Flameworthy around these parts- We tithe 10% of our gross income plus 2% to other charitable causes. This is twice as much as we put in to savings. Also, I feel no guilt about this.
I don't see why this is flammable unless you aren't actually saving enough. We give a greater percentage of our income to charity than we do to savings and no one has ever flamed us for it. But we aren't compromising our long term financial stability in order to be charitable.
We still save plenty, IMO. We are putting money in to savings each month in addition to our retirement contributions. I just recall posting my budget years ago on TN shortly after DS was born. Everyone went a little crazy on the fact that we were paying something like $400 to tithing and only $200 to savings. The arguments were that we were saving less than we were giving and we had a house and a child. I wasn't caring for my son's needs because I was contributing too much to tithes/charity. It was very eye opening for me because I really didn't think paying 10% was all that shocking. We contribute way more than that to tithes now but also contribute more to savings. It has never bothered me but I was shocked that it bothered others so much.
This is kind of flame worthy. I'm not shocked to to read someone who used to post on MM is heading for a divorce. I think a lot of people saw this coming back when they were just engaged and told her so.
This is kind of flame worthy. I'm not shocked to to read someone who used to post on MM is heading for a divorce. I think a lot of people saw this coming back when they were just engaged and told her so.
Post by MixedBerryJam on Dec 19, 2012 14:13:07 GMT -5
I'm trying really hard not to judge Adam Lanza's mother, but failing. Why'd she have all those guns? Why'd she teach him how to shoot? I saw an interview with an old babysitter of his who said the mom told him not to even leave him unsupervised long enough to go to the bathroom. I would like to know wtf she was thinking was okay about this situation. I'm really, really trying not to judge her, but it's hard.
I'm trying really hard not to judge Adam Lanza's mother, but failing. Why'd she have all those guns? Why'd she teach him how to shoot? I saw an interview with an old babysitter of his who said the mom told him not to even leave him unsupervised long enough to go to the bathroom. I would like to know wtf she was thinking was okay about this situation. I'm really, really trying not to judge her, but it's hard.
He could have figured out how to get guns from elsewhere, and you probably don't have to be a great shot to do what he did.
I don't think growing up around guns is going to make a kid shoot up a school. Nor do I think that growing up with no guns around will make you not shoot up a school.
I'm trying really hard not to judge Adam Lanza's mother, but failing. Why'd she have all those guns? Why'd she teach him how to shoot? I saw an interview with an old babysitter of his who said the mom told him not to even leave him unsupervised long enough to go to the bathroom. I would like to know wtf she was thinking was okay about this situation. I'm really, really trying not to judge her, but it's hard.
I know next to nothing about their home situation because I haven't been following the story that closely. But to play devil's advocate, I could see a situation where a kid might be depressed and struggle socially with few to no friends or outside interests. Then the kid expresses an interest in target practice so a parent starts taking him to the range because at least it's something that gets him outside and out of his bedroom.
Of course any guns they own should be locked up (ideally with a thumb print safe) and the kid should be in therapy. But the vast, vast majority of teens who struggle with mental issues do not shoot up schools. I could see how that thought would never cross her mind.
I'm trying really hard not to judge Adam Lanza's mother, but failing. Why'd she have all those guns? Why'd she teach him how to shoot? I saw an interview with an old babysitter of his who said the mom told him not to even leave him unsupervised long enough to go to the bathroom. I would like to know wtf she was thinking was okay about this situation. I'm really, really trying not to judge her, but it's hard.
I know next to nothing about their home situation because I haven't been folliwing the story that closely. But to play devil's advocate, I could see a sutuation where a kid might be depressed and struggle socially with few to no friends or interests. Then the kid expresses an interest in target practice so a parent starts taking them to the range because at least it's something that gets him outside and out of his bedroom.
Of course any guns they own should be locked up (ideally with a thumb print safe) and the kid should be in therapy. But the vast, vast majority of teens who struggle with mental issues do not shoot up schools. I can see how that thought never drossed her mind.
This. I can also see a situation where maybe he had a sudden onset of a serious mental illness, like schizophrenia. He is the right age and my understanding is that schizophrenia can almost literally change you into a different person overnight--the symptoms can arise really rapidly.
There is just so not enough information to judge either way yet.
Considering I'm a fan of strict liability for violence caused with guns, I blame Adam Lanza's mother solely for not locking up her guns better so anyone other than herself could access them.
I do not blame her for Adam's actions without more information.
Considering I'm a fan of strict liability for violence caused with guns, I blame Adam Lanza's mother solely for not locking up her guns better so anyone other than herself could access them.
