Democrats openly talk about replacing Biden

[sakoro]

In the NY Times and Washington Post this morning some Democratic Party operatives are talking about replacing Biden. I would bet we have a new candidate by the convention on August 19.
Washington Post: Democrats panic over Biden’s debate performance, doubt his future

On Capitol Hill, the panic among Democratic lawmakers and staffers was also palpable, as they privately acknowledged that calls for Biden to step aside were only likely to grow as the party fully processed Biden’s dismal debate night performance…

... “We’re so [f---ed],” texted one Democratic strategist in a battleground state. “He has great material. He just cannot deliver a single line.”

Julián Castro, the former Democratic mayor of San Antonio who served in President Barack Obama’s Cabinet, called the debate “completely predictable.”

“Biden had a very low bar going into the debate and failed to clear even that bar,” Castro wrote on X. “He seemed unprepared, lost, and not strong enough to parry effectively with Trump, who lies constantly.”

Speaking to MSNBC’s Rachel Maddow, David Plouffe, former senior adviser to Obama, described the debate as a “Defcon 1 moment.”

New York Times A Fumbling Performance, and a Panicking Party

“Biden is about to face a crescendo of calls to step aside,” said a veteran Democratic strategist who has staunchly backed Mr. Biden publicly. “Joe had a deep well of affection among Democrats. It has run dry.”

“Parties exist to win,” this Democrat continued. “The man on the stage with Trump cannot win. The fear of Trump stifled criticism of Biden. Now that same fear is going to fuel calls for him to step down.”

A group of House Democrats said they were watching the debate together, and one, who spoke on the condition of anonymity, acknowledged that it was a “disaster” for Mr. Biden. The person said the group was discussing the need for a new presidential nominee.

Mark Buell, a prominent donor for Mr. Biden and the Democratic Party, said after the debate that the president had to strongly consider whether he is the best person to be the nominee. “Do we have time to put somebody else in there?” Mr. Buell said.
…..
No incumbent president has dropped out of the race so late in the campaign cycle, and there was little consensus about what would happen if he were to. On Thursday night, Democrats were imagining scenarios in which party elders like Senator Chuck Schumer of New York, former Speaker Nancy Pelosi of California and Representative James E. Clyburn of South Carolina were to intervene with Mr. Biden.

[rubytue]

I’ve had one friend who has been predicting this path for a couple months. And, I don’t thing it’s wrong. we need someone energizing, because there is a huge swath of the population that doesn’t see this as life as we know it vs a dictator.

[konapoppy]

If the dems history has shown us anything, this isn’t going to happen.

And who could they even pick with name recognition and likability at this point? Oprah?!

[imimahoney]

The president of the Massachusetts State Senate just called for Biden to step aside.

[laladypoet]

Jun 28, 2024 8:42:26 GMT -5 konapoppy said:

If the dems history has shown us anything, this isn’t going to happen.

And who could they even pick with name recognition and likability at this point? Oprah?!

...Bernie? don't hit me.

[fernweh]

Jun 28, 2024 8:42:26 GMT -5 konapoppy said:

If the dems history has shown us anything, this isn’t going to happen.

And who could they even pick with name recognition and likability at this point? Oprah?!

This is what I was thinking. Who? I would worry that they would try to push Harris which don’t get me wrong, I like her and think she would be a good president. I don’t think she would drive enough voters to win though.

I don’t think this is the wrong thing to do but they would need to move fast and I just don’t think they have anyone with the name recognition ready.

[jinkies]

Jun 28, 2024 8:42:26 GMT -5 konapoppy said:

If the dems history has shown us anything, this isn’t going to happen.

And who could they even pick with name recognition and likability at this point? Oprah?!

I think you are right on the first point.

On the second point-- does it really matter? Literally no one, not even die-hard Dem voters, are voting for Biden the man. They are voting for the Dem ticket because they believe it and/or because the alternative is Trump. Those people will vote for whoever has a D after their name.

So could someone younger/more energizing be any worse? At least there might be a *chance* of inspiring less involved/ younger/ independent voters to go to the polls, if for nothing else than to vote for something different. 

[babsbunny]

Trump's team would destroy publicly anyone Ds pick. They'll spin up a million lies in a second. There are very few people in the world he would not attack: Michelle Obama (she's adament she'd never run), Ivanka... I can't think of any more.

