I feel for those kids. Unless they were aware, i would be pretty embarrassed if my mom had done this "for" me.
if their parents went to this extreme, though, i doubt this is the first time these kids have been handed shit w/o having to do anything for it.
Considering that one of Aunt Becky's daughters has multiple videos showing her Christmas "hauls" that include Chanel bags and more, that's likely very true. Oh and she also has her own makeup palette which I'm sure her parents funded the creation of.
Can I share a funny semi-related story? About 10 years ago my parents were in Russia and the tourguide was telling my dad about various corruption schemes people do. One was a guy who told parents he had special connections at elite schools and could help get their kids in, for a fee of course. So people would apply as usual, but pay him a fee for him to grease the skids behind the scenes. He promised a full money back guarantee if the kids didn't get in to their school of choice. So the people who gave him money and their kids got into their schools were thrilled that he came through for them and he fully refunded the money for people whose kids didn't get in, so they may have been disappointed, but had no beef with this guy. I don't know how/ when he got caught, but what the scam turned out to be was that he didn't do anything. He didn't have any connections or do anything to help kids get in. the ones who got accepted did so on their own (unknowingly) and happily gave him money.
A lot of them posed for pictures pretending to play sports they didn’t.
True, but I don't think that was the case for everyone. Though I would have been suspicious if my SAT score miraculously went up by 400 points.
Many were also sent letters congratulating them on joining various teams. They were given extra time on the SAT, they had people change their scores, write their essays. Unless they were in a coma, the kids knew.
Post by Velar Fricative on Mar 12, 2019 19:32:17 GMT -5
I am sure there will be a bunch of white kids and their parents who think this is terribly unfair and will sue these people for taking up precious elite college spots they deserved more.
ETA: In case the sarcasm doesn’t read well, I’m totally sarcastic.
I’m always torn on the teens in this and other cases. Yes they are the age to know right from wrong and yes some of them are terrible.
But they were led by terrible adults saying oh yeah it’s fine. It’s OK. Adults that raised them. Or by teachers and schools in a different case saying yeah that’s OK. People who have authority over them and who are their role models.
Do all of them raised this was just stay entitled forever? Do some eventually learn and cast off those terrible values they were taught? And if so how long into adulthood does that happen?
I was raised with morals and questioning authority. But how many are raised to just go along?
I am not saying that they are not in the wrong here because they knew what was happening and were definitely in the wrong.
I guess I am wondering how much is responsibility of an adult versus a teen in cases where they are misled by adults.
True, but I don't think that was the case for everyone. Though I would have been suspicious if my SAT score miraculously went up by 400 points.
Many were also sent letters congratulating them on joining various teams. They were given extra time on the SAT, they had people change their scores, write their essays. Unless they were in a coma, the kids knew.
Goodness. I am guessing, on some level, this has been how their lives have always been. Getting the special treatment and all that jazz without really earning it.
Can I share a funny semi-related story? About 10 years ago my parents were in Russia and the tourguide was telling my dad about various corruption schemes people do. One was a guy who told parents he had special connections at elite schools and could help get their kids in, for a fee of course. So people would apply as usual, but pay him a fee for him to grease the skids behind the scenes. He promised a full money back guarantee if the kids didn't get in to their school of choice. So the people who gave him money and their kids got into their schools were thrilled that he came through for them and he fully refunded the money for people whose kids didn't get in, so they may have been disappointed, but had no beef with this guy. I don't know how/ when he got caught, but what the scam turned out to be was that he didn't do anything. He didn't have any connections or do anything to help kids get in. the ones who got accepted did so on their own (unknowingly) and happily gave him money.
This is hilarious and awesome. Nothing like scamming the scammer.
Can I share a funny semi-related story? About 10 years ago my parents were in Russia and the tourguide was telling my dad about various corruption schemes people do. One was a guy who told parents he had special connections at elite schools and could help get their kids in, for a fee of course. So people would apply as usual, but pay him a fee for him to grease the skids behind the scenes. He promised a full money back guarantee if the kids didn't get in to their school of choice. So the people who gave him money and their kids got into their schools were thrilled that he came through for them and he fully refunded the money for people whose kids didn't get in, so they may have been disappointed, but had no beef with this guy. I don't know how/ when he got caught, but what the scam turned out to be was that he didn't do anything. He didn't have any connections or do anything to help kids get in. the ones who got accepted did so on their own (unknowingly) and happily gave him money.