I do not blame her for Adam's actions without more information.
She might have had a combination lock or a lock with a key which he stole. Personally I abhor guns and would love to see the 2nd amendment repealed. But I also don't like the idea of someone being culpable for another's actions, which is an idea that a lot of people have been floating (i.e. If someone steals your gun and you fail to report it fast enough and then that person shoots up a school, it's all on you).
Adam Lanza's mother was petitioning the court for a conservatorship so she could try to have him committed. Some people think this might have been his motive/the reason he snapped.
Well, I didn't mean literally overnight, more like fast enough that the person's loved ones could still be unaware or in denial about how serious the problem is. But seriously, thanks for correcting me. I will make an effort not to be a spreader of this kind of misinformation that I have heard from others.
I think it's foolish that people think there is any one thing/person to blame here. We've heard from people on this board how hard it is to get help for a child that needs it. Legal or not guns are going to be available to anyone that wants them. Etc, etc. It's horribly, horribly tragic, and I understand the want to know why - but judging his mom makes my heart break.
It's such a hard process in this country to want to get your adult child help and not be able to b/c at 18 they're an adult and have rights.
My parents tried for years b/c of all my sister's issues and she was self-medicating with drugs. Since she never hurt anyone else and technically doing drugs only hurts yourself in the long run, no signs of suicide, there was little they could do, even with a court battle.
But I can still remember her as a young child chasing me around the house with a knife b/c she was mad at me for some reason.
Considering I'm a fan of strict liability for violence caused with guns, I blame Adam Lanza's mother solely for not locking up her guns better so anyone other than herself could access them.
I do not blame her for Adam's actions without more information.
I think where I am is that she seems to have almost facilitated this. I'm really struggling with this, though, because she was definitely a victim, and I'm usually pretty good at not blaming the victim. Sure he might have gotten guns somewhere else, but he didn't need to because they were right there. If she hadn't taught him it might never have occurred to him to pick up the gun in the first place. Believe me, I totally understand that my judgement is ill-placed and that I shouldn't be blaming the victim. But I cannot shake this thing in my gut.
My grad school demographics info is listed as "single". I was married when I started, still am and haven't updated that info. I'm set to graduate in May and I don't really care to update it either.
Well, I would tend to agree that saving only $2400 a year when you have a small child and own a home is not the best. Especially when you have discretionary budget categories that could be reallocated for the financial stability of your family.
I have no recollection of your budget post, but it seems likely you were flamed for putting tithing ahead of your short and long term financial well being and not because you were tithing more than you were saving. You are kind of conflating two different causes for flaming. Percentages are not, on face, flammable. But the numbers that constitute them may be.
See, I told you it was flameful around these parts. At that time (6ish years ago) we were commended by our ecclesiastical leader and our friends for being able to pay bills/tithing/retirement and still put something in to our savings account while caring for our child. Obviously, this is a different group than MM. In all honest, we were fine. In addition to the small monthly savings we had DH's 2 extra paychecks per year and our tax refund was going to savings. Our emergency savings never fell below 3 month of expenses and we put money in to DH's 401k to get the full company match. I just recall finding it interesting that a majority of the people suggested cutting or reducing tithes as opposed to cutting other items like cable or internet. I would sell our car (payment was only $187 at the time, I think, plus insurance and maintenance) or our house before I ever cut tithing because I believe that firmly in paying it. This is a strictly personal view and I get that few others feel this strongly about it. On a related note, I put my budget up again a few months ago because our income has doubled since the last time I posted a budget. I just took the tithing amount off the top and showed a reduced net income. The only comment then was that it was surprising that I fed DH, myself and the two older kids for less than $400 per month. And yes, I put more than $200 in savings now.
This. I can also see a situation where maybe he had a sudden onset of a serious mental illness, like schizophrenia. He is the right age and my understanding is that schizophrenia can almost literally change you into a different person overnight--the symptoms can arise really rapidly.
There is just so not enough information to judge either way yet.
Schizophrenics are actually very, very unlikely to be violent in this way. These shootings are always premeditated, which is not how a schizophrenic person would act out with violence (they would be more likely to feel threatened in the moment).
Excellent point, Jenny. In addition to that, schizophrenia often causes cognitive deficits, making it difficult for an individual to plan and follow through with an intricate act of premeditated violence.
Schizophrenics are actually very, very unlikely to be violent in this way. These shootings are always premeditated, which is not how a schizophrenic person would act out with violence (they would be more likely to feel threatened in the moment).
Excellent point, Jenny. In addition to that, schizophrenia often causes cognitive deficits, making it difficult for an individual to plan and follow through with an intricate act of premeditated violence.
