Classified documents found at Penn Biden Center in DC

[NewOrleans]

can everyone just not fucking take classified documents? wtf. 

interesting how it didn’t make the news for midterms. 

President Biden's personal attorneys have discovered classified documents among what appear to be Obama-era records when the current president was vice president, according to a statement from Richard Sauber, the special counsel to the president.

Biden's attorneys found the documents while packing other materials in a locked closet at the Penn Biden Center in Washington, D.C., before the midterm elections and the National Archives were notified the same day, CBS first reported. The Archives collected the documents the following morning and the matter is under review by the Justice Department.

www.npr.org/2023/01/09/1147977922/classified-documents-biden-doj-archives

[suburbanzookeeper]

Ugh.

[sonrisa]

Jan 9, 2023 21:58:35 GMT -5 NewOrleans said:

can everyone just not fucking take classified documents? wtf. 

I second this.

[pumpkin]

Jan 10, 2023 0:50:27 GMT -5 sonrisa said:

Jan 9, 2023 21:58:35 GMT -5 NewOrleans said:

can everyone just not fucking take classified documents? wtf. 

I second this.

Yeah, I’m here.

[SwimDeep]

Saw this on the nightly news last night and appreciated the effort they made to point out the differences between the actions of the Biden team (following protocol and immediately notifying the right people) vs TFG (hiding, denying, delaying, obstructing, etc).

The guy they had on said there were clear differences in intent, so the DOJ investigations into each would look very different.

The optics are still horrible 😕

[bcv513]

I just don’t understand how everyone can be so free and loose with classified documents. I work for the state and our records retention policy is so explicit. We have to get so many sign offs before anything can be sent to off site storage.

[erbear]

Of course these aren’t the same…and it doesn’t fucking matter when you’re trying to show that you respect the government. Jesus. What is wrong with people?! I am so disappointed with this.

[underwaterrhymes]

Ugghhhhhhhhh.

I saw this last night and was just so irritated. Even though there seem to be differences, it’s just fuel for the fire.

[rupertpenny]

Jan 10, 2023 6:44:49 GMT -5 bcv513 said:

I just don’t understand how everyone can be so free and loose with classified documents. I work for the state and our records retention policy is so explicit. We have to get so many sign offs before anything can be sent to off site storage.

I am also exasperated that this keeps happening, but not surprised because so few people care about records management 

It sounds like instances of classified records ending up in the wrong place is mostly happening while the records are active and before they might be sent offsite. I can imagine that if the governor of your state asked for access to any active records, or brought records with them to some inappropriate place, it would be hard for staff to stop them. It seems like that's the real problem in many of these cases; people don't understand/respect records management and/or no one wants to tell the boss they shouldn't do something. 

[mrsd2006]

We'll never hear the end of this. No matter the differences.

[carmenere]

Jan 10, 2023 9:32:58 GMT -5 rupertpenny said:

Jan 10, 2023 6:44:49 GMT -5 bcv513 said:

I just don’t understand how everyone can be so free and loose with classified documents. I work for the state and our records retention policy is so explicit. We have to get so many sign offs before anything can be sent to off site storage.

I am also exasperated that this keeps happening, but not surprised because so few people care about records management 

It sounds like instances of classified records ending up in the wrong place is mostly happening while the records are active and before they might be sent offsite. I can imagine that if the governor of your state asked for access to any active records, or brought records with them to some inappropriate place, it would be hard for staff to stop them. It seems like that's the real problem in many of these cases; people don't understand/respect records management and/or no one wants to tell the boss they shouldn't do something. 

I do wonder how and when this happened, and what the documents pertained to (obviously that's unlikely to be answered). I've seen them referred to as documents from his time as VP, but that didn't overlap with his his time using the office. I know former presidents (besides TFG) can still get classified briefings after they leave office, but can former VPs?

[mcsangel2]

They found more, in a different location this time. Like, I'm all for them investigating the heck out of all this, but this, especially having found more in a different place, seems weird to me. Before Trump, I don't remember ever hearing about this kind of thing happening?

[carmenere]

Jan 11, 2023 17:39:43 GMT -5 mcsangel2 said:

They found more, in a different location this time. Like, I'm all for them investigating the heck out of all this, but this, especially having found more in a different place, seems weird to me. Before Trump, I don't remember ever hearing about this kind of thing happening?

I am certain it’s not a new occurrence, especially if you think back to the days when everything was on paper and files had to be brought to presidents wherever they were. I think it’s just that past instances were handled more quietly - in past decades documents in a former presidential office wouldn’t have captured the average American’s attention. The reason Trump’s documents became a big story was because he put up a fight about it and also the media was always eager for a story about him.

[basilosaurus]

Jan 11, 2023 22:46:56 GMT -5 carmenere said:

Jan 11, 2023 17:39:43 GMT -5 mcsangel2 said:

They found more, in a different location this time. Like, I'm all for them investigating the heck out of all this, but this, especially having found more in a different place, seems weird to me. Before Trump, I don't remember ever hearing about this kind of thing happening?

