its the fact that these two episodes highlight violence and fear against children specifically.
I wouldn't be AS creeped if it were just TWD (unless the rape episode was her favorite) but its the violence towards children that another child is enjoying that I have an issue with.
I think it's weird that she's sitting down to watch these episodes with attentiveness. That would make me turn it the fuck off and say, uhm no, watch Jake and these pirates or whatever the fuck it's called.
Most of the people in my house are old enough to watch most things with parental supervision. If we had to wait for the baby to go to bed or do something else, we wouldn't watch a damned thing. So shit is usually on while he wandering around. But if I caught him all absorbed and shit, we'd have to watch something else.
its the fact that these two episodes highlight violence and fear against children specifically.
I wouldn't be AS creeped if it were just TWD (unless the rape episode was her favorite) but its the violence towards children that another child is enjoying that I have an issue with.
More than likely the kid doesn't realize that the zombie kid is dead. Nor does she get that there is anything else happening to the children in the other episodes other than "Hey, there are kids on tv!"
If she was older and was scared of what was on the tv and they kept watching, ok, yeah, they need to stop. As it is she doesn't understand that there is something to be scared about since the parents aren't scared.
IDK. These particular episodes that the child is watching involves the zombie kids getting shot in the head. And its not cartoony, fake looking violence.
I really don't want to get into a discussion about kids and what is appropriate.
I will say that if you don't present things as being scary then they won't be scary to a child. ZB's favorite past time was walking through the haunted house and poking the fake zombies in the eyes. When it was all set up we took her through with everyone in it. She had a blast.
OK, but......TWD presents the zombie apocalypse as being pretty fucking scary. I don't think any amount of parental grinning and insisting "it's FAKE, honey!!!" is going to undo that.
Yeah, but if the parents aren't jumping around screaming, and are reacting normally to a tv show, the kid isn't going to realize that what is happening on tv is supposed to be scary. They're just just people who look funny.
I'm trying to remember the term for it... conditional fear response? Such as fear of spiders. Most kids aren't scared of spiders until they're told to be scared of spiders - like mom jumping and screaming when she sees one.
its the fact that these two episodes highlight violence and fear against children specifically.
I wouldn't be AS creeped if it were just TWD (unless the rape episode was her favorite) but its the violence towards children that another child is enjoying that I have an issue with.
More than likely the kid doesn't realize that the zombie kid is dead. Nor does she get that there is anything else happening to the children in the other episodes other than "Hey, there are kids on tv!"
If she was older and was scared of what was on the tv and they kept watching, ok, yeah, they need to stop. As it is she doesn't understand that there is something to be scared about since the parents aren't scared.
I think for me, a person who does not like scary anything, the concern I have about that show at that age is that kids slide into greater consciousness of death/life/reality vs. tv/scary at varying ages. And that show is particularly violent (I did try to watch it because the story line is so interesting, but I found the, to me, "gross" stuff too distracting). So you can't know when/if your kid will become afraid of it/internalize it in a different way. I'm also sensitive to this issue since my own child (who is 5) recently became aware of circle of life things in a new way that scared her. You know?
And, particularly, the OP has not herself watched it so it was very tra la la, oh, is that bad? Kinda Steve Erkel "did I do that?" Whether or not you think it's appropriate (and I fall on the side of "no"), you should at least be thinking about it carefully.
More than likely the kid doesn't realize that the zombie kid is dead. Nor does she get that there is anything else happening to the children in the other episodes other than "Hey, there are kids on tv!"
If she was older and was scared of what was on the tv and they kept watching, ok, yeah, they need to stop. As it is she doesn't understand that there is something to be scared about since the parents aren't scared.
I don't understand how this is a plus. If a child was witnessing actual violence, and the other adults acted all passive and unemotional about it, that would teach a kid a lot about how violence is commonplace and normal.
Is this the video game argument? That if kids see violence they become desensitized and want to perform violence? There's been a handful of new studies that show that this isn't true.
OK, but......TWD presents the zombie apocalypse as being pretty fucking scary. I don't think any amount of parental grinning and insisting "it's FAKE, honey!!!" is going to undo that.
Yeah, but if the parents aren't jumping around screaming, and are reacting normally to a tv show, the kid isn't going to realize that what is happening on tv is supposed to be scary. They're just just people who look funny.
I'm trying to remember the term for it... conditional fear response? Such as fear of spiders. Most kids aren't scared of spiders until they're told to be scared of spiders - like mom jumping and screaming when she sees one.
