...so here's my issue. NOBODY should be above reproach. It feels like police unions at least are angry people are questioning some of the methods used ir some of the cops out there. If we are no longer allowed to do that, if they are going to demand an apology for something like an athlete wearing a tshirt calling for justice during pregame warm ups or people using their right to peacefully assemble are going to become scapegoats for when a nutter kills a cop and told they have blood on their hands, then they do not want a democracy. They want tyranny. They want representatives of the government (because that's what they are) to be above question, above suspicion, and above the Constitution. And that's as undamnAmerican as you can get.
This is what I keep coming back to. We don't live in a police state.
In this case, the thin blue line looks more like a lynch rope than a symbol of law and order.
I know you don't like police. And that is fine. But this is straight disrespectful to all good police out there. And I don't think I have ever disrespected your views whether I agree or not.
I am so tired of the pick a side black lives or police lives. And that has been a complaint here, or so I thought. So as a black LEO, what I am supposed to pick a side in this matter? That is ridiculous. If I change my profile pic to the thin blue now I am lynching black lives? Are you serious with this? I have criticized people throwing out the policelivesmatter when the the protests first started. I felt that they were missing the entire point of the conversation. But now because I care that 2 police officers were executed, supporting them is like a lynch rope?
I can't even get my thoughts straight around this to make my comment coherent. Whatever.
I said: IN THIS CASE.
You know why? Because every other jackwad out there that doesn't agree with the protests is picking it up and using it as "proof" that the "blah people" are inciting riots to kill people. IN THIS CASE taking up the picture and using it when they normally wouldn't is saying, "Blah people can just shut the fuck up right now."
IN THIS CASE.
I'm not asking anyone to pick sides. I want the cops to do their jobs. I want the AA population to not be unfairly targeted. I want EVERYONE to look at this situation and think, "Oh hey, this guy was a fucking nutjob." Not use this to prove what "side" they are on.
In this case, the thin blue line looks more like a lynch rope than a symbol of law and order.
I know you don't like police. And that is fine. But this is straight disrespectful to all good police out there. And I don't think I have ever disrespected your views whether I agree or not.
I am so tired of the pick a side black lives or police lives. And that has been a complaint here, or so I thought. So as a black LEO, what I am supposed to pick a side in this matter? That is ridiculous. If I change my profile pic to the thin blue now I am lynching black lives? Are you serious with this? I have criticized people throwing out the policelivesmatter when the the protests first started. I felt that they were missing the entire point of the conversation. But now because I care that 2 police officers were executed, supporting them is like a lynch rope?
I can't even get my thoughts straight around this to make my comment coherent. Whatever.
I don't think Pixy meant the image. I *think* she meant departments' unconditional, unquestioned support of each other even when their members are not in the right. That blue line, not the one in the picture.
I know you don't like police. And that is fine. But this is straight disrespectful to all good police out there. And I don't think I have ever disrespected your views whether I agree or not.
I am so tired of the pick a side black lives or police lives. And that has been a complaint here, or so I thought. So as a black LEO, what I am supposed to pick a side in this matter? That is ridiculous. If I change my profile pic to the thin blue now I am lynching black lives? Are you serious with this? I have criticized people throwing out the policelivesmatter when the the protests first started. I felt that they were missing the entire point of the conversation. But now because I care that 2 police officers were executed, supporting them is like a lynch rope?
I can't even get my thoughts straight around this to make my comment coherent. Whatever.
I don't think Pixy meant the image. I *think* she meant departments' unconditional, unquestioned support of each other even when their members are not in the right. That blue line, not the one in the picture.
No, I didn't get that deep. I meant the image and using it as profile pics on fb.
...so here's my issue. NOBODY should be above reproach. It feels like police unions (at least, since those are the ones I keep hearing from in the news) are angry people are questioning some of the methods used by some of the cops out there. If we are no longer allowed to do that, if they are going to demand an apology for something like an athlete wearing a tshirt calling for justice during pregame warm ups or people using their right to peacefully assemble are going to become scapegoats for when a nutter kills a cop and told they have blood on their hands, then they do not want a democracy. They want tyranny. They want representatives of the government (because that's what they are) to be above question, above suspicion, and above the Constitution. And that's as undamnAmerican as you can get.