I am certain it’s not a new occurrence, especially if you think back to the days when everything was on paper and files had to be brought to presidents wherever they were. I think it’s just that past instances were handled more quietly - in past decades documents in a former presidential office wouldn’t have captured the average American’s attention. The reason Trump’s documents became a big story was because he put up a fight about it and also the media was always eager for a story about him.

Yes I imagine this has always happened. I've witnessed how careless people can be about discussing things in public. With docs if you're handling multiple classifieds day in day out it's not surprising some get lost in the daily shuffle.

So partly it's due to a desire to paint tfg in a bad (deserved) light. But I can also see promoting this story was a both sides ism to take pressure off him. Obviously they're different but one side has an interest in making them seem the same

[carmenere]

Jan 12, 2023 1:54:27 GMT -5 basilosaurus said:

Jan 11, 2023 22:46:56 GMT -5 carmenere said:

I am certain it’s not a new occurrence, especially if you think back to the days when everything was on paper and files had to be brought to presidents wherever they were. I think it’s just that past instances were handled more quietly - in past decades documents in a former presidential office wouldn’t have captured the average American’s attention. The reason Trump’s documents became a big story was because he put up a fight about it and also the media was always eager for a story about him.

Yes I imagine this has always happened. I've witnessed how careless people can be about discussing things in public. With docs if you're handling multiple classifieds day in day out it's not surprising some get lost in the daily shuffle.

So partly it's due to a desire to paint tfg in a bad (deserved) light. But I can also see promoting this story was a both sides ism to take pressure off him. Obviously they're different but one side has an interest in making them seem the same

Yes - and likewise Biden has an interest in radical transparency. It sounds like his team went looking to make sure there were no documents left elsewhere, and then they had to proactively announce it before the right wing media did.

I'm sure in most cases it's not the president or VP being careless with docs, it's delegated to an overworked aide juggling a ton of things in the midst of frequent travel and changing plans. I sure wouldn't want that job.

[rupertpenny]

Jan 11, 2023 17:39:43 GMT -5 mcsangel2 said:

They found more, in a different location this time. Like, I'm all for them investigating the heck out of all this, but this, especially having found more in a different place, seems weird to me. Before Trump, I don't remember ever hearing about this kind of thing happening?

I don't think this is surprising at all. Very few people are good at keeping track of their own records, especially at work. Most of us just don't happen to have a security clearance. 

[dulcemariamar]

I don’t live in the States so it is hard to really get a true understanding of what is happening there but do people who usually vote Democrat want Biden to run for a second term? How bad would it be for Democrat chances if he stepped down and someone else was picked to run?

[Jalapeñomel]

Jan 12, 2023 11:54:43 GMT -5 dulcemariamar said:

I don’t live in the States so it is hard to really get a true understanding of what is happening there but do people who usually vote Democrat want Biden to run for a second term? How bad would it be for Democrat chances if he stepped down and someone else was picked to run?

Most dems I know would like a new candidate to run. 

[basilosaurus]

Jan 12, 2023 11:55:40 GMT -5 Jalapeñomel said:

Jan 12, 2023 11:54:43 GMT -5 dulcemariamar said:

I don’t live in the States so it is hard to really get a true understanding of what is happening there but do people who usually vote Democrat want Biden to run for a second term? How bad would it be for Democrat chances if he stepped down and someone else was picked to run?

Most dems I know would like a new candidate to run. 

I think it's anyone but a republican. People I know who were never partisan feel this.

Weirdly, not in America, I just had a brit saying anything but Harris. He couldn't articulate why which says everything

[heat40]

As much as this doesn’t look great for Biden, the fast movement on it, cooperation, DOJ involvement etc. Makes trump’s case look worse. Biden is doing what is supposed to be done, which makes it easier for the DOJ to continue fighting trump. It’s standard procedure but also good strategy.

[cous0226]

The next 2 years will be a circus and this just lit DT up for material to run on. Biden will need to explain this over and over because every 2024 candidate will grasp at this. We all know the media is excited about this why is why Biden needs to have a strategy. It can’t be mumbling a few words at a presser about it. This really sucks.

[prettyinpearls]

Jan 12, 2023 13:32:29 GMT -5 heat40 said:

As much as this doesn’t look great for Biden, the fast movement on it, cooperation, DOJ involvement etc. Makes trump’s case look worse. Biden is doing what is supposed to be done, which makes it easier for the DOJ to continue fighting trump. It’s standard procedure but also good strategy.

 I was reading speculation on Twitter that the quick assignment of a Special Counsel for Biden's investigation doesn't bode well for Trump, either. 

[TR]

Jan 12, 2023 14:00:17 GMT -5 prettyinpearls said:

Jan 12, 2023 13:32:29 GMT -5 heat40 said:

As much as this doesn’t look great for Biden, the fast movement on it, cooperation, DOJ involvement etc. Makes trump’s case look worse. Biden is doing what is supposed to be done, which makes it easier for the DOJ to continue fighting trump. It’s standard procedure but also good strategy.