With Biden, the Dem campaign can predict and combat the lies the R campaign will spread.

[konapoppy]

Jun 28, 2024 8:49:42 GMT -5 jinkies said:

Jun 28, 2024 8:42:26 GMT -5 konapoppy said:

If the dems history has shown us anything, this isn’t going to happen.

And who could they even pick with name recognition and likability at this point? Oprah?!

I think you are right on the first point.

On the second point-- does it really matter? Literally no one, not even die-hard Dem voters, are voting for Biden the man. They are voting for the Dem ticket because they believe it and/or because the alternative is Trump. Those people will vote for whoever has a D after their name.

So could someone younger/more energizing be any worse? At least there might be a *chance* of inspiring less involved/ younger/ independent voters to go to the polls, if for nothing else than to vote for something different. 

Yes, it matters because people for sure won’t vote for someone they haven’t even heard of at this point. In swing states, this will matter more than in blue strong holds.

[underwaterrhymes]

Jun 28, 2024 8:45:06 GMT -5 laladypoet said:

Jun 28, 2024 8:42:26 GMT -5 konapoppy said:

If the dems history has shown us anything, this isn’t going to happen.

And who could they even pick with name recognition and likability at this point? Oprah?!

...Bernie? don't hit me.

No.

[pixy0stix]

Jun 28, 2024 8:45:06 GMT -5 laladypoet said:

Jun 28, 2024 8:42:26 GMT -5 konapoppy said:

If the dems history has shown us anything, this isn’t going to happen.

And who could they even pick with name recognition and likability at this point? Oprah?!

...Bernie? don't hit me.

Sure, replace an 81 yo with an 82 yo who has been in declining health. Sounds legit.

[livinitup]

My teenager was watching the debate with us and asked me why we had to have these two.

We don’t.

But we will in November. It’s embarrassing. I am embarrassed in front of my teenager.

[stuffandthings]

Jun 28, 2024 8:42:26 GMT -5 konapoppy said:

If the dems history has shown us anything, this isn’t going to happen.

And who could they even pick with name recognition and likability at this point? Oprah?!

Harris. She's got similar likeability numbers to Biden but her unfavorables are actually better and she's a stronger pick with Black voters. She can come off as feisty in a Trump debate but she's a political moderate so she can keep the never Trumpers. 81 million people already voted for her to be VP in 2024. If Biden resigns now she could govern for five months and make her case to the country.

www.politico.com/news/2024/06/12/kamala-harris-favorability-poll-00162093

[kadams767]

Jun 28, 2024 9:51:00 GMT -5 stuffandthings said:

Jun 28, 2024 8:42:26 GMT -5 konapoppy said:

If the dems history has shown us anything, this isn’t going to happen.

And who could they even pick with name recognition and likability at this point? Oprah?!

Harris. She's got similar likeability numbers to Biden but her unfavorables are actually better and she's a stronger pick with Black voters. She can come off as feisty in a Trump debate but she's a political moderate so she can keep the never Trumpers. 81 million people already voted for her to be VP in 2024. If Biden resigns now she could govern for five months and make her case to the country.

www.politico.com/news/2024/06/12/kamala-harris-favorability-poll-00162093

Wait.  This is no longer just about Biden stepping away from being the nominee, but resigning as current president as well?  Oh man.  I am pretty sure this is even less likely than him stepping down as nominee.  

[kadams767]

Jun 28, 2024 8:59:44 GMT -5 babsbunny said:

Trump's team would destroy publicly anyone Ds pick. They'll spin up a million lies in a second. There are very few people in the world he would not attack: Michelle Obama (she's adament she'd never run), Ivanka... I can't think of any more.

With Biden, the Dem campaign can predict and combat the lies the R campaign will spread.

Did I miss something?  Why would Trump not attack Michelle Obama?

[kath16]

Harris is the only person they could remotely pull this off with.