But wouldn't the same effect happened in reverse? Like if no one responded to the violence, would a kid think it was normal then?
At this point, I'm just having a philosophical conversation given my children have watched all kinds of questionable shit. Just not The Walking Dead because we gave up on that show years ago.
And, particularly, the OP has not herself watched it so it was very tra la la, oh, is that bad? Kinda Steve Erkel "did I do that?" Whether or not you think it's appropriate (and I fall on the side of "no"), you should at least be thinking about it carefully.
This I definitely agree with. I'm also side eyeing the whole, but she asks for it and gets upset when we say no.
So what happens when the kid develops a fascination the Tyrion Lannister? I mean those Lannister guard helmets are pretty bad ass and there are dragons so it's okay, right? I mean it's just two episodes and one of them has a wedding!
More than likely the kid doesn't realize that the zombie kid is dead. Nor does she get that there is anything else happening to the children in the other episodes other than "Hey, there are kids on tv!"
If she was older and was scared of what was on the tv and they kept watching, ok, yeah, they need to stop. As it is she doesn't understand that there is something to be scared about since the parents aren't scared.
I think for me, a person who does not like scary anything, the concern I have about that show at that age is that kids slide into greater consciousness of death/life/reality vs. tv/scary at varying ages. And that show is particularly violent (I did try to watch it because the story line is so interesting, but I found the, to me, "gross" stuff too distracting). So you can't know when/if your kid will become afraid of it/internalize it in a different way. I'm also sensitive to this issue since my own child (who is 5) recently became aware of circle of life things in a new way that scared her. You know?
And, particularly, the OP has not herself watched it so it was very tra la la, oh, is that bad? Kinda Steve Erkel "did I do that?" Whether or not you think it's appropriate (and I fall on the side of "no"), you should at least be thinking about it carefully.
A lot of that is brain development, and starting to become more aware of what is happening in the world.
I would imagine that if her kid does suddenly become afraid of zombies that she would stop showing the child zombies. Much like people stopped their kids from watching Frozen, or Fern Gully.
Yeah, but if the parents aren't jumping around screaming, and are reacting normally to a tv show, the kid isn't going to realize that what is happening on tv is supposed to be scary. They're just just people who look funny.
I'm trying to remember the term for it... conditional fear response? Such as fear of spiders. Most kids aren't scared of spiders until they're told to be scared of spiders - like mom jumping and screaming when she sees one.
But wouldn't the same effect happened in reverse? Like if no one responded to the violence, would a kid think it was normal then?
At this point, I'm just having a philosophical conversation given my children have watched all kinds of questionable shit. Just not The Walking Dead because we gave up on that show years ago.
Again, going back to the video game argument, no. Mostly because there are other "real world" clues that you can't go around curb stomping someone's head.
And, particularly, the OP has not herself watched it so it was very tra la la, oh, is that bad? Kinda Steve Erkel "did I do that?" Whether or not you think it's appropriate (and I fall on the side of "no"), you should at least be thinking about it carefully.
This I definitely agree with. I'm also side eyeing the whole, but she asks for it and gets upset when we say no.
So what happens when the kid develops a fascination the Tyrion Lannister? I mean those Lannister guard helmets are pretty bad ass and there are dragons so it's okay, right? I mean it's just two episodes and one of them has a wedding!
oh and I had to look it up but the episode with the deer also starts out with a herd of zombies trying to eat everyone hiding under cars and the other little girl on the show gets scared and runs away and they never find her. so think terrified little girl hiding in the woods and then a deer and kid shot and killed at the end.
Is this the video game argument? That if kids see violence they become desensitized and want to perform violence? There's been a handful of new studies that show that this isn't true.
There has got to be a line though, right? I mean when we're talking about video games, we are usually talking about 14 year olds and stylized violence.
Kids in shitty ass violent neighborhoods do get PTSD and are desensitized in many ways to the emotions of others.
That being said, a kid watching TWD would likely become desensitized to zombies which I mean, okay. That's one more kid who will survive the zombie apocalypse, right?
I think for me, a person who does not like scary anything, the concern I have about that show at that age is that kids slide into greater consciousness of death/life/reality vs. tv/scary at varying ages. And that show is particularly violent (I did try to watch it because the story line is so interesting, but I found the, to me, "gross" stuff too distracting). So you can't know when/if your kid will become afraid of it/internalize it in a different way. I'm also sensitive to this issue since my own child (who is 5) recently became aware of circle of life things in a new way that scared her. You know?