 I was reading speculation on Twitter that the quick assignment of a Special Counsel for Biden's investigation doesn't bode well for Trump, either. 

Why would this be? Genuinely curious. Because my only thought when I saw a SC was already assigned was "are you fucking kidding me?" that this was so fast when it took so long to assign one for Trump's bullshit.

[kath16]

Jan 12, 2023 16:46:23 GMT -5 TR said:

Jan 12, 2023 14:00:17 GMT -5 prettyinpearls said:

 I was reading speculation on Twitter that the quick assignment of a Special Counsel for Biden's investigation doesn't bode well for Trump, either. 

Why would this be? Genuinely curious. Because my only thought when I saw a SC was already assigned was "are you fucking kidding me?" that this was so fast when it took so long to assign one for Trump's bullshit.

Same.

I, a non-expert, assumed that fast movement means it’s bad

[carmenere]

Jan 12, 2023 16:46:23 GMT -5 TR said:

Jan 12, 2023 14:00:17 GMT -5 prettyinpearls said:

 I was reading speculation on Twitter that the quick assignment of a Special Counsel for Biden's investigation doesn't bode well for Trump, either. 

Why would this be? Genuinely curious. Because my only thought when I saw a SC was already assigned was "are you fucking kidding me?" that this was so fast when it took so long to assign one for Trump's bullshit.

I think the DOJ is making a concerted effort to show they’re being impartial, which I think is the right approach. I know the circumstances aren’t comparable but it would be a really bad look for them to not take it equally seriously.

[lilac05]

Jan 12, 2023 13:45:59 GMT -5 cous0226 said:

The next 2 years will be a circus and this just lit DT up for material to run on. Biden will need to explain this over and over because every 2024 candidate will grasp at this. We all know the media is excited about this why is why Biden needs to have a strategy. It can’t be mumbling a few words at a presser about it. This really sucks.

I’m kind of hoping that knowing this will encourage Biden to take a step back and let someone else run on the D ticket in 2024. Democrats need to focus on who can win, and stuff like this makes a tough job even tougher. Republicans will stop at nothing to make their people believe that what Biden did is somehow equal or worse than what Trump did…and they will believe it.

[cous0226]

Jan 12, 2023 17:03:24 GMT -5 lilac05 said:

Jan 12, 2023 13:45:59 GMT -5 cous0226 said:

The next 2 years will be a circus and this just lit DT up for material to run on. Biden will need to explain this over and over because every 2024 candidate will grasp at this. We all know the media is excited about this why is why Biden needs to have a strategy. It can’t be mumbling a few words at a presser about it. This really sucks.

I’m kind of hoping that knowing this will encourage Biden to take a step back and let someone else run on the D ticket in 2024. Democrats need to focus on who can win, and stuff like this makes a tough job even tougher. Republicans will stop at nothing to make their people believe that what Biden did is somehow equal or worse than what Trump did…and they will believe it.

I don’t think he’ll step aside because in his head he thinks he’s the only one who can beat trump. I’m not sure he’s wrong either.

[TR]

Jan 12, 2023 17:03:24 GMT -5 lilac05 said:

Jan 12, 2023 13:45:59 GMT -5 cous0226 said:

The next 2 years will be a circus and this just lit DT up for material to run on. Biden will need to explain this over and over because every 2024 candidate will grasp at this. We all know the media is excited about this why is why Biden needs to have a strategy. It can’t be mumbling a few words at a presser about it. This really sucks.

I’m kind of hoping that knowing this will encourage Biden to take a step back and let someone else run on the D ticket in 2024. Democrats need to focus on who can win, and stuff like this makes a tough job even tougher. Republicans will stop at nothing to make their people believe that what Biden did is somehow equal or worse than what Trump did…and they will believe it.

I don’t have a strong opinion on whether Biden should run again or not, but I don’t think we should include in that calculation what Republicans will or won’t believe. They’re never going to vote for a Democrat no matter what. And I think we’ve learned over the past few elections that “swing voters” don’t really exist. We need to turn Democrats out.

[Velar Fricative]

Jan 12, 2023 16:55:51 GMT -5 carmenere said:

Jan 12, 2023 16:46:23 GMT -5 TR said:

Why would this be? Genuinely curious. Because my only thought when I saw a SC was already assigned was "are you fucking kidding me?" that this was so fast when it took so long to assign one for Trump's bullshit.

I think the DOJ is making a concerted effort to show they’re being impartial, which I think is the right approach. I know the circumstances aren’t comparable but it would be a really bad look for them to not take it equally seriously.

Yeah, if the DOJ stalled even five more minutes on appointing an SC it would look terrible given the SC for Trump under similar circumstances. So Garland had to do it quickly.

[lilac05]

TR, true. However, I don’t think we can discount how much negative press can impact turnout for democrats, too. We need someone that people will be excited to show up and vote for. I just don’t think Biden is that person. Last election, turnout was more to make sure Trump didn’t stay in than to get Biden in.