A second person tried to shoot Trump

[laladypoet]

I totally thought the first attempt was fake at first. Now I believe it was real but that he greatly exaggerated his wound for some reason that makes no damn sense.
however, I'm not a bastion of moral superiority or above tin foil hats, so ignore me.

[stuffandthings]

I did not and do not think the first attempt was faked. People died. I do think he was hit by shrapnel and not a bullet and he milked it for all it was worth, but I have never believed that incident was faked or staged.

I'll admit that my kneejerk first reaction when I heard the news yesterday was, "Really? Right now? When everyone is currently focused on ridiculing his debate performance?" and I had a moment of thinking that was pretty convenient for him, especially when he put out a fundraising email about it at the speed of light. Now that I have the facts, though, it's pretty clear this was a real guy who had a real gun at the place where Trump was and I don't think the secret service would make it up or anything. I don't feel in the least bit bad for him on a personal level, given what he's put other people through, but political violence is bad for everyone.

Finally, given this series of events, you'd think that banning assault weapons would be a bipartisan, unity issue.

[pixy0stix]

Sept 16, 2024 8:41:46 GMT -5 laladypoet said:

I totally thought the first attempt was fake at first. Now I believe it was real but that he greatly exaggerated his wound for some reason that makes no damn sense.
however, I'm not a bastion of moral superiority or above tin foil hats, so ignore me.

Lest anyone think I'm a bastion of morality, my first thought was, "he fucking didn't have a heart attack again?!"

[VillainV]

Sept 16, 2024 8:14:49 GMT -5 rubytue said:

Sept 16, 2024 8:10:12 GMT -5 wildrice said:

This is true - we just don't normally hear about it, do we? I am sure tons of things are thwarted regularly, but it makes me wonder why this one - which doesn't sound like it was particularly close - was big news. I was watching football and one of those ticker things went along the bottom of the screen like this was important breaking news that couldn't wait to be announced. Is that just the media always being a circus when it comes to Trump, or was this an unusual event?

1. Shots were fired. So not like a quiet take down. 
2. Trump was shot at two months ago. 

yeah, it’s news for any reason. Not just because Trump. If it had been Harris, it would have been news, too. 

Just to be clear, the shots that were fired were by the secret service. The gunman didn’t fire his weapon, and was not in a position to shoot at Trump because the secret service was doing their job and spotted him before he could endanger Trump. I’m not trying to downplay what happened at all, simply clarifying. Was it “an attempt on his life”? I personally would consider it a thwarted attempt. The first one in PA was absolutely an attempt on his life.

I 100% agree that not only should this gunman should never have had access to the type of weapon he had, but NOBODY outside of the military and law enforcement (in the course of carrying out their specific duties) should have a weapon like this. And I’m aghast that the gun-loving right can’t wrap their head around this.

ETA: I think it really matters how we talk about what happened. Did someone “try to shoot” him? Was it an “assassination attempt”? It seems likely that Trump was his intended target. Whether his intent was to actually shoot/kill him if he had the chance or if his objective was observe movement and security procedures so he could potentially use them another time seems unclear still. Ordinarily I’d assume a citizen with a gun intended to shoot, but given the gunman’s quasi-military background I think there’s small reason to think the may have had a different objective yesterday. It was definitely a potentially very dangerous situation that was averted due to the SS taking appropriate action.

[Bad Dingo]

There were various attempts on President Obama at the White House:
www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-36348361

Trump is reveling in this and it's disgusting. He doesn't care that he's putting other's lives in danger by the words he's using, the activities he insists on partaking in, etc.

[icedcoffee]

Thoughts and Prayers!

[mofongo]

A golf course seems like a nightmare to secure!

[pixy0stix]

New York Times Reporter Revisits Earlier Interview With Suspect at Trump Golf Course www.nytimes.com/2024/09/15/us/politics/trump-routh-ukraine-interview.html?unlocked_article_code=1.LE4.NXK4.Jy5mGUt20n_n


Per this, the suspect didn't have any military training. It sounds like he was a keyboard warrior - all talk and no action.

ETA: I just read the WaPo post about him and the guy was a nut. He'd been arrested several times.

[laladypoet]

Sept 16, 2024 9:02:00 GMT -5 pixy0stix said:

Sept 16, 2024 8:41:46 GMT -5 laladypoet said:

I totally thought the first attempt was fake at first. Now I believe it was real but that he greatly exaggerated his wound for some reason that makes no damn sense.
however, I'm not a bastion of moral superiority or above tin foil hats, so ignore me.

