.

[morecoffeeplease]

May 12, 2020 11:56:33 GMT -5 yogione said:

I was on UI during my 1 month furlough. If I chose not to go back to work when my employer opened our offices I would not be eligible for any UI anymore. No one can choose to stay unemployed or not go back to work if their job is available and make the $600+UI

Also, this.

[SusanBAnthony]

May 12, 2020 11:58:28 GMT -5 Kristinmo said:

May 12, 2020 11:50:44 GMT -5 maddiepaddy said:

I don’t have an answer for you as to why it was set up this way.

But, I agree that it causes issues - especially for small businesses (particularly retail and restaurants). Many need to get back to full staffing levels by the end of June to get their PPP loans forgiven, but the $600 weekly bonus is hard to compete with in some markets. They’re going to end up having to hire and train completely new staff - composed primarily by people who have been shut out of UI for various reasons.

I’m all for a safety net, but it seems unwise to be allowing a ‘windfall’ for some while others are shut out or still struggling.

I have complaints about the PPP, too. I think in general, they had to rush to get something done (both UI and PPP) and didn’t have time to think through how it would all work together and be executed.

If people are recalled and refuse to go back, they are no longer eligible for unemployment.

It is causing huge issues with morale in my larger company. People are NOT happy that laid off folks are making more. And yes they should stop getting UI of they refuse to return, but given the flood of applications I can't see that getting checked up on right now.

[SusanBAnthony]

May 12, 2020 12:50:27 GMT -5 morecoffeeplease said:

Personally, this extra $600 is really helpful for my parents who own their own business. They don't have employees and their unemployment $ per week from the state is laughable. So this $600 will help them until they can open back up. I can assure everyone that they won't not work just to get this 600 a week. They are still stressed AF and can't wait to be able to (safely) open.

Some states have such low max UI that it makes sense. I don't think anyone has a problem with UI getting increased in those states. The issues come in the states that have higher UI.

[SusanBAnthony]

May 12, 2020 12:28:48 GMT -5 Velar Fricative said:

May 12, 2020 11:54:11 GMT -5 jlt19 said:

I understand people being irked by being furloughed for less than what it pays, but when it runs out in July, you'll still have a job while 30+ million will be back to making a few hundred a week on UE and competing with each other with the few jobs hiring. It's a great short term bandaid for many, yes, but this will have negative effects for far longer than July in job market.

Exactly this. I understand the irritation, no doubt. But when that extra money runs out, I would not want to be in the job market at the same time as millions of other people. Long-term, that $600 a week until July will not be as helpful as having a steady job and benefits through this ordeal, which we all know is going to continue well after July.

It is for sure true that it will run out and there will be pain.

[morecoffeeplease]

May 12, 2020 13:40:07 GMT -5 SusanBAnthony said:

May 12, 2020 12:50:27 GMT -5 morecoffeeplease said:

Personally, this extra $600 is really helpful for my parents who own their own business. They don't have employees and their unemployment $ per week from the state is laughable. So this $600 will help them until they can open back up. I can assure everyone that they won't not work just to get this 600 a week. They are still stressed AF and can't wait to be able to (safely) open.

Some states have such low max UI that it makes sense. I don't think anyone has a problem with UI getting increased in those states. The issues come in the states that have higher UI.

I think the thought of "why go back to work when you can make UI and $600 a month" is playing right into the GOP playbook (Lindsey Graham). I don't know one person personally, out of everyone I know who has had to go through UI in the last two months, say they don't want to go back to work.

I don't think that the $600 a week solves any problems but I don't think the above thought it as prevalent as people make it out to be. 

[seeyalater52]

May 12, 2020 13:38:43 GMT -5 SusanBAnthony said:

May 12, 2020 11:58:28 GMT -5 Kristinmo said:

If people are recalled and refuse to go back, they are no longer eligible for unemployment.

It is causing huge issues with morale in my larger company. People are NOT happy that laid off folks are making more. And yes they should stop getting UI of they refuse to return, but given the flood of applications I can't see that getting checked up on right now.

States are doing absolutely everything they can to lower their own unemployment costs. They are absolutely verifying eligibility, sometimes to the detriment of people getting their IU benefits at all or in a timely manner.

Honestly this sounds like an issue with how your company is handling the situation, not an issue with the unemployment payments, which are a drop in the bucket/bandaid on a bullet wound compared to the real financial needs of people during this time.

[breezy8407]

In our case, it has turned out to be a team morale issue as well. Its hard to not get emotional when it comes to your livelihood. And I don't blame them for that. I've been there. I was unemployed for most of 2010, so I know that its scary and no matter what logic could be applied, I felt ashamed. I had so many people give me the "bootstraps" treatment. Its not that simple and everyone has a different situation.

[mysteriouswife]

TN weekly rate caps at $275 and the min is $33 a week. If an additional $600 is given so be it. UI rates are bit inline with true salaries. Hell, Nashville is not up to par with wages as fast as we grew. We are MCOL if not on the verge of HCOL.

I am currently Ui and I am not making what I make in a normal week. I have applied for jobs and only snagged one interview. I was over qualified and did not get the job. When July comes I don’t know what my family will do. Our saving grace is childcare cost are eliminated right now. We are saving those funds in hopes I can find something once school starts.

[morecoffeeplease]

May 12, 2020 13:54:31 GMT -5 seeyalater52 said:

May 12, 2020 13:38:43 GMT -5 SusanBAnthony said:

It is causing huge issues with morale in my larger company. People are NOT happy that laid off folks are making more. And yes they should stop getting UI of they refuse to return, but given the flood of applications I can't see that getting checked up on right now.