/files away idea in "alternative retirement funding plans" folder
Can I share a funny semi-related story? About 10 years ago my parents were in Russia and the tourguide was telling my dad about various corruption schemes people do. One was a guy who told parents he had special connections at elite schools and could help get their kids in, for a fee of course. So people would apply as usual, but pay him a fee for him to grease the skids behind the scenes. He promised a full money back guarantee if the kids didn't get in to their school of choice. So the people who gave him money and their kids got into their schools were thrilled that he came through for them and he fully refunded the money for people whose kids didn't get in, so they may have been disappointed, but had no beef with this guy. I don't know how/ when he got caught, but what the scam turned out to be was that he didn't do anything. He didn't have any connections or do anything to help kids get in. the ones who got accepted did so on their own (unknowingly) and happily gave him money.
I want to know more about how answers on standardized entrance exams were changed. Proctor's aren't hand scoring exams...unless they are just super smart themselves, they don't know the answers. It's not like ACT is providing them the answer key. There is a ton of security and procedures around testing and scoring. Was this someone on the inside? None are listed currently so maybe not? But then how?
I used to work at ACT and still have a lot of friends there. I'm curious if anything more will come of this aspect of things.
I want to know more about how answers on standardized entrance exams were changed. Proctor's aren't hand scoring exams...unless they are just super smart themselves, they don't know the answers. It's not like ACT is providing them the answer key. There is a ton of security and procedures around testing and scoring. Was this someone on the inside? None are listed currently so maybe not? But then how?
I used to work at ACT and still have a lot of friends there. I'm curious if anything more will come of this aspect of things.
I feel like it would have to be someone on the inside, because i am agree with you, i am not sure how a proctor would be able to adjust the test score right there, in the moment. Or do they have a test already filled out and swap out the tests??
I want to know more about how answers on standardized entrance exams were changed. Proctor's aren't hand scoring exams...unless they are just super smart themselves, they don't know the answers. It's not like ACT is providing them the answer key. There is a ton of security and procedures around testing and scoring. Was this someone on the inside? None are listed currently so maybe not? But then how?
I used to work at ACT and still have a lot of friends there. I'm curious if anything more will come of this aspect of things.
I feel like it would have to be someone on the inside, because i am agree with you, i am not sure how a proctor would be able to adjust the test score right there, in the moment. Or do they have a test already filled out and swap out the tests??
It sounds like some were swapped with a completed test. Maybe swapped with someone else who sat the exam at the same sitting who was super-smart? I mean, they weren’t (obviously) getting perfect scores.
This kind of reminds me of that girl from Florida (I think?) whose second SAT was invalidated because they say her score improved too much between first and second attempts. She is black. At least a few of these rich kids took the test more than once, but the disparity in scores didn’t ring any alarm bells???
I want to know more about how answers on standardized entrance exams were changed. Proctor's aren't hand scoring exams...unless they are just super smart themselves, they don't know the answers. It's not like ACT is providing them the answer key. There is a ton of security and procedures around testing and scoring. Was this someone on the inside? None are listed currently so maybe not? But then how?
I used to work at ACT and still have a lot of friends there. I'm curious if anything more will come of this aspect of things.
I feel like it would have to be someone on the inside, because i am agree with you, i am not sure how a proctor would be able to adjust the test score right there, in the moment. Or do they have a test already filled out and swap out the tests??
I listened to the Washington Post podcast on this today and they said they brought in people who were just very gifted test takers. The College Board wasn’t involved and there wasn’t any inside information on the tests.
Post by sporklemotion on Mar 12, 2019 20:54:36 GMT -5
I’m guessing that it’s a test coordinator and/or that kids have accommodations that make them the only one in the room. So the proctor changes answers before the tests get sent back to the agencies. The College Board wouldn’t know that it was mailed at 4 pm instead of 1 pm or whatever. I’ve proctored PSATs and you sign booklets in and out, but it’s kind of an honor system when you report the times, etc. They care that they get back all of the booklets, but you could order an extra and just report that the student didn’t show, or have someone else sign up to take it (adults can do this). While kids are taking the test, you figure out and write down the right answers. Or swap bubble sheets at the end. There are ID #s on them but kids bubble those themselves and I suppose the proctor could switch the codes on the chester’sssnd the ringer’s tests. They are stricter about checking ID than they used to be, but if the administrators or proctors are cheating, it’s hard for the College Board to catch it right away because they’re the ones enforcing the rules.