This is only somewhat related to what you said, but this morning I was out and on TV they were talking about the torture report. Someone said they do not support torture under any circumstances (on TV). Some guy muttered under his breath, "Well, that means you support the murder of Americans by terrorists."
People are fucking stupid. There is no shade of gray, apparently, everything is black and white. And a vocal and sizable part of the population support police (and the military) no matter what the tactics or the cost to our freedoms. It's clearly not just the police; I'd venture to say it's a majority of white Americans, given that most white Americans have not had negative encounters with the police and can't speak about police biases and brutality with any level of experience or understanding.
...so here's my issue. NOBODY should be above reproach. It feels like police unions at least are angry people are questioning some of the methods used ir some of the cops out there. If we are no longer allowed to do that, if they are going to demand an apology for something like an athlete wearing a tshirt calling for justice during pregame warm ups or people using their right to peacefully assemble are going to become scapegoats for when a nutter kills a cop and told they have blood on their hands, then they do not want a democracy. They want tyranny. They want representatives of the government (because that's what they are) to be above question, above suspicion, and above the Constitution. And that's as undamnAmerican as you can get.
This is what I keep coming back to. We don't live in a police state.
this.
i think they are generally just pissed that they aren't getting unwavering support.....almost as bad as questioning the military.
How is it not obvious that throwing your all behind police AT THIS PARTICULAR TIME IN HISTORY comes off in some kinda way? Events are not happening in a vacuum. Have we forgotten the NY school teachers who wore the support for NYPD t-shirts? The counter protesters supporting Darren Wilson? The motivations behind those things were not seen as pure. Choosing to side with police as an institution also implies that you are going AGAINST those who are currently critical of the police. So why pick one "side" at all?
...so here's my issue. NOBODY should be above reproach. It feels like police unions at least are angry people are questioning some of the methods used ir some of the cops out there. If we are no longer allowed to do that, if they are going to demand an apology for something like an athlete wearing a tshirt calling for justice during pregame warm ups or people using their right to peacefully assemble are going to become scapegoats for when a nutter kills a cop and told they have blood on their hands, then they do not want a democracy. They want tyranny. They want representatives of the government (because that's what they are) to be above question, above suspicion, and above the Constitution. And that's as undamnAmerican as you can get.
This is what I keep coming back to. We don't live in a police state.
How is it not obvious that throwing your all behind police AT THIS PARTICULAR TIME IN HISTORY comes off in some kinda way? Events are not happening in a vacuum. Have we forgotten the NY school teachers who wore the support for NYPD t-shirts? The counter protesters supporting Darren Wilson? The motivations behind those things were not seen as pure. Choosing to side with police as an institution also implies that you are going AGAINST those who are currently critical of the police. So why pick one "side" at all?
I posted this on FB last night instead:
And I have been saying this. I know other officers have to. But there are some people on this board (SOME NOT ALL) who act like they are mutually exclusive if you have any compassion for police and what they do every day. At least that is my take away. And I know others who get that impression as well. But just like politics there are many positions to take wrt to this as well, from solely siding with the protesters to solely siding with the police. And just like politics, most people fall somewhere in between.
For me the tie to the protests to the tragedy of what happened to these officers is part of the problem in the dialogue (not you just in general). There is nothing that indicates he was a protester. He shot his girlfriend first so whatever the motivations were it clearly wasn't solely related to garner and brown. Linking the two just contributes to the divide.
And I have been saying this. I know other officers have to. But there are some people on this board (SOME NOT ALL) who act like they are mutually exclusive if you have any compassion for police and what they do every day. At least that is my take away. And I know others who get that impression as well. But just like politics there are many positions to take wrt to this as well, from solely siding with the protesters to solely siding with the police. And just like politics, most people fall somewhere in between.
I genuinely feel, penny, that the only people in this post saying that we're either with or against the police... are the NYPD themselves.
Speaking for myself, fwiw, my anger is at the system, at the lack of accountability, and at this particular department's feeling of entitlement to unlimited support.