And, particularly, the OP has not herself watched it so it was very tra la la, oh, is that bad? Kinda Steve Erkel "did I do that?" Whether or not you think it's appropriate (and I fall on the side of "no"), you should at least be thinking about it carefully.
A lot of that is brain development, and starting to become more aware of what is happening in the world.
I would imagine that if her kid does suddenly become afraid of zombies that she would stop showing the child zombies. Much like people stopped their kids from watching Frozen, or Fern Gully.
Sure. But I think, and this is not based on any studies therefore I have no CEP-worthy evidence, that it's likely easier for a child to place cartoon scary Hans in context and carry that forward with less fear than it is to do with images of a child zombie/child getting shot. So while any kid can become afraid of anything they watch, one of these fears is easier to understand and reframe for them than the other.
Again, for me, that show is a bridge too far. But I let my kid watch cartoons of Batman beating the crap out of bad guys (some of them, I've nixed quite a few) so I'm certainly no Tipper Gore.
And, particularly, the OP has not herself watched it so it was very tra la la, oh, is that bad? Kinda Steve Erkel "did I do that?" Whether or not you think it's appropriate (and I fall on the side of "no"), you should at least be thinking about it carefully.
This I definitely agree with. I'm also side eyeing the whole, but she asks for it and gets upset when we say no.
So what happens when the kid develops a fascination the Tyrion Lannister? I mean those Lannister guard helmets are pretty bad ass and there are dragons so it's okay, right? I mean it's just two episodes and one of them has a wedding!
My daughter (4.5) caught a glimpse of Daenarys while MH and I were watching a Game of Thrones preview and now wants a Daenarys-themed birthday. I'm REALLY hoping she forgets about that over the next couple months.
Is this the video game argument? That if kids see violence they become desensitized and want to perform violence? There's been a handful of new studies that show that this isn't true.
I didn't say anything about wanting to perform violence. But you're making the argument that the kids model the parent's reactions. I don't find it a positive (or neutral) thing for a three year old to be blase about this level of violence and gore and hopelessness, to normalize it. I find it MORE disturbing that her kid isn't frightened by it.
Why? She's 3. She has no basis on which to base her fear. She doesn't understand the complex storyline behind what is happening on the screen. She has no other experience than what she's seeing on the screen are kids like her. The end.
I'm a little disturbed that you want to assign adult reactions to a 3 yo.
Post by penguingrrl on Apr 8, 2015 10:00:02 GMT -5
At 3 I would imagine she doesn't have enough concept of life and death to really understand what is going on in the show the way an adult or older child would process it. So I'm not surprised she's not scared. At some point she will begin to awaken to the reality of the finality of death and what it means and then it may scare her. At which time I presume her parents will turn it off.
A friend of my girls watches it, has been watching it with her dad for a long time and taught my girls the concept of zombies. Even my wimpy kids who are terrified of Brave handled that concept without a problem. I won't let them watch TWD because I know they can't handle it, but there are certainly kids who can and won't grow up to be murderers because of it.
At three, my kid still thinks dead is something you wake up from. He's dead and then he isn't.
but again, I'm kind of whatever on things for two and three year olds that I wouldn't allow a 5 or 6 year old anywhere near.
For instance, the kids watched Robot Chicken all the time when they were two or three. But once I felt they were old enough to even kind of understand anything going on, they haven't seen it since and they are 11 and 13. It will be another four or five years before they are allowed to watch it again.
At 3 I would imagine she doesn't have enough concept of life and death to really understand what is going on in the show the way an adult or older child would process it. So I'm not surprised she's not scared. At some point she will begin to awaken to the reality of the finality of death and what it means and then it may scare her. At which time I presume her parents will turn it off.
A friend of my girls watches it, has been watching it with her dad for a long time and taught my girls the concept of zombies. Even my wimpy kids who are terrified of Brave handled that concept without a problem. I won't let them watch TWD because I know they can't handle it, but there are certainly kids who can and won't grow up to be murderers because of it.
I am more concerned about the lack of empathy the kid might develop.
that combined with a "we let her do whatever the fuck she wants" lead my mind to think that being a sociopath isn't out of the question
Empathy is something that kids develop with human interaction. Not what they see on the screen.
