How far does "in sickness and in health" go?

[ProfessorArtNerd]

I'm clear that I don't want to be married anymore. But there's a complicating matter. My H has been depressed for a long time. He's not doing well at all, and I feel like a jerk asking him to leave. Like I'm abandoning him. I'm the caretaker, right?

But on the other hand, Lucy is very much suffering as well.

I'm a bit paralyzed, as you can see. And he's manipulated me so much that I doubt my own judgment and seem to need permission to end it

Ughhh

[WOUNDTIGHT]

You can't fix him, and at this point I'd put my daughter' s well-being first.

If you need to have an "excuse" you can tell yourself you're doing a disservice NOt leaving him because as long as you are there he is going to KOKO and not make any changes (because you're handling all of his business). Maybe the change would force him to get his shit together. Or not, but that's on him.

[FastHands]

If he isn't willing to get help, it isn't sickness, it's neglect. Moreover, while that sickness may make it hard to be the best version of oneself, it does not excuse abusive behavior.

He abandoned his promises to you, and abandoned your marriage, long ago. You're just telling him to complete the process and physically remove himself.

[shopgirl07]

Your child is suffering. Is there really any more to say?

[drruth]

You're not the caretaker. If he's not willing to help himself there is nothing you can do to force him to get help. You are not a jerk- you are looking out for your children and yourself. You are not abandoning him, and you can and should leave. This is not an "in sickness and in health" situation, this is an abusive situation. By leaving you are showing him that you won't tolerate his behavior towards you or the children anymore, and that is not abandoning him.

[demelza]

Just keeping the current status quo helps no-one, including him. You know what you need to do here. Hugs and good thoughts to you.

[tacokick]

I think your main responsibility is to your children. They cannot help themselves, he can.

[BaliHai]

He's an adult who is unwilling to seek treatment for his mental illness; you are not his caretaker, you're his emotional prisoner. If he suddenly did a 180 and sought help and really made an effort and was still struggling, that would be a whole different ballgame. As it stands, whether it's intentional or not, his continued refusal of treatment is more manipulation.

[thatgirl2478]

Mar 29, 2017 7:59:16 GMT -5 FastHands said:

If he isn't willing to get help, it isn't sickness, it's neglect. Moreover, while that sickness may make it hard to be the best version of oneself, it does not excuse abusive behavior.

He abandoned his promises to you, and abandoned your marriage, long ago. You're just telling him to complete the process and physically remove himself.

This.
Save

[Deleted]

Mar 29, 2017 8:03:29 GMT -5 tacokick said:

I think your main responsibility is to your children. They cannot help themselves, he can.

Exactly this.

[lacey]

I will support my husband in sickness and in health. I will not support my husband in the abuse of myself or my children.

If your husband was actively seeking help (and hadn't waited years to do so), yes, I think it is gracious to allow for adjustment times for medication or therapy to start to help. That doesn't appear to be the case.

I take the decision to have kids just as seriously as I take my wedding vows. Until my child is an adult, I am responsible for her. I am responsible for keeping her safe and, relatively, happy. If my husband is not on board with that plan I must protect my young children over an adult, husband or not.

[kicks]

I didn't put "in sickness and in health" in my vows.

At the time I asked for a separation my ex might have been depressed or had anxiety, but those diagnoses don't make someone an asshole. I think he also threatened suicide at one point but I know that was just manipulation. So I didn't feel bad for leaving even if he did start working on getting help by going to 1 therapy appointment alone. At that point it was too little too late. One year was long enough for him to get his shit together.

You have no obligation to stay in a shitty relationship whether your partner is sick or healthy.

[samanthamkm]

If he is unwilling to get help after a couple of years of being this way, you aren't being a jerk. Would you want your children to be in a marriage like this? Right now you are showing them that it is okay for their father to treat mom this way, plus their own kids this way. (Does that make sense?) Where is your health in all of this? He is causing you to doubt yourself ( how is that healthy) and tear you down as a person. He isn't living up to his end of the vows.

[cuddlyevil]

"In sickness and health" does not mean you are responsible for his health or the maintenance of said health. It only means you support his efforts to get or stay healthy -- if he will not make any effort to be healthy then it's not on you.

If he is depressed and not doing anything about it, that is on him -- NOT you. You are not responsible for his mental health, happiness, employment, or anything he is an adult who needs to act like one.

That all said, it's okay to just be done and ask him to leave. You don't need to have any other reason than that, if people want to give you flack or demand an explanation they can go fuck right off because you owe them nothing.

[mrs.jacinthe]

Ask yourself this: if the tables were turned, would he stay with you? If you were unable to wait on him hand and foot, if you were unwilling to seek help, if you were unable to keep things running like a well-oiled machine, would he stay? (Hint: the answer is no.) You owe him *nothing* at this point. You have been more than patient. It's time to walk.

[Saint Monica]

He is abusive.  Pure and simple.

[shamrockshake]

I'll echo everyone else, if he refuses to acknowledge and seek help for it then it doesn't work for me. My DH was depressed for a long time and refused to do anything about it, it was really affecting me and the kids every day, I flat out told him do something or we're gone because I'm not going to live like this, it's not fair to anyone else. depression is one thing, refusing to do anything about it is another and it's not fair for those around them to have to deal with it

[speckledfrog]

Prof you deserve happiness. You deserve peace and you deserve to be comfortable in your own home. You can leave because behind the depression he still has a fundamentally flawed character. He's not a partner and I don't know that he ever really was. He has been manipulative for a long time. He has been selfish for a long time. He consistently puts himself first, with little to no regard for his family. That's not loving, cherishing, or honoring you. He's not holding up any part of his end of the bargain.