For the record, I was not referring to you at all.
As for your second point, I guess people might think that about me of FB then. I normally keep politics off my FB. That is what I have here for. But I did post a thin blue line for the officers killed. And I have in the past. But that does not mean that I defend all police actions. I think my posts here prove that I don't. I will engage people in political conversations if they post something (especially if I disagree) and I will post political articles specifically for a person to read if I think they will appreciate it, but other than that I don't. So I guess there could be people on my feed thinking I blindly support officers. I never really thought about it. I do like that John Stewart meme msmerymac posted. I might post that on FB.
If it matters, because you probably could not care less about my opinion, lol-- I think you have been quite even-handed in the cop posts.
And I have been saying this. I know other officers have to. But there are some people on this board (SOME NOT ALL) who act like they are mutually exclusive if you have any compassion for police and what they do every day. At least that is my take away. And I know others who get that impression as well. But just like politics there are many positions to take wrt to this as well, from solely siding with the protesters to solely siding with the police. And just like politics, most people fall somewhere in between.
Listen, just for the record, I posted my sympathies to the two officers shot and their families yesterday and said that those protesting the recent actions of some police and police departments do not stand with this crazy motherfucker.  And you can even ask @smorriso because SHE EVEN SAW IT.
I think, though, that there does need to be some honesty about the fact that a lot of people are suddenly putting up sympathy posts or whatever for the police, who were absolutely silent during discussions of Eric Gardner. Â Or Tamir Rice. Â Or John Crawford. Â When you ONLY show up to show your support for one side, people ARE going to think you're only for that side. Â And I'm going to be honest, the only people I have seen on my specific feed who are posting sympathy towards the slain officers (as they should) have been DEAD SILENT about the other issues, the protests, etc. Â Or, they have been critical of the "bad" parts of the protests like the looting but have made absolutely no reference to the numerous calm, peaceful, positive protests. Â
Slightly unrelated but another thing I've noticed is that every powerful poc, from the president to #blacklivesmatter leadership have had to go out of their way to be sure their statement condoning the killing of the cops is on record, lest someone assume they are anti-cop.
I don't know if I'm putting my thought into clear words here but it just seems like another good example of privilege and who holds it.
Is anyone else bothered by the use of the term, thug? I feel like it's being thrown around pretty casually but I find it to be almost a substitue for other, more offensive terms
Post by Black Lavender on Dec 23, 2014 1:26:54 GMT -5
This is the one FB post that quite a few of my former FB friends liked and shared:
Imagine yourself, 13 years old, Christmas day. Your dad was executed 5 days earlier, assassinated, shot in the head at point blank range without a fighting chance. For what? For doing his job. For donning the uniform. For wearing the badge. For keeping chaos, unrest, and animosity at bay every single day. For serving an ungrateful and violent public.
Imagine yourself looking underneath the Christmas tree at a gift with a tag on it saying, "From Dad", only knowing his funeral is next week.
Imagine your Dad being blatantly murdered at the hands of a crazed and radical individual, driven by media and political-instilled hate all because he wears a Police Officer's uniform.
Now, imagine yourself, a newly wed, ready to get your life on track with the love of your life. 2 months of marriage under your belt and you and your husband are planning your first Christmas together as a married couple. While out Christmas shopping for him, you get a phone call saying your husband has been shot and is in the hospital fighting for his life, only to find out he'd died in his patrol car for no reason.
This, ladies and gentlemen, is a reality we of the law enforcement community live with day by day. Every Police Officer's goal at the end of the day isn't to fuck you over for a speeding ticket or to pick on you because you're black, red, purple, white, a dog, or anything.
Their goal at the end of the day is to come home safe to the loving, embracing arms of their families at home. That is it.
So while you sit there, sympathizing with the criminals and becoming part of the problem by saying, "Hands up, don't shoot" or "I can't breathe" and preaching an ignorant and biased agenda against an individual who would willingly die for you in an instant, no matter if you like them or not; while you sit there with hate and distaste over the fact that they are "all racist" and they can hide behind the badge and without mercy, murder anyone they please-while you sit there and bask in all the hatred that has been ignited this past year, understand that they will ALWAYS be there to help you.
