You should probably rephrase this. Token? Like how do you know this black person is a "token?"
I'm sorry, you are absolutely right. I was being cynical about my office's hiring history. I actually do know for a fact that she was hired on her merit and not because she is black. I should not have phrased it that way. ETA even if I didn't know, I shouldn't have phrased it that way. I just wish we would focus on hiring more non-white people instead of making sure we have a man in here. Surely we have qualified applicants each time who are not white.
I know you apologized above, but I just can't stop thinking about this. I think I understand what you were trying to convey in using "token," but that was such an unfortunate choice. I'm losing faith that we can do better here.😕
(And in case that emoji goes funky on the app, he's the half-frowny disappointed one.)
Trying for #3; FET 8/18 -- BFN. Leaving things up to chance for now... After three years, three IVFs, and two FETs, we finally have our miracle babIES!
Guilty. Working in academia is like a smug white liberal echo chamber sometimes.
Yes. I worked on the staff side at Berkeley, and my xH was a grad student. I couldn't stand the paternalism sometimes. The city was (is still?) run by left-leaning Democrats and Socialists, yet there were, and are, huge disparities in performance between black and white kids in the public schools. Drugs were everywhere, yet the white people I hung out with never got in trouble; arrests only were made in poor, predominantly African-American areas. People were super happy to decry the racist policing in L.A., but never lifted a finger to change the biases right in our own city.
there's an enormous difference between the flats of Berkeley (and Oakland too) and the hills. the folks in the hills pat each other on the back for living such a diverse place yet they enact policies that greatly affect the flats aka nanny state of Berkeley.
Post by barefootcontessa on Sept 15, 2016 7:21:53 GMT -5
fyi: "token" is generally a pejorative term. Like when you say, "token of appreciation," you mean something small, not important. The above comment shows why black persons have to be twice as good to achieve the same level. The bias is assume a black person holding a desired position is there because they are black -- and they have to work twice as hard in order to overcome that bias.
@tambcat just stop talking. You keep saying racist and/or offensive things, trying to explain them and offering non apologies. Your intent is irrelevant. If you are truly interested in learning anything than you need to shut up and listen.
@tambcat just stop talking. You keep saying racist and/or offensive things, trying to explain them and offering non apologies. Your intent is irrelevant. If you are truly interested in learning anything than you need to shut up and listen.
Also @tambcat, don't ever fucking type out the N word ever again. Stop. FUCKING STOP.
Wait, what?! How on earth could you think that is ok? @tambcat, seriously?!??!??
@tambcat just stop talking. You keep saying racist and/or offensive things, trying to explain them and offering non apologies. Your intent is irrelevant. If you are truly interested in learning anything than you need to shut up and listen.
Also @tambcat , don't ever fucking type out the N word ever again. Stop. FUCKING STOP.
Please tell me you mean natariru and not the other N word. PLEASE, OMG.
Post by pizzapizza on Sept 15, 2016 9:02:51 GMT -5
@tambcat seriously wtf is wrong with you. That is racist as shit to write that out 2 days ago. That is not LISTENING AND LEARNING. Nor is token either which is insulting as fuck. No white person should say or write that word.
can't believe (although I should) that Texas has textbooks calling Mexicans lazy. Or that someone as young as she is had a school teacher talking to the class about "niggers." Please note, I'm not doubting her, I'm just horrified. Of course, it's easy for me to be outraged at these flagrant examples of racism, because they're the kinds of things I feel like I've "risen above." I would never say THAT stuff. What's really sad that we can spot and decry all of that shit and still make the spaces we dominate (including here, apparently) uncomfortable for black people.
can't believe (although I should) that Texas has textbooks calling Mexicans lazy. Or that someone as young as she is had a school teacher talking to the class about " ." Please note, I'm not doubting her, I'm just horrified. Of course, it's easy for me to be outraged at these flagrant examples of racism, because they're the kinds of things I feel like I've "risen above." I would never say THAT stuff. What's really sad that we can spot and decry all of that shit and still make the spaces we dominate (including here, apparently) uncomfortable for black people.
That's rich, especially the part making the boards "uncomfortable for black people." @tambcat you really need to shut up and stop offering your opinion. And for fucks sake don't never type out that word again! I assure there is no place or context that it will ever be appropriate.
meanwhile, i visibly flinched when I read it. really? that's something you're just comfortable reading/hearing right between fall and winter mini Boden lineups? no big deal, right?
how nice for you.
No, it's not . I don't use that word and I have asked people not to use it around me or my kids. I thought I had read in the past that it was worse to dance around it when talking about racism and the terrible things white people have said to black people because it minimizes the horror.