[stuffandthings]

Jun 28, 2024 10:19:56 GMT -5 kadams767 said:

Jun 28, 2024 9:51:00 GMT -5 stuffandthings said:

Harris. She's got similar likeability numbers to Biden but her unfavorables are actually better and she's a stronger pick with Black voters. She can come off as feisty in a Trump debate but she's a political moderate so she can keep the never Trumpers. 81 million people already voted for her to be VP in 2024. If Biden resigns now she could govern for five months and make her case to the country.

www.politico.com/news/2024/06/12/kamala-harris-favorability-poll-00162093

Wait.  This is no longer just about Biden stepping away from being the nominee, but resigning as current president as well?  Oh man.  I am pretty sure this is even less likely than him stepping down as nominee.  

I have no problems with Biden, really. I'm only arguing that Biden resigning gives Harris the best chance to win in November--she can spend the next 5 months actually doing the job and showing everyone that she's capable.

In April of 2015 I would have said, "Donald Trump winning the presidency is even less likely than Donald Trump becoming the GOP nominee," and yet...it happened. Things in politics are always unlikely until they happen. What makes them happen is that people decide they should happen, right?

[underwaterrhymes]

A reminder from Luvvie Ajayi Jones that it’s about more than this election:

“Whoever gets elected in November will get to pick 2-3 Supreme Court justices.

Our SCOTUS is already 6-3 Conservative. November's election could very much mean it goes 8-1. That is for GENERATIONS. The implications are damning. For decades.

So. Keep that in mind.”

[neverfstop]

Harris-he could gracefully step aside and say it's time for the next generation, she could be a continuance of his administration & policies.
I know the GOP would shit all over anybody the D's pick, but fuck them..... it needs to be done & she's the best option.
She'd fire up a lot of people to be excited and interested, generate a lot of excitement, be a great foil to Trump (and his disdain for women and POC and his age)

[neverfstop]

The Axios newsletter this morning was brutal....4 headline stories about how Dems are freaking. Plus how harris was doing a great job at clean up last night...
www.axios.com/newsletters/axios-am-2733d180-34bf-11ef-9e4b-7929b8aed519.html

[stuffandthings]

Jun 28, 2024 10:35:03 GMT -5 neverfstop said:

Harris-he could gracefully step aside and say it's time for the next generation, she could be a continuance of his administration & policies.
I know the GOP would shit all over anybody the D's pick, but fuck them..... it needs to be done & she's the best option.
She'd fire up a lot of people to be excited and interested, generate a lot of excitement, be a great foil to Trump (and his disdain for women and POC and his age)

Yeah, the GOP had shown that they'll attack anyone who opposes Trump, even members of their own party! We're not going to find someone they won't attack. We just need someone they can't attack without making themselves look shittier in comparison. I think Harris could be that person, if she plays her cards right.

[laladypoet]

Jun 28, 2024 9:34:59 GMT -5 pixy0stix said:

Jun 28, 2024 8:45:06 GMT -5 laladypoet said:

...Bernie? don't hit me.

Sure, replace an 81 yo with an 82 yo who has been in declining health. Sounds legit.

it was a tongue-in-cheek.

[pixy0stix]

Jun 28, 2024 10:41:16 GMT -5 laladypoet said:

Jun 28, 2024 9:34:59 GMT -5 pixy0stix said:

Sure, replace an 81 yo with an 82 yo who has been in declining health. Sounds legit.

it was a tongue-in-cheek.

I'm just out of sorts this morning.

[fortnightlily]

I'd still happily vote for Hillary. Sigh.

[lilac05]

At this point, we’re used to “unprecedented times.” What’s one more?

No one can predict what would happen based on what has happened in the past because we’ve never had something like last night happen. I’m not even sure we’ve ever had an incumbent with such unfavorable numbers running for a second time (but could definitely be wrong there). We’ve also never had someone so dangerous running on the Republican ticket.

In my opinion, there’s truly no way anyone can predict with any reliability what would happen…except that they’d have a 50/50 chance of being right.

Living in a very purple area, I can absolutely envision a huge sigh of relief if literally anyone else showed up on the ticket for either party, and a big rally around that person. There are a LOT of people disenfranchised with both parties, and while many will show up to protect democracy, the number of young people who I have legitimately heard say, “Play stupid games, win stupid prizes” or something like that about refusing to vote. I truly think that they think nothing would *really* happen (like so many of us thought about so many things when we were younger).

Iowa went blue for Obama, and I believe we could do it again with the right candidate. It’s a long shot, but I refuse to give up.