Lest anyone think I'm a bastion of morality, my first thought was, "he fucking didn't have a heart attack again?!"

I was making a self-deprecating joke. it wasn't about you.

[dontlook]

Sept 16, 2024 9:23:18 GMT -5 icedcoffee said:

Thoughts and Prayers!

This is all any Trump news deserves, IMO.

[pixy0stix]

Sept 16, 2024 9:45:33 GMT -5 laladypoet said:

Sept 16, 2024 9:02:00 GMT -5 pixy0stix said:

Lest anyone think I'm a bastion of morality, my first thought was, "he fucking didn't have a heart attack again?!"

I was making a self-deprecating joke. it wasn't about you.

I didn't think it was. I was just adding on.

[mcppalmbeach]

Sept 15, 2024 19:49:31 GMT -5 pixy0stix said:

Lol that people here don't believe the first shooting is fake. It's been implied numerous times in other threads, most recently in the debate thread.

ETA: and another thread that was talking about an interview he did that the interviewer said they had a close view of his ear and saw nothing. Which could have been implying that it healed/or wasn't bad, but also echoes the "it never happened" rationale.

I’m fully with you on all of this. What have we become?!

[laladypoet]

Sept 16, 2024 10:35:14 GMT -5 mcppalmbeach said:

Sept 15, 2024 19:49:31 GMT -5 pixy0stix said:

Lol that people here don't believe the first shooting is fake. It's been implied numerous times in other threads, most recently in the debate thread.

ETA: and another thread that was talking about an interview he did that the interviewer said they had a close view of his ear and saw nothing. Which could have been implying that it healed/or wasn't bad, but also echoes the "it never happened" rationale.

I’m fully with you on all of this. What have we become?!

with all due, girl, calm down

[mcppalmbeach]

Sept 16, 2024 13:58:39 GMT -5 laladypoet said:

Sept 16, 2024 10:35:14 GMT -5 mcppalmbeach said:

I’m fully with you on all of this. What have we become?!

with all due, girl, calm down

Listen, I’m a believer that truth can be stranger than fiction. But logically I also know that Occam’s razor rules the day. Without any additional evidence, it’s logical to assume that a man in a tree with a rifle near an extremely contentious presidential candidate probably meant harm. The immediate jump to a tin foil hat theory is, yes, concerning to me. Because that’s “our side,” but on the other side are people who readily believe that immigrants eat pets, that Sandy Hook was fake and that doctors are killing babies after birth. The two sides aren’t as far apart as one might hope.

[laladypoet]

Sept 16, 2024 19:57:59 GMT -5 mcppalmbeach said:

Sept 16, 2024 13:58:39 GMT -5 laladypoet said:

with all due, girl, calm down

Listen, I’m a believer that truth can be stranger than fiction. But logically I also know that Occam’s razor rules the day. Without any additional evidence, it’s logical to assume that a man in a tree with a rifle near an extremely contentious presidential candidate probably meant harm. The immediate jump to a tin foil hat theory is, yes, concerning to me. Because that’s “our side,” but on the other side are people who readily believe that immigrants eat pets, that Sandy Hook was fake and that doctors are killing babies after birth. The two sides aren’t as far apart as one might hope.

Im just commenting on your “What has happened to us?!” part that I read in a southern accent and pictured you fanning yourself with a hankie. It was a lot. I was about to get smelling salts.

[sonrisa]

Sept 16, 2024 21:00:29 GMT -5 laladypoet said:

Sept 16, 2024 19:57:59 GMT -5 mcppalmbeach said:

Listen, I’m a believer that truth can be stranger than fiction. But logically I also know that Occam’s razor rules the day. Without any additional evidence, it’s logical to assume that a man in a tree with a rifle near an extremely contentious presidential candidate probably meant harm. The immediate jump to a tin foil hat theory is, yes, concerning to me. Because that’s “our side,” but on the other side are people who readily believe that immigrants eat pets, that Sandy Hook was fake and that doctors are killing babies after birth. The two sides aren’t as far apart as one might hope.

Im just commenting on your “What has happened to us?!” part that I read in a southern accent and pictured you fanning yourself with a hankie. It was a lot. I was about to get smelling salts.

And I read it as going with Kamala's "They're eating cats!" face. 