I didn't get the vibe that she was letting her kid do anything. Just that her kid requested it and they didn't see the big deal about letting her watch it.
LOL sociopath. The things people blow out of proportion around here. I guess we haven't had a good mommywar in a while.
At three, my kid still thinks dead is something you wake up from. He's dead and then he isn't.
but again, I'm kind of whatever on things for two and three year olds that I wouldn't allow a 5 or 6 year old anywhere near.
For instance, the kids watched Robot Chicken all the time when they were two or three. But once I felt they were old enough to even kind of understand anything going on, they haven't seen it since and they are 11 and 13. It will be another four or five years before they are allowed to watch it again.
But they let this kid watch the show because she "really wanted to." I'm not exactly confident that when she gets to be 5 or 6, they'll say "sorry, you can't watch this anymore." Which of course is the real problem here.
Why? She's 3. She has no basis on which to base her fear. She doesn't understand the complex storyline behind what is happening on the screen. She has no other experience than what she's seeing on the screen are kids like her. The end.
I'm a little disturbed that you want to assign adult reactions to a 3 yo.
....what?
Bloody growling little girl gets graphically shot by a police officer. I have to be an adult to be scared by that?
Its a conditioned response, so... yes? A 3 yo hasn't developed the mental ability to work through the reasoning about why this should be scary.
Huh. And here I thought letting your three-year-old watch graphic violence against children would be a unity horse. Shows what I know.
I'm not saying that they should let her watch it. My entire point is that she's not going to be emotionally scarred at 3, nor is she going to grow up to be a sociopath.
At 3 I would imagine she doesn't have enough concept of life and death to really understand what is going on in the show the way an adult or older child would process it. So I'm not surprised she's not scared. At some point she will begin to awaken to the reality of the finality of death and what it means and then it may scare her. At which time I presume her parents will turn it off.
A friend of my girls watches it, has been watching it with her dad for a long time and taught my girls the concept of zombies. Even my wimpy kids who are terrified of Brave handled that concept without a problem. I won't let them watch TWD because I know they can't handle it, but there are certainly kids who can and won't grow up to be murderers because of it.
I am more concerned about the lack of empathy the kid might develop.
that combined with a "we let her do whatever the fuck she wants" lead my mind to think that being a sociopath isn't out of the question
I think you're giving TV a lot of power here. While TV shows with good lessons can certainly reinforce things like empathy I also think it's up to people the child interacts with in real life to instill those values. If a parent is doing their job and setting limits and teaching those values watching a TV show that doesn't reinforce them in addition to other shows isn't going to impact this.
And I honestly don't think that saying yes to a show she didn't think was that bad because the kid wants to see it means she's setting no limits and teaching no empathy. Seems like a huuuuuge stretch to me. I pick my battles with my kids and give in on more than I ever thought I would and yet so far none of my three are showing signs of being sociopaths.
Also, there is research that shows that some things, like snakes and spiders, have an inherent "scary" factor. Our brains are wired to quickly and easily learn that these are things to be afraid of, and that fear lasts longer, more so than random objects or creatures. Not all fear is taught.
I'm not saying that they should let her watch it. My entire point is that she's not going to be emotionally scarred at 3, nor is she going to grow up to be a sociopath.
And I don't think either one of us knows this child well enough to make that assumption. I'm not sure even the PARENTS know enough about her cognitive process to make this assumption, which is why generally speaking parents err on the side of caution in this regard.
Then why the 7 page thread calling her a bad parent? LOL!
It's a tv show. She's not showing any fear about what she's been shown.
I think you're giving TV a lot of power here. While TV shows with good lessons can certainly reinforce things like empathy I also think it's up to people the child interacts with in real life to instill those values. If a parent is doing their job and setting limits and teaching those values watching a TV show that doesn't reinforce them in addition to other shows isn't going to impact this.
And I honestly don't think that saying yes to a show she didn't think was that bad because the kid wants to see it means she's setting no limits and teaching no empathy. Seems like a huuuuuge stretch to me. I pick my battles with my kids and give in on more than I ever thought I would and yet so far none of my three are showing signs of being sociopaths.
I think TV has a HUGE influence and I err on the side of caution
I think TV has influence, but I also don't think it can entirely undo good parenting.
I thought she was getting a lot of shit because she admitted that she herself didn't even watch the show, so even she didn't know what her kid was watching. At least, that's what *I* was totally side eyeing.