How could anyone have the audacity to hate the protectors? The unseen heroes of every day life?
Matthew 5:9-
"Blessed are the peacemakers, for they shall be called children of God."
God bless NYPD Officer Liu-EOW 12/20/2014
God bless NYPD Officer Ramos-EOW 12/20/2014
Godspeed gentlemen, your deaths will not be in vain.
-Signed, the grateful son of an oath keeping Peace Officer.
This is the one FB post that quite a few of my former FB friends liked and shared:
Imagine yourself, 13 years old, Christmas day. Your dad was executed 5 days earlier, assassinated, shot in the head at point blank range without a fighting chance. For what? For doing his job. For donning the uniform. For wearing the badge. For keeping chaos, unrest, and animosity at bay every single day. For serving an ungrateful and violent public.
Imagine yourself looking underneath the Christmas tree at a gift with a tag on it saying, "From Dad", only knowing his funeral is next week.
Imagine your Dad being blatantly murdered at the hands of a crazed and radical individual, driven by media and political-instilled hate all because he wears a Police Officer's uniform.
Now, imagine yourself, a newly wed, ready to get your life on track with the love of your life. 2 months of marriage under your belt and you and your husband are planning your first Christmas together as a married couple. While out Christmas shopping for him, you get a phone call saying your husband has been shot and is in the hospital fighting for his life, only to find out he'd died in his patrol car for no reason.
This, ladies and gentlemen, is a reality we of the law enforcement community live with day by day. Every Police Officer's goal at the end of the day isn't to fuck you over for a speeding ticket or to pick on you because you're black, red, purple, white, a dog, or anything.
Their goal at the end of the day is to come home safe to the loving, embracing arms of their families at home. That is it.
So while you sit there, sympathizing with the criminals and becoming part of the problem by saying, "Hands up, don't shoot" or "I can't breathe" and preaching an ignorant and biased agenda against an individual who would willingly die for you in an instant, no matter if you like them or not; while you sit there with hate and distaste over the fact that they are "all racist" and they can hide behind the badge and without mercy, murder anyone they please-while you sit there and bask in all the hatred that has been ignited this past year, understand that they will ALWAYS be there to help you.
How could anyone have the audacity to hate the protectors? The unseen heroes of every day life?
Matthew 5:9-
"Blessed are the peacemakers, for they shall be called children of God."
God bless NYPD Officer Liu-EOW 12/20/2014
God bless NYPD Officer Ramos-EOW 12/20/2014
Godspeed gentlemen, your deaths will not be in vain.
-Signed, the grateful son of an oath keeping Peace Officer.
Lol. When reading this drivel I was imagining Jack Nicholson in A Few Good Men...
Col. Jessep: Son, we live in a world that has walls, and those walls have to be guarded by men with guns. Who's gonna do it? You? You, Lt. Weinburg? I have a greater responsibility than you could possibly fathom. You weep for Santiago, and you curse the Marines. You have that luxury. You have the luxury of not knowing what I know. That Santiago's death, while tragic, probably saved lives. And my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, saves lives. You don't want the truth because deep down in places you don't talk about at parties, you want me on that wall, you need me on that wall. We use words like honor, code, loyalty. We use these words as the backbone of a life spent defending something. You use them as a punchline. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the blanket of the very freedom that I provide, and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather you just said thank you, and went on your way, Otherwise, I suggest you pick up a weapon, and stand a post. Either way, I don't give a damn what you think you are entitled to.
Is anyone else bothered by the use of the term, thug? I feel like it's being thrown around pretty casually but I find it to be almost a substitue for other, more offensive terms
This has been discussed on here at length, and yeah, most people seem to agree it is code.
There is nothing wrong with stop and frisk in and of itself as long as certain conditions are met. Terry v. Ohio.
I've not read the ruling linked above but if it says that stop and frisk violates the fourth amendment period it will likely be overturned on appeal. If it says the way NY employments the city wide policy doesn't fit within the confines of a Terry search--well, that seems like it would be pretty simple to modify while still doing it.
Just to clarify, I'm not a fan of the way stop and frisk is used to begin with. ?