[shauni27]

Mar 29, 2017 8:19:28 GMT -5 cuddlyevil said:

"In sickness and health" does not mean you are responsible for his health or the maintenance of said health. It only means you support his efforts to get or stay healthy -- if he will not make any effort to be healthy then it's not on you.

If he is depressed and not doing anything about it, that is on him -- NOT you. You are not responsible for his mental health, happiness, employment, or anything he is an adult who needs to act like one.

That all said, it's okay to just be done and ask him to leave. You don't need to have any other reason than that, if people want to give you flack or demand an explanation they can go fuck right off because you owe them nothing.

I rarely post on this board, so I hope I am not giving unwanted "advice."

When I was in an emotionally abusive relationship years ago, my then BF told me if I ever left him he would kill himself. He had access to guns and was mentally unstable, so I knew he would. I was terrified to leave him because I felt responsible for his well being--I felt like I would be responsible for him killing himself.

Someone who I didn't know very well was able to pick up on the signs that I was in a terrible relationship just one day pulled me aside and said "I don't know what you are going through, but I just want you to know that he is not your responsibility, no matter what." That gave me the courage to leave and really opened my eyes.

So, all of that is to say, you are not responsible for his health, despite your vows of "in sickness and in health."

[VillainV]

I haven't responded to a lot of your posts, but I've read most of them. It sounds like you are looking for someone to tell you it's okay to leave. IT'S OKAY. It's not just okay, it's the RIGHT THING TO DO.

[closertofine]

This was the exact debate I had and why it took me so long to finally decided to get out. My stbx has had severe mental illness since I met him. And I do honestly believe it is just that, an illness, so I wrestled with, "well, if he had cancer, I wouldn't abandon him, would I?" And my stbx was seeking treatment (though not as aggressively as I thought he should be). When it got to the point where I saw it begin to affect my children, and I could see how that was never going to change, I finally got the wake up call that I needed.

It's been a year and a half. He has still not improved, nor has he sought different treatment (I know this because of court proceedings). While I still struggle with the effect this divorce is having/will have on my kids, we are all so much happier and at peace now than we were in October 2015. There have been many truly horrible moments in the past year and a half, ones that have made me fear for my children's and my own safety, but I can say I am infinitely relieved it is no longer going on under my own roof.

Hugs to you.

[idahome]

I completely understand feeling like you need permission to leave. The truth is, you already have it. The way he treats you and your children is permission enough.

I am sorry this is so hard. You will get there, though, because you have to.

[Linie]

Mar 29, 2017 7:59:16 GMT -5 FastHands said:

If he isn't willing to get help, it isn't sickness, it's neglect. Moreover, while that sickness may make it hard to be the best version of oneself, it does not excuse abusive behavior.

He abandoned his promises to you, and abandoned your marriage, long ago. You're just telling him to complete the process and physically remove himself.

I could not have phrased it better. This is all the answer you need. No guilt. You have warned him sufficiently.

[bittybomb]

I adore my husband and would really do nearly anything for him.  The only exception to that though is if his presence in our home, or our marriage/relationship was negatively affecting or impacting our kids in any way, I'd be out.

He's a grown up and can look out for himself.  Your kids are kids, and need their grownups to look out for them.

[hopecounts]

It's OK to leave him.
He is not being a partner or a father and you and the kids deserve better.
Your responsibility is to support him in efforts to get healthy if he isn't doing that and it's hurting your kids the way it is your responsibility shifts to protecting them and making sure they have a safe, calm, happy home and in this case that means kicking him out.

[CurlyQ284]

Speaking as someone with depression, I sought help and have been on medication for years and therapy when needed. He CAN help himself. He really can. You need to take care of yourself and your kids ((hugs))

[margarita]

Mar 29, 2017 7:59:16 GMT -5 FastHands said:

If he isn't willing to get help, it isn't sickness, it's neglect. Moreover, while that sickness may make it hard to be the best version of oneself, it does not excuse abusive behavior.

He abandoned his promises to you, and abandoned your marriage, long ago. You're just telling him to complete the process and physically remove himself.

Exactly this!

(((Prof))) You are NOT a jerk! It's okay to be done and ask him to leave.

[lovelyshoes]

Your responsibility is to your kids, not him. He doesn't seem to be doing a thing to get better or get help. Has he done anything that you've asked him to do? I think you know what you need to do and you shouldn't feel any guilt doing it. Take care of yourself and your babies. Cut the dead weight off your back.

[amandakisser]

I hope this doesn't come off the wrong way...but are you SURE he's that depressed? Or is it another way he is manipulating you? Right now, he has ZERO incentive to change - as you said, you're his caretaker and he basically has no responsibilities in life. I want to be respectful of depression, as I've suffered from it myself, but knowing your history I have to wonder.

If he is truly depressed, you leaving will (hopefully) be his rock bottom and he will have no choice but to either seek help or live in squalor.

If he's manipulating you into believing he's depressed, well...obviously by leaving that will take care of that issue, won't it?

As always, I'm rooting for you!

[Ohhmm(bligo)]

To the end of the driveway where his stuff goes.