I think Kamala’s response to the debate last night spoke volumes. In my dream scenario, Biden would step back on his own decision and enthusiastically support whoever ends up on the ticket. 2 weeks ago, I still wanted it, but thought there was no chance. Now I’m thinking it’s still unlikely, but possible.

[laladypoet]

Jun 28, 2024 10:44:34 GMT -5 pixy0stix said:

Jun 28, 2024 10:41:16 GMT -5 laladypoet said:

it was a tongue-in-cheek.

I'm just out of sorts this morning.

me too. solidarity, sister.

[fernweh]

Jun 28, 2024 10:32:32 GMT -5 underwaterrhymes said:

A reminder from Luvvie Ajayi Jones that it’s about more than this election:

“Whoever gets elected in November will get to pick 2-3 Supreme Court justices.

Our SCOTUS is already 6-3 Conservative. November's election could very much mean it goes 8-1. That is for GENERATIONS. The implications are damning. For decades.

So. Keep that in mind.”

Would it make it 8-1 though? Don’t get me wrong, I understand the importance of this election on the Supreme Court but the articles I’ve seen have the 2 that are likely to vacate are Alito and Thomas. If that were the case and a republican were in office it would still stay 6-3.
Is there other info out there that I’m missing?

[mrsslocombe]

Jun 28, 2024 10:53:34 GMT -5 fernweh said:

Jun 28, 2024 10:32:32 GMT -5 underwaterrhymes said:

A reminder from Luvvie Ajayi Jones that it’s about more than this election:

“Whoever gets elected in November will get to pick 2-3 Supreme Court justices.

Our SCOTUS is already 6-3 Conservative. November's election could very much mean it goes 8-1. That is for GENERATIONS. The implications are damning. For decades.

So. Keep that in mind.”

Would it make it 8-1 though? Don’t get me wrong, I understand the importance of this election on the Supreme Court but the articles I’ve seen have the 2 that are likely to vacate are Alito and Thomas. If that were the case and a republican were in office it would still stay 6-3.
Is there other info out there that I’m missing?

After Alito and Thomas, Sotomayor is the next oldest judge. 

Personally I find it hard to believe, even if the next president is Republican, that Alito will retire. He has too much power now and there's so many rights left to strip away. He also seems like the type who would be delulu about his own health/age/mental capacity.

Who knows about Thomas. 

Overall it seems like no one retires any more in government. Looking at you, Nancy and Chuck.

[underwaterrhymes]

Jun 28, 2024 10:53:34 GMT -5 fernweh said:

Jun 28, 2024 10:32:32 GMT -5 underwaterrhymes said:

A reminder from Luvvie Ajayi Jones that it’s about more than this election:

“Whoever gets elected in November will get to pick 2-3 Supreme Court justices.

Our SCOTUS is already 6-3 Conservative. November's election could very much mean it goes 8-1. That is for GENERATIONS. The implications are damning. For decades.

So. Keep that in mind.”

Would it make it 8-1 though? Don’t get me wrong, I understand the importance of this election on the Supreme Court but the articles I’ve seen have the 2 that are likely to vacate are Alito and Thomas. If that were the case and a republican were in office it would still stay 6-3.
Is there other info out there that I’m missing?

Sotomayor is older and purportedly not in the best health.

If we have a Democrat administration, people are encouraging her to retire so we can replace her with another Dem.

That would make it 7 to 2. As far as I know, Kagan and Brown Jackson are in good health, but Scalia’s death was sudden and I’m not at all confident that we can count on the 3 liberal Justices remaining healthy, especially since Trump will do what he can to eliminate our democracy.

[penguingrrl]

Jun 28, 2024 10:21:39 GMT -5 kadams767 said:

Jun 28, 2024 8:59:44 GMT -5 babsbunny said:

Trump's team would destroy publicly anyone Ds pick. They'll spin up a million lies in a second. There are very few people in the world he would not attack: Michelle Obama (she's adament she'd never run), Ivanka... I can't think of any more.

With Biden, the Dem campaign can predict and combat the lies the R campaign will spread.

Did I miss something?  Why would Trump not attack Michelle Obama?

Trump would absolutely attack Michelle, not even a question.

Also, Michelle has made it extremely clear that she is not a politician and there is absolutely no chance of her ever returning to the White House.