There is nothing wrong with stop and frisk in and of itself as long as certain conditions are met. Terry v. Ohio.
I've not read the ruling linked above but if it says that stop and frisk violates the fourth amendment period it will likely be overturned on appeal. If it says the way NY employments the city wide policy doesn't fit within the confines of a Terry search--well, that seems like it would be pretty simple to modify while still doing it.
Just to clarify, I'm not a fan of the way stop and frisk is used to begin with. ?
I agree with the first part, but why to the bolded? I am not talking about the way NY was twisting the Stop and Frisk (I don't agree with that either), but why are you not a fan of it in general?
I was talking about the way NY uses it as a means to cut back on crimes that have nothing to do with being armed.
This is the one FB post that quite a few of my former FB friends liked and shared:
Imagine yourself, 13 years old, Christmas day. Your dad was executed 5 days earlier, assassinated, shot in the head at point blank range without a fighting chance. For what? For doing his job. For donning the uniform. For wearing the badge. For keeping chaos, unrest, and animosity at bay every single day. For serving an ungrateful and violent public.
Imagine yourself looking underneath the Christmas tree at a gift with a tag on it saying, "From Dad", only knowing his funeral is next week.
Imagine your Dad being blatantly murdered at the hands of a crazed and radical individual, driven by media and political-instilled hate all because he wears a Police Officer's uniform.
Now, imagine yourself, a newly wed, ready to get your life on track with the love of your life. 2 months of marriage under your belt and you and your husband are planning your first Christmas together as a married couple. While out Christmas shopping for him, you get a phone call saying your husband has been shot and is in the hospital fighting for his life, only to find out he'd died in his patrol car for no reason.
This, ladies and gentlemen, is a reality we of the law enforcement community live with day by day. Every Police Officer's goal at the end of the day isn't to fuck you over for a speeding ticket or to pick on you because you're black, red, purple, white, a dog, or anything.
Their goal at the end of the day is to come home safe to the loving, embracing arms of their families at home. That is it.
So while you sit there, sympathizing with the criminals and becoming part of the problem by saying, "Hands up, don't shoot" or "I can't breathe" and preaching an ignorant and biased agenda against an individual who would willingly die for you in an instant, no matter if you like them or not; while you sit there with hate and distaste over the fact that they are "all racist" and they can hide behind the badge and without mercy, murder anyone they please-while you sit there and bask in all the hatred that has been ignited this past year, understand that they will ALWAYS be there to help you.
How could anyone have the audacity to hate the protectors? The unseen heroes of every day life?
Matthew 5:9-
"Blessed are the peacemakers, for they shall be called children of God."
God bless NYPD Officer Liu-EOW 12/20/2014
God bless NYPD Officer Ramos-EOW 12/20/2014
Godspeed gentlemen, your deaths will not be in vain.
-Signed, the grateful son of an oath keeping Peace Officer.
Lol. When reading this drivel I was imagining Jack Nicholson in A Few Good Men...
Col. Jessep: Son, we live in a world that has walls, and those walls have to be guarded by men with guns. Who's gonna do it? You? You, Lt. Weinburg? I have a greater responsibility than you could possibly fathom. You weep for Santiago, and you curse the Marines. You have that luxury. You have the luxury of not knowing what I know. That Santiago's death, while tragic, probably saved lives. And my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, saves lives. You don't want the truth because deep down in places you don't talk about at parties, you want me on that wall, you need me on that wall. We use words like honor, code, loyalty. We use these words as the backbone of a life spent defending something. You use them as a punchline. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the blanket of the very freedom that I provide, and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather you just said thank you, and went on your way, Otherwise, I suggest you pick up a weapon, and stand a post. Either way, I don't give a damn what you think you are entitled to.
Is anyone else bothered by the use of the term, thug? I feel like it's being thrown around pretty casually but I find it to be almost a substitue for other, more offensive terms
This has been discussed on here at length, and yeah, most people seem to agree it is code.
Yep. And still get to be respectable. "No, I'm not talking about blah people. I'm only talking about people with those hoodies who listen to all that rap music. The ones who don't do what police tell them."