Post by EllieArroway on Dec 4, 2014 22:40:09 GMT -5
Ugh! I typed a long post and PB ate it. Boo.
Anyway, I thought I would respond to a few things that I saw come up today. Please feel free to talk to me when you feel that there is a problem.
- About the 'validity' of the votes: CEP gets an average of 2,700 unique visitors per day. 83% of those are returning visitors, meaning they've been here before. They view an average of 17 threads per day. (GBCN as a whole gets around 12,000 unique daily visitors.) There are more people here than you think.
- About Amoosed: The short answer is that she wasn't banned because no one asked. No one reported anything. The only person who said anything to me at all about it was Amoosed, who sent me a message asking me to help her delete something that she accidentally posted. (She had already deleted her post, but it was quoted.) Pagas asked me to delete all of her posts, but didn't say why. It wasn't until later (weeks? months? I don't remember how long it was) that someone asked why she was still around & threw up a thread voting on whether or not to ban her that I found out what had happened. Even then, thoughts were mixed about whether or not she did it on purpose. Amoosed deactivated her account that day.
- About the admins: y4m & I were not voted in. I created the board, which automatically made me an admin. y4m was the one who brought CEP & MM here. I'm not exaggerating when I say that this board would not exist without her. I made her an admin when we realized that it wasn't going to be a temporary place to hang out while TN got their shit together. That was my decision and there was no discussion. I think she has been a great admin. We've all made mistakes & done things that we wish we could take back. She's probably made the fewest mistakes out of all of mods. We just remember hers because it was the most recent.
- There is no such thing as perma-banning. We've never successfully banned anyone permanently. We can ban your account, but we can't stop you from creating another one.
I obviously picked an inopportune day to be stuck in 12 straight hours of meetings. My phone has been blowing up (thanks for your semi-working notifications, Tapatalk app!) Anyway, normally I think just letting mod drama simmer and die out is best, but there's probably too much here to just ignore and move on from.
Although that said, I'm not really sure where to start. I have fallible moments for sure. Threatening to ban bliss was certainly one--hindsight is 20:20 on those. I do the best I can and mainly focus on being transparent in my thinking and actions.
I don't see today as a fallible moment though. I have no doubts at all about my belief that Lys shouldn't be banned. That's a scary slippery slope that we've never been down and this is not the time to start.
I'm a little surprised at the pearl clutching over "group-thinky" - I've been completely transparent that I think the quality of political discussion on CEP has suffered due to one-sided-ness. I believe I've used the term circle-jerk at least once and possibly a few more times than that, so I don't know why anyone would find this surprising. We've beaten that dead horse to death and I think for the most part moved on. I take value where I find it, which is mainly in the people, and I leave the rest. Like I do on every other board I participate in here. I don't think any of that impacts the way I moderate here, and I'm glad EllieArroway seems to agree. The minute she doesn't think I'm fit for the role, she can relieve me and I'd go quite quietly. I never asked for this, and it's really not a big part of my identity here.
I'm sorry pixy feels the way she does about me and I am resigned to the fact that there's probably nothing I can do about it. Although I stand by what I wrote on the mod board, I think copying it here was completely inappropriate and designed to be incendiary. In my opinion it showed very bad judgement for a moderator.
Anyway, tomorrow is another long work day for me, so i don't expect to be around much. But I couldn't let this one go by without getting my voice in a bit.
Post by curbsideprophet on Dec 5, 2014 2:09:39 GMT -5
Thanks for clarifying. That all sounds pretty reasonable to me.
While I expected more than the 100 regs on the FB group, I am a little surprised at the number of daily visitors. That number is higher than I thought it would be. Now I am curious what those numbers are for some of the other boards.
Wow, even as someone who lurked for a bit (back at the old site) before signing up when you all jumped ship to Proboards, I had no idea there were so many lurkers. That's insane.
Post by lyssbobiss, Command, B613 on Dec 5, 2014 7:20:51 GMT -5
I appreciate this. I have a couple of questions:
1. Since its apparent that lys won't be banned, but apparently if we block someone, we still see their posts on tapatalk, does anyone know if someone is working on a patch for that? Maybe it's a tapatalk issue and not a proboards one, but it was worth checking. I'd prefer to not have to see her bullshit anymore.
2. Is there any sort of list of criteria for what makes someone a bannable spambot troll versus a hateful troll who wanders in and posts irrelevant and offensive non sequiturs?