States are doing absolutely everything they can to lower their own unemployment costs. They are absolutely verifying eligibility, sometimes to the detriment of people getting their IU benefits at all or in a timely manner.

Honestly this sounds like an issue with how your company is handling the situation, not an issue with the unemployment payments, which are a drop in the bucket/bandaid on a bullet wound compared to the real financial needs of people during this time.

Yes, my god. My parents had to shut down their business March 14th. They don't know how to do shit on a computer that requires more than email and browsing so I applied for them. First we applied for regular unemployment because the state didn't give out good directions and tell us we shouldn't. It took over 4 weeks for my parents to be denied. Finally the state set up the COVID unemployment system (I am in NO WAY blaming the state because they HAD to set up a new system according to the department of labor). So we were finally able to apply for that. It took me 5 hours to do that and my parents case was uncomplicated. That was one month ago. My parents got their first unemployment deposit this morning. They have had zero income since March 14th. According to a state run twitter account people have had so many issues applying. My parents are considered lucky that they got their first deposit this morning. I feel so lucky and they have had no income in almost 2 months!

I have a master's degree and I joke that my life's crowning achievement is getting them approved for unemployment in the middle of a pandemic. 

Ugh. I need to stop. I'm just really annoyed at this idea that UI is so much money and so easy to get. 

[seeyalater52]

May 12, 2020 13:45:18 GMT -5 morecoffeeplease said:

May 12, 2020 13:40:07 GMT -5 SusanBAnthony said:

Some states have such low max UI that it makes sense. I don't think anyone has a problem with UI getting increased in those states. The issues come in the states that have higher UI.

I think the thought of "why go back to work when you can make UI and $600 a month" is playing right into the GOP playbook (Lindsey Graham). I don't know one person personally, out of everyone I know who has had to go through UI in the last two months, say they don't want to go back to work.

I don't think that the $600 a week solves any problems but I don't think the above thought it as prevalent as people make it out to be. 

This is absolutely a conservative trope. It’s really frustrating to see otherwise educated people falling into this mindset. Believe me, I spend all damn day combatting this line of thinking as part of the decades-long assault against safety net services (in my case usually Medicaid but it’s also used to justify cuts to UI, SNAP, TANF etc.) There is absolutely no evidence that providing benefits (cash or otherwise) disincentivizes work.

[morecoffeeplease]

I should stop but I can't.

When Lindsey Graham came out and said why would people go back to work when they are getting an extra $600 a week, I couldn't stop crying because of my parents. I was honestly scared that my dad would died from a heart attack because he was so stressed out. I was sick that someone tried to make it seem like people like my dad were living the high life. Fuck that.

I know I'm emotionally charged but I want to share the stress and worry because it's real and it's happening to a lot of people right now.

[breezy8407]

morecoffeeplease I understand. Its not a lot of money. I am glad you were able to help your parents and they are finally getting some payments.

ETA: my parents are small business owners (retail) and I am worried about their livelihood, where as two months ago it was the complete opposite. 

[morecoffeeplease]

May 12, 2020 14:27:45 GMT -5 breezy8407 said:

morecoffeeplease I understand. Its not a lot of money. I am glad you were able to help your parents and they are finally getting some payments.

Thank you. I seriously feel so lucky that I happen to be one of the people that was able to get everything through and approved. I checked the UC website multiple times a day. No one can even get through to get their questions answered. People were emailing questions and would get a response that it would take up to 18 days to get their questions answered. I feel so thankful that, even though it took 2 months, I was able to accomplish it without the ADDED stress of trying to get a wrongful denial overturned or the added stress of trying to contact someone in the unemployment office. It's a fucking mess right now. 

[morecoffeeplease]

May 12, 2020 14:27:45 GMT -5 breezy8407 said:

morecoffeeplease I understand. Its not a lot of money. I am glad you were able to help your parents and they are finally getting some payments.

ETA: my parents are small business owners (retail) and I am worried about their livelihood, where as two months ago it was the complete opposite. 

I just saw your edit. Good luck to your parents. I hope they are able to weather this storm.

[NewOrleans]

I don’t have it in me to be confrontational but for God’s sake. Can you not see the cruelty on what you are saying and suggesting?
People who took a pay cut are suffering. People who lost their jobs or have indefinite full furlough are suffering. One has a job but less money. The other has no job and more money until July, and only any money at all for like 6 months. These are pretty equal sufferings.

SBA, you have been really upsetting the last few months. I don’t remember you ever saying the things you’ve said, in all these years. Are you well?

[breezy8407]

May 12, 2020 14:34:01 GMT -5 morecoffeeplease said:

May 12, 2020 14:27:45 GMT -5 breezy8407 said:

morecoffeeplease I understand. Its not a lot of money. I am glad you were able to help your parents and they are finally getting some payments.

ETA: my parents are small business owners (retail) and I am worried about their livelihood, where as two months ago it was the complete opposite. 

I just saw your edit. Good luck to your parents. I hope they are able to weather this storm.

Thank you. I am grateful for all we have each day, because I know it could be worse. 

[docholly]

Yes, it helps because the money will run out in July. Yes, it helps close the gap in the states with low unemployment payments. Also, with a little extra money in their pockets, it may encourage people to spend money (trickle up effect). Also, during a pandemic we sort of want to encourage some people to stay home... Less people working helps lower the R-naught.