I don't think there's anything I can say at this point to make you, collectively, believe I'm not a hateful, racist person who doesn't care about anything but kids clothes. I would hope the people who have gotten to know me over the years would know that that is not who I am. I am trying to show I care by joining in the conversations, since people have told me it is hurtful to stay silent, but I've done so much more harm now that I wish I hadn't.Â
How about reflecting all posts directed at you, reading some of the linked articles, not posting every thought that enters your head, and offering a sincere apology (without excuses or explanations)?
meanwhile, i visibly flinched when I read it. really? that's something you're just comfortable reading/hearing right between fall and winter mini Boden lineups? no big deal, right?
how nice for you.
No, it's not . I don't use that word and I have asked people not to use it around me or my kids. I thought I had read in the past that it was worse to dance around it when talking about racism and the terrible things white people have said to black people because it minimizes the horror.
I don't think there's anything I can say at this point to make you, collectively, believe I'm not a hateful, racist person who doesn't care about anything but kids clothes. I would hope the people who have gotten to know me over the years would know that that is not who I am. I am trying to show I care by joining in the conversations, since people have told me it is hurtful to stay silent, but I've done so much more harm now that I wish I hadn't.
I keep trying to post in here and I keep deleting. I am not trying to ignore this thread. I am just so out of it these days ( insomnia SUCKS). I actually am trying to type up a word document so I can go back and edit.
meanwhile, i visibly flinched when I read it. really? that's something you're just comfortable reading/hearing right between fall and winter mini Boden lineups? no big deal, right?
how nice for you.
No, it's not . I don't use that word and I have asked people not to use it around me or my kids. I thought I had read in the past that it was worse to dance around it when talking about racism and the terrible things white people have said to black people because it minimizes the horror.
I don't think there's anything I can say at this point to make you, collectively, believe I'm not a hateful, racist person who doesn't care about anything but kids clothes. I would hope the people who have gotten to know me over the years would know that that is not who I am. I am trying to show I care by joining in the conversations, since people have told me it is hurtful to stay silent, but I've done so much more harm now that I wish I hadn't.Â
Post by karinothing on Sept 15, 2016 9:52:16 GMT -5
UGH I actually really want to have a discussion about this article but now I just want to punch things.
It is not okay to use words like token and it is 100% not okay to use the "n" word EVER. Like don't type it, don't refer to it when quoting someone, and don't sing along to it in songs. That pretty much goes for every racial slur out there.
meanwhile, i visibly flinched when I read it. really? that's something you're just comfortable reading/hearing right between fall and winter mini Boden lineups? no big deal, right?
how nice for you.
No, it's not . I don't use that word and I have asked people not to use it around me or my kids. I thought I had read in the past that it was worse to dance around it when talking about racism and the terrible things white people have said to black people because it minimizes the horror.
I don't think there's anything I can say at this point to make you, collectively, believe I'm not a hateful, racist person who doesn't care about anything but kids clothes. I would hope the people who have gotten to know me over the years would know that that is not who I am. I am trying to show I care by joining in the conversations, since people have told me it is hurtful to stay silent, but I've done so much more harm now that I wish I hadn't.
I don't even know what to say to this. I keep typing and deleting because WTAF. You think that you care and maybe you do want to do better, but stuff like this doesn't come out of your mouth (or fingers) if you're not a racist.
Post by DesertMoon on Sept 15, 2016 10:01:54 GMT -5
@tambcat
this isn't right. Wtf are you thinking? Please think deeply about the things you say. This shit is just so low.
I've posted with you for a long time, you're indifference has already been called out, and now you're calling people token black people and typing up the N word? Can you see how fucked up it is?
meanwhile, i visibly flinched when I read it. really? that's something you're just comfortable reading/hearing right between fall and winter mini Boden lineups? no big deal, right?
how nice for you.
No, it's not . I don't use that word and I have asked people not to use it around me or my kids. I thought I had read in the past that it was worse to dance around it when talking about racism and the terrible things white people have said to black people because it minimizes the horror.
I don't think there's anything I can say at this point to make you, collectively, believe I'm not a hateful, racist person who doesn't care about anything but kids clothes. I would hope the people who have gotten to know me over the years would know that that is not who I am. I am trying to show I care by joining in the conversations, since people have told me it is hurtful to stay silent, but I've done so much more harm now that I wish I hadn't.
Here's my honest suggestion to you. Stop and think before you post. If you're really attempting to learn, it may behoove you to seriously consider all that has been posted on these boards the past few weeks.
It's not that hard to be more sensitive in your word choice. Just like you choose your words when conveying feelings to your spouse, kids, friends, etc, give WOC the same respect. It's not that hard. I promise.