"This prick is asking for someone here to bring him to task Somebody give me some dirt on this vacuous mass so we can at last unmask him I'll pull the trigger on it, someone load the gun and cock it While we were all watching, he got Washington in his pocket."
I'm kind of surprised. But wow at the numbers for the FB page too. I almost feel like I'm missing out in not joining or friending GBCN ladies (and don't you feel special now, oh the very few that are my FB friends. lol.)
I guess I'm surprised at people's surprise at the number of lurkers. There may be this mentality that we're like a rather large dinner party which gets a small share of party crashers, when we're far more like a concert being put on at Central Park (as far as audience, that is... who or what would we equate to as far as a performance?).
I guess I'm surprised at people's surprise at the number of lurkers. There may be this mentality that we're like a rather large dinner party which gets a small share of party crashers, when we're far more like a concert being put on at Central Park.
This is going to sound snarky, and I honestly do not intend that, but the surprise at the number of lurkers (and my initial reaction was one of surprise as well) is on the same plane as people forgetting just how vulnerable they are when they put stuff out there in the internet. I think it's easy to think we are somehow cloistered from the rest of the planet because we see the same people here day after day, but there is nothing protecting this board. Facebook, which gets a privacy rating of negative two bajillion, has stronger privacy and personal control settings than PB.
This is not to criticize PB, as that is the nature of the beast. It is, however, a good reminder to be careful with our information.
I am troubled that there is a board administrator who is so obviously disdainful of this board.
I do not remember my exact journey to this board, but my user number suggests I jumped over here very early in the process and it seems unlikely (though certainly not impossible) that I would have followed Y4M. Anywhere. So I think that her role is setting this board up may be overstated. But it's somewhat irrelevant to me. I'm here now, no matter how I came about it.
I voted not to permaban lys, but I wouldn't have minded if she had been banned. I think she should be suspended at least, and I think it would be appropriate if folks on this board simply ignored her. Entirely and eternally. I did not vote to van her because I overthought it and decided that if I'm someone who doesn't think hate crimes should be their own crime category, I don't think lys should be banned for THAT particular statement. I do think she should be kept on a short leash.
Some of the things she has said in the past have actually been worse than what she said yesterday in terms if tipping the scales from racially insensitive to hate speech.
I'm not at all concerned about our lurkers. If the camera conspiracy board has taught us anything, which of course it has, it's that we are all being watched by an infinite number of government operatives who will not hesitate to assassinate us if we say something that could be dangerous to larger government interests - like noting that a long rectangle shaped donut with chocolate frosting is called a long John, but if you full it with cream, it's an eclair.
Because really they are completely different items made from completely different doughs.
Long johns are kinda all over the place as per the internets, but donuts in general are usually a yeasted dough/batter or sometimes a chemically leavened dough/batter (baking soda/powder). Either baked or fried.
They're totally different things. It's not just terminology. They're COMPLETELY DIFFERENT PRODUCTS. Though it's not exactly easy to tell which is which from a grainy internet picture the size of a stick of gum.
None of which touches the issue of creamsticks. That is just terminology.
(Yes, I know I'm being ridiculous because this is just a board joke at this point, but seriously people, have you never cooked either of these things? they aren't at all the same. I mean...a pierogi and a empanada are not the same food just because they're roughly the same shape and same basic concept. Get with it.)
that that I've had my totally inappropriate side bar (please don't ban me! oh wait...) I appreciate the two of you clarifying. We all know this is all just going to blow over now that we're done with our Annual Airing of the Grievances, but it would have left a terrible taste in my mouth if you hadn't spoken up to share your thoughts.
I am a semi-poster but mostly lurker. I read this board daily and I have even made a friend. I should post more often but usually you ladies beat me to any real news items. So I find myself liking posts and occasionally adding silly comments.
I do not read y4m's comments as disdain for the board. Circle jerk is a crude term, but this board is crude and that is part of its charm.
Most conservatives have been driven from the CEP board. While we may debate and discuss the minutia of various issues, at a macro level this is a very left leaning bored and in that regard is pretty groupthink. When a board has 10 unity horses that nationally are controversial subjects, one could say there is some groupthink going on. OR one could play semantics and argue it is not about groupthink, but instead it is about values. Tomato tomahto really.
Y4m, not being part of the "group" in many ways offers the greatest opportunity for unbiased moderating. And I really appreciate her for that.