[ellipses84]

The past decade and past 3 presidential election cycles have been so insane, I feel like nothing is even shocking to people. We had people over to watch football and the reaction to the ticker tape breaking news alert someone read out loud was like oh, really? meh, no comment (if you can’t say anything nice don’t say anything at all in a room of people who won’t vote for him). In the 24 hour news cycle, we constantly hear inaccurate information which has happened since the 90s and has only gotten worse so it’s not surprising people question things and conspiracy theories abound. It’s not surprising he’s a target considering his rhetoric. It’s one more risk factor to add to the likelihood that if he wins, he does not outlive his presidency and JD Vance becomes President.

[basilosaurus]

Sept 16, 2024 8:10:12 GMT -5 wildrice said:

Sept 16, 2024 7:29:15 GMT -5 lilac05 said:

I haven’t seen yet how close he actually was, so maybe I’m off-base here, but when I hear this, I think it’s a good reminder of how protected they are. He didn’t get through anything. He made it to the perimeter of the course, which was being closely monitored by secret service. They spotted him and did exactly what was needed to be done to keep him safe. They can only protect out so far, and being on a private course makes this even more difficult.

This is true - we just don't normally hear about it, do we? I am sure tons of things are thwarted regularly, but it makes me wonder why this one - which doesn't sound like it was particularly close - was big news. I was watching football and one of those ticker things went along the bottom of the screen like this was important breaking news that couldn't wait to be announced. Is that just the media always being a circus when it comes to Trump, or was this an unusual event?

We probably don't hear about a ton of security risks thwarted whether against presidents or in our airports or wherever. That's likely a good thing. They're doing the job successfully.

I know Obama got earlier protection due to the nature of threats against him. I wouldn't be in the least surprised at Trump also getting this especially after the RNC shooting and as post-president protection. So, this outside the perimeter, found the guy, shot at him story doesn't exactly make me fearful, but I do think it is his camp's best interest to play up the story. Always the biggest victim, so attacked, that's his entire schtick, so I don't think it's amiss to question the credulity of early reports.

Also, just because it was referenced above, I've known multiple survivors of lightening strikes shark attacks. Probably I've met more but they didn't mention it. 

[livinitup]

Since this unfolded in Florida, LEO are having trouble charging the would-be shooter. It’s totally legal to walk around with an AK 47 and apparently wait around for hours with it. He didn’t fire it or seem to threaten to fire it. He broke no laws in leaving the location and did not resist being pulled over or arrested. He is a felon and the AK 47 does not have a serial number, so they have these charges:

Routh was charged today with possession of a firearm by a convicted felon and possession of a firearm with an obliterated serial number.

Fun.

[glw]

Sept 17, 2024 10:51:51 GMT -5 livinitup said:

It’s totally legal to walk around with an AK 47 and apparently wait around for hours with it. He didn’t fire it or seem to threaten to fire it. 

So I remain confused about how this all went down, because at the moment that the SS encountered this person, it wasn't obvious that he was breaking the law (except maybe trespassing?), but they shot at him (and missed?). Is that legal? Can the SS just shoot anyone nearby who has a gun?

[ellipses84]

Sept 17, 2024 11:28:05 GMT -5 glw said:

Sept 17, 2024 10:51:51 GMT -5 livinitup said:

It’s totally legal to walk around with an AK 47 and apparently wait around for hours with it. He didn’t fire it or seem to threaten to fire it. 

So I remain confused about how this all went down, because at the moment that the SS encountered this person, it wasn't obvious that he was breaking the law (except maybe trespassing?), but they shot at him (and missed?). Is that legal? Can the SS just shoot anyone nearby who has a gun?

Highlighting all the problems with open carry laws! You don’t know the difference between a good guy with a gun and a bad guy with a gun until it’s too late!

[VillainV]

Sept 17, 2024 11:49:33 GMT -5 ellipses84 said:

Sept 17, 2024 11:28:05 GMT -5 glw said:

So I remain confused about how this all went down, because at the moment that the SS encountered this person, it wasn't obvious that he was breaking the law (except maybe trespassing?), but they shot at him (and missed?). Is that legal? Can the SS just shoot anyone nearby who has a gun?

Highlighting all the problems with open carry laws! You don’t know the difference between a good guy with a gun and a bad guy with a gun until it’s too late!