This kind of reminds me of that girl from Florida (I think?) whose second SAT was invalidated because they say her score improved too much between first and second attempts. She is black. At least a few of these rich kids took the test more than once, but the disparity in scores didn’t ring any alarm bells???
I want to know more about how answers on standardized entrance exams were changed. Proctor's aren't hand scoring exams...unless they are just super smart themselves, they don't know the answers. It's not like ACT is providing them the answer key. There is a ton of security and procedures around testing and scoring. Was this someone on the inside? None are listed currently so maybe not? But then how?
I used to work at ACT and still have a lot of friends there. I'm curious if anything more will come of this aspect of things.
PDQ - So DH was just telling me a story that could shed some light on this. He played HS football with someone who played in the NFL. Definitely not a dumb guy by any means, but not a brainiac either, and he needed some help getting his test scores up so that he wasn't getting a football scholarship with a horrible SAT score. He did end up receiving some accommodations for the SAT where the questions were read aloud to him, accommodations that DH thought were odd at the time since he didn't have a learning disability or visual impairment. He eventually learned that the proctors would read the test questions out loud and would read the answers in such a way where you knew what the answers were. So that's one example of how a proctor could be part of a scam, though not necessarily what happened in any of these cases. i'm sure there are other ways to help a test-taker get the score they need.
I feel like it would have to be someone on the inside, because i am agree with you, i am not sure how a proctor would be able to adjust the test score right there, in the moment. Or do they have a test already filled out and swap out the tests??
It sounds like some were swapped with a completed test. Maybe swapped with someone else who sat the exam at the same sitting who was super-smart? I mean, they weren’t (obviously) getting perfect scores.
This kind of reminds me of that girl from Florida (I think?) whose second SAT was invalidated because they say her score improved too much between first and second attempts. She is black. At least a few of these rich kids took the test more than once, but the disparity in scores didn’t ring any alarm bells???
I read most of the complaint earlier and in one of the phone conversations the lead scammer in charge talked about not increasing the score more than 30% so that there weren't any red flags.
It may be flameful, but I'm pretty torn on the kids involved in this. Like, I guess if you worked your way through and earned the degree, you deserve to have the degree. On the other hand, you shouldn't have even been there in the first place, so it seems pretty shitty that these kids are getting the advantage of having degrees from elite colleges that they never should have gotten into in the first place.
I don't feel surprised by most of this. On some level it feels like, "well, sure, that's totally plausible." It's pretty next level to go changing your kid's SAT/ACT scores though. Jesus.
I feel like it would have to be someone on the inside, because i am agree with you, i am not sure how a proctor would be able to adjust the test score right there, in the moment. Or do they have a test already filled out and swap out the tests??
I listened to the Washington Post podcast on this today and they said they brought in people who were just very gifted test takers. The College Board wasn’t involved and there wasn’t any inside information on the tests.
I will say that after this scandal broke I realized 2 things: 1. I should have applied to much better schools 2. I really missed an opportunity to make a ton of cash taking tests for rich kids.
I want to know more about how answers on standardized entrance exams were changed. Proctor's aren't hand scoring exams...unless they are just super smart themselves, they don't know the answers. It's not like ACT is providing them the answer key. There is a ton of security and procedures around testing and scoring. Was this someone on the inside? None are listed currently so maybe not? But then how?
I used to work at ACT and still have a lot of friends there. I'm curious if anything more will come of this aspect of things.
I feel like it would have to be someone on the inside, because i am agree with you, i am not sure how a proctor would be able to adjust the test score right there, in the moment. Or do they have a test already filled out and swap out the tests??
I don't know, but where would they even get the test? This stuff is on serious lockdown. There are not extras, and filled out tests with correct answers aren't just laying around! It makes no sense to me.
I guess having someone smart sit for the test, or even take a look at the test afterward, is possible. But my impression is that the proctors don't even hang onto the tests themselves for long after it's done. Maybe I'm wrong about that.