Oh yeah, at least half a dozen lurker hits a day are mine because I require that I login to post every time I come to the site from my work computer, even at home.
I am a semi-poster but mostly lurker. I read this board daily and I have even made a friend. I should post more often but usually you ladies beat me to any real news items. So I find myself liking posts and occasionally adding silly comments.
I lurk here daily. I tend not to jump in because I'm not as well informed as you ladies, but I really enjoy reading. And I like to visit the makeup thread. I didn't vote yesterday, though.
I lurk here daily. I tend not to jump in because I'm not as well informed as you ladies, but I really enjoy reading. And I like to visit the makeup thread. I didn't vote yesterday, though.
Post by ChillyMcFreeze on Dec 5, 2014 9:24:43 GMT -5
You guys. Sharing similar opinions is not groupthink. Groupthink means we're all bobbleheads nodding along to one loud idea. Groupthink is not a compliment or neutral term. Many of us share liberal ideologies and, thus, come to similar conclusions on a variety of topics. But virtually every response in the really good political threads offers some nuance of "and here's how I came to that similar conclusion." We are a critically-thinking bunch of women. Please stop using groupthink like it's not offensive as hell.
You guys. Sharing similar opinions is not groupthink. Groupthink means we're all bobbleheads nodding along to one loud idea. Groupthink is not a compliment or neutral term. Many of us share liberal ideologies and, thus, come to similar conclusions on a variety of topics. But virtually every response in the really good political threads offers some nuance of "and here's how I came to that similar conclusion." We are a critically-thinking bunch of women. Please stop using groupthink like it's not offensive as hell.
I do think there are some bobble head subjects. Aka unity horses ::shrug::
I do not read y4m's comments as disdain for the board. Circle jerk is a crude term, but this board is crude and that is part of its charm.
Most conservatives have been driven from the CEP board. While we may debate and discuss the minutia of various issues, at a macro level this is a very left leaning bored and in that regard is pretty groupthink. When a board has 10 unity horses that nationally are controversial subjects, one could say there is some groupthink going on. OR one could play semantics and argue it is not about groupthink, but instead it is about values. Tomato tomahto really.
Y4m, not being part of the "group" in many ways offers the greatest opportunity for unbiased moderating. And I really appreciate her for that.
This is a good point.
I also think it's disingenuous and slightly self absorbed of us to think that we (CEP) require an admin that thinks we are the shit and doesn't see our flaws when there are only two admins anyway, and there are way more than 2 boards here. I'm sure CEP gets a lot of traffic, but so does ML (much more than us, I'm sure) and they don't have an admin representative.
TBH, I think it's good that both of our admins for the entire forum are people that are more outside and not necessarily regulars of one specific board. And I'm glad they refused to ban lys because that was clearly the right call based on the sentiment expressed on this board when it was discussed. I appreciate them protecting the common practice and minimal moderation we've set up on this forum.
And I'm just going to say it. I think it was inappropriate for pixy to post a direct quote from the mod board. I think posting it here was meant to rile up the board over what y4m said, and I don't like it. It smacks of an agenda, and an attempt to muddy the waters and incite drama. I enjoy good drama, don't get me wrong, but I didn't want to ignore something that was bothering me. I'm not calling for pixy's head or anything, but felt like I needed to add my 2 cents to that. Maybe feedback for the future? Mods are given access to a mod board for a reason, and I don't think bringing direct quotes here is appropriate. Perhaps that makes my position somewhat of a contradiction (minimal moderation but no access for members to the mod board comments), but whatever. Honestly, to me, this is like the mod drama with regards to a post being shared on ML before it was deleted, even though I feel like y4m would happily have said that here. It felt like using access to the mod board to stir up drama and I'm not a fan.
I confess to being a frequent lurker and an infrequent poster.
I read this board almost every morning and evening on my bus ride. I have been following the whole recent banning drama. However, I didn't vote in the poll.
I don't post much because I am afraid of getting flamed, and also because I am afraid of giving too much identifying information.
I used to lurk on The Nest and The Knot back in the old days. Based on the information that real posters gave about themselves and the pictures that they posted, I figured out the usernames of the following people: a co-worker, a former college classmate that I wasn't close to but who shared mutual friends with me, and my own sister.
I once found out that my sister was pregnant before she announced to the family because she posted her BFP on The Nest.