Several years ago I was in CO Springs when there was a shooting. The gunman had been walking down the street carrying an AR-15 I think. A few people called the police to report it, but it’s an open carry state so the police wouldn’t do anything until he started shooting. It’s absolutely ridiculous that someone can walk down the street brandishing an assault rifle and it’s all perfectly legal.

[livinitup]

Sept 17, 2024 11:28:05 GMT -5 glw said:

Sept 17, 2024 10:51:51 GMT -5 livinitup said:

It’s totally legal to walk around with an AK 47 and apparently wait around for hours with it. He didn’t fire it or seem to threaten to fire it. 

So I remain confused about how this all went down, because at the moment that the SS encountered this person, it wasn't obvious that he was breaking the law (except maybe trespassing?), but they shot at him (and missed?). Is that legal? Can the SS just shoot anyone nearby who has a gun?

It’s fine
Everything is fine

No one is asking these questions. And no one will. It’s just too enthralling when reports pop with “shots fired”, “attempted assassination”, “pointing a high powered rifle” “suspect fled”, “AK 47”

Yes, the shots were actually fired by the Secret Service.
It stopped plans for a suspected attempt.
The rifle was seen pointed at the golf course.
The man being shot at by SS ran away.
The criminal complaint states it was a SKS-type rifle, it was misidentified as a AK-47. (a distinction without difference, imo)

But the bell has been rung and all that. A serious security situation for sure.

[cayl]

It's sad because so much of what is said by Trump & Co is fabricated, exaggerated, or straight up lies, so then serious things happen and there's skepticism. It doesn't help that the first attempt was on a flat roof with a perfect line of sight, and that people reported the guy and were ignored, but Occam's Razor comes into play.

If both of these were legitimate assassination attempts I wouldn't be surprised. If we somehow found out months/years from now that these were fabricated I can't honestly say that I would be surprised. For now, I err on the side of not wanting to sound like my lunatic conspiracy enthusiast in-laws and assume they're valid attempts. Besides, what does saying they were made up accomplish? It makes us look as crazy as them, and may make people on the fence feel that both sides are equally crazy, so may as well just stay home. I would rather see Dems say "these are horrible attempts, and further proof as to why we need stricter gun laws."

[sonrisa]

Sept 17, 2024 12:22:05 GMT -5 VillainV said:

It’s absolutely ridiculous that someone can walk down the street brandishing an assault rifle and it’s all perfectly legal.

QFT

[cmeon]

FL isn't an open carry state.

[rachers]

Meanwhile we’re working in my state (AR) for people to not be able to carry at school bus stops.

It’s maddening and DM me if you would like contacts for gun sense candidates.

[Michelle]

my takeaways:

1) July Assassination attempt was by a person who, for all intents and purposes, was a Republican
2) September thwarted assassination attempt was by a person whose political affilitation seems to be under debate - i've seen reported evidence on both sides with reports that he actually did vote for Trump in 2016 and calls Biden "sleepy Joe" but he has a lot of social media posts indicating he is pro-Bernie. If nothing else, he's definitely not a securely pro-Kamala/Biden voter and his outfits look straight out of a MAGA rally.
3) You don't see Democrats wearing "come and take my AR-15s" at their rallies, but these kinds of assassination attempts both involved long range assault weapons.

So Twice in 3 months there were two national headliners who got close enough to almost kill the Republican candidate, and they have ties to his side with weapons he supports being free-for-all accessible.

The call is coming from inside the house, Republicans.

Get your affairs in order. Your party and followers are off the rails and "your" political commentators and candidates are exacerbating the problem!

[stuffandthings]

Sept 17, 2024 12:50:32 GMT -5 cmeon said:

FL isn't an open carry state.

I wonder if they couldn't charge him because of their loopholes, though. Apparently, you can open carry in Florida if you're in the process of camping, and he was camped out there for 12 hours beforehand. Maybe they can't get him because of that?

[cmeon]

Sept 17, 2024 13:48:17 GMT -5 stuffandthings said:

Sept 17, 2024 12:50:32 GMT -5 cmeon said:

FL isn't an open carry state.

I wonder if they couldn't charge him because of their loopholes, though. Apparently, you can open carry in Florida if you're in the process of camping, and he was camped out there for 12 hours beforehand. Maybe they can't get him because of that?

I haven't seen anything describing the charging decisions personally, but the law only provides those exceptions for people who are legally able to carry a gun (and obviously, as a felon, he was not).