Aren't late teens/early 20's the period where people are most likely to come down with serious mental illness?
Not arguing your points - I agree with you both - but I wonder if he had something other than schizophrenia that had sudden (or if not sudden, recent) onset.
It just doesn't make sense to me otherwise why she'd take the risk having guns a part of his life.
People who are asking for gift ideas 6 days before Christmas make me LOL. People who have their shopping done don't want to do yours for you. Or asking where to find an obscure gift - um, the internet, three weeks ago.
And if anyone hasn't bought their gift for me yet, I would rather they not bother. I don't want whatever you could find quickly at whatever store was on your way home from work. Just own it and get me a gift card instead. That way at least I won't have to stand in a return line to get rid of your hastily grabbed obligation gift.
You can still do hardcore shopping the day before xmas. Maybe that person has been busy. Why does it matter when they shop?
Post by hannamaren on Dec 19, 2012 21:37:29 GMT -5
I had a patient come in last night with a prescription for antipsychotics. He wasnt sure he wanted them. He was afraid of side effects and they were too expensive, etc. he also mentioned that he knew he needed them because the voices were coming back. I felt this important need to make sure he took the medication in case he was going to go shoot up a school. I felt so bad for him for the lack of support (financial and emotional)
Excellent point, Jenny. In addition to that, schizophrenia often causes cognitive deficits, making it difficult for an individual to plan and follow through with an intricate act of premeditated violence.
Aren't late teens/early 20's the period where people are most likely to come down with serious mental illness?
Not arguing your points - I agree with you both - but I wonder if he had something other than schizophrenia that had sudden (or if not sudden, recent) onset.
It just doesn't make sense to me otherwise why she'd take the risk having guns a part of his life.
Yes, specifically males. Sometimes the onset is slightly later in females, although I don't think there is a significant difference.
Dammit, I love post your budget day and I missed it. FTR, I actually don't mind being very frank about expenses/budgets but I know I can only be so open in certain crowds. In NYC, no one was shy about finances and my friends and co-workers shared information easily. Elsewhere has been a completely different story.
I got some good feedback the last time I posted our budget. We've had a lot of changes since that budget but I know what to work on. Sadly, my going back to work actually doesn't add anything besides money in a 403b. When it comes to our monthly cashflow, I cost our household money and also our savings :-(
I know we don't know much about Adam Lanza and his mother but it is hard not to place partial blame on the mother. Growing up with guns does not make a killer. However, I have a really hard time understanding the mother's reasons for wanting to teach Adam how to shoot guns even after she recognized that her son was socially awkward enough to pull him from regular high school.
I've been to gun ranges and I've actually enjoyed learning how to be responsible with a gun. Yet, in the end, DH and I decided gun ownership was not for us. I also don't understand why people actually want to collect guns, particularly if they don't even hunt.
My flame-worthy opinion is this -- I am hard core judging one of my clients for the crappy ass Christmas gift they gave me. She and I are friendly outside of our daycare relationship. Our kids are the same age and in an activity together. She has been a client here for almost 4 years.
We were discussing holiday tips and she told me how much she tipped the paper delivery guy, mailman, and her hair stylist. She told me that she gave the karate instructor a $50 gift card - her dd has been in karate for 8 weeks. So when she handed me an envelope and a gift bag, I thought it was sweet. Until I saw the Dollar Tree plastic snowman holiday plate, a candle with a clearance sticker for $1.97 still on it, and a holiday card from her family, I was bummed.
Later, I got mad. Her entire "gift" to me cost under $5. The gift her kid made for her mom and dad cost me about $15 and about an hour of time to help her make it. I frequently do them favors above and beyond my job. Taking her dd early, waiving late fees, caring for her kid when she is borderline ill because I know her boss is a jerk, etc. I am done. I was planning on driving her dd back and forth to preschool next year, but I won't do it now. I feel really unappreciated. Not even a thank you card. WTF?
So maybe I am gift grabby, but I am super pissed off today.
I don't think that's gift grabby at all. That makes me sad for you that you do all that for her DD and compared to others you got shit. Why the hell did she tell you she tipped the karate instructor $50 when she gave you that? I would feel extremely unappreciated too, not for the monetary value, but the lack of thought in both the gift and sharing how much she tipped others when your gift wasn't even in the same ballpark.
That was the most unlikely OP to result in a multipage thread. LOL
Multiple pages on more than one board!
That may be my best flame achievement to date.
Quit bragplainting about your post!
I was surprised to see people call that a bragplaint. I thought it was a reasonable question and it seems like such a silly thing to consider a brag. Weirdos.