I want to know more about how answers on standardized entrance exams were changed. Proctor's aren't hand scoring exams...unless they are just super smart themselves, they don't know the answers. It's not like ACT is providing them the answer key. There is a ton of security and procedures around testing and scoring. Was this someone on the inside? None are listed currently so maybe not? But then how?
I used to work at ACT and still have a lot of friends there. I'm curious if anything more will come of this aspect of things.
When I taught I was transferred to a new school right at standardized test time. I didn’t have a class yet and so I just helped out. Some of those teachers would read out the test emphasizing certain phrases that included clues or the answer.
These were small kids so the questions being read aloud was standard but it seems like the same thing could happen for the SATs to me. They said some got to take tests alone or with unlimited time. If the proctor was a good test taker (which I assume for these purposes they would be) they could just take the test along with the kid and give them answers or guide them. It would explain why the one girl only got in the 1300s.
And I did turn in the cheating teachers to the school board!
It may be flameful, but I'm pretty torn on the kids involved in this. Like, I guess if you worked your way through and earned the degree, you deserve to have the degree. On the other hand, you shouldn't have even been there in the first place, so it seems pretty shitty that these kids are getting the advantage of having degrees from elite colleges that they never should have gotten into in the first place.
I don't feel surprised by most of this. On some level it feels like, "well, sure, that's totally plausible." It's pretty next level to go changing your kid's SAT/ACT scores though. Jesus.
Let them retake the tests on their own and apply again!
It may be flameful, but I'm pretty torn on the kids involved in this. Like, I guess if you worked your way through and earned the degree, you deserve to have the degree. On the other hand, you shouldn't have even been there in the first place, so it seems pretty shitty that these kids are getting the advantage of having degrees from elite colleges that they never should have gotten into in the first place.
I don't feel surprised by most of this. On some level it feels like, "well, sure, that's totally plausible." It's pretty next level to go changing your kid's SAT/ACT scores though. Jesus.
Let them retake the tests on their own and apply again!
Yeah, but that's the thing, kids with high scores and lots of extracurriculars are truly a dime a dozen. That's why schools like that have to be so selective. So to say, "well, just take the test again and if you cross this particular threshold we'll honor your admission," doesn't really seem fair. What about the other kids who had the same scores and still didn't get in on their merits?
I feel like it would have to be someone on the inside, because i am agree with you, i am not sure how a proctor would be able to adjust the test score right there, in the moment. Or do they have a test already filled out and swap out the tests??
I don't know, but where would they even get the test? This stuff is on serious lockdown. There are not extras, and filled out tests with correct answers aren't just laying around! It makes no sense to me.
I guess having someone smart sit for the test, or even take a look at the test afterward, is possible. But my impression is that the proctors don't even hang onto the tests themselves for long after it's done. Maybe I'm wrong about that.
The article I read said the employees of the scam company were also the proctors. They would sign up to take the tests on a weekend in a different city. Because they “qualified” for extra time, it would be a 2 day test.
Let them retake the tests on their own and apply again!
Yeah, but that's the thing, kids with high scores and lots of extracurriculars are truly a dime a dozen. That's why schools like that have to be so selective. So to say, "well, just take the test again and if you cross this particular threshold we'll honor your admission," doesn't really seem fair. What about the other kids who had the same scores and still didn't get in on their merits?
I think they should be kicked out and have to apply elsewhere with new scores and this hanging over their heads. I didn’t mean for them to stay at their current, grifted school. If they can’t get in anywhere or fail out oh well.
Yeah, but that's the thing, kids with high scores and lots of extracurriculars are truly a dime a dozen. That's why schools like that have to be so selective. So to say, "well, just take the test again and if you cross this particular threshold we'll honor your admission," doesn't really seem fair. What about the other kids who had the same scores and still didn't get in on their merits?
I think they should be kicked out and have to apply elsewhere with new scores and this hanging over their heads. I didn’t mean for them to stay at their current, grifted school. If they can’t get in anywhere or fail out oh well.
I think they should be kicked out and have to apply elsewhere with new scores and this hanging over their heads. I didn’t mean for them to stay at their current, grifted school. If they can’t get in anywhere or fail out oh well.