It's a super weird bullshit trap to offer to pay for half or whole but the real secret answer is that you want the man to decline your offer. And if he does take the option he should magically know isn't really an option then he doesn't get a second date. So, you're setting yourselves up for terrible communication and secret non-options. If you aren't willing to pay, and you're going to next a bro for taking up your offer to pay, just don't offer. I don't understand why some of you are talking in code.
I agree with this 100 percent. Stop playing this game. I have no intention of paying so I don't offer. I don't feign like I'm reaching for my wallet, none of that. No need. If he asks me to pay, I would not behave like the video woman, but I would be put off (didn't this muthafukka ask ME out?!) however I would pay my part and that would be the end of it and him, for me.
Agreed. I've never offered to pay when I've been asked out. I've never reached for my purse to say "Oh, let me chip in." You asked me out Bruh, Imma expect that you take the check when the server gets to the table.
Also, to the speaking in code thing- I didn't do that when I was dating. I was very clear about MY rules. If I didn't want to see ol' boy again, I'd say that I wasn't interested and kept it moving. I'm not gonna play games with other folks children. Likewise, the man I married was the same way. There were never any ambiguities with him. It was clear that we were dating because he made it known that he was no longer entertaining other women. Also, I knew going in that I had to take his last name when we married.
So, I agree, there are no games to be played when dating. Say what you want, be clear and roll out if that person isn't what YOU need. Life is too short to be sitting around mad about what someone is or is not. You know what you can and can't live with.
@eveer I have a pet peeve that I have to yap about. People use the words "same" and "equal" interchangeably. I think often people mean to use the word, "same."
Equal has a specific mathematical meaning as in greater than, less than or equal to. So if you say two things are not equal then you are saying they have a less than/greater than relationship.
So, "I don't think men and women are equal," becomes "I don't think men and women are the same."
Look, I don't want to go out with a guy who can't afford his own dinner or mine occasionally, either. But I can also afford my dinner and his and why not contribute? Why assume that my ability to pay for things is a non-factor to him? He might also be looking for someone who is self-sufficient.
Well, as I said earlier, that's what dating is, a chance for everyone to size each other up. If he needs a woman to pick up the tab on a date that he asked her out on and doesn't see that as rude and he finds a woman like you who is good with that, then y'all run off into the sunset together.
the bolded text is killing me, LOLOLOLOLOLOLOL!!!!
I'm loling that I'm being reprimanded for playing games, when I can GUARANTEE you're also looking for your own clues as to whether the person you're on a date with is worthy of a second date. We ALL play games, you just have to be honest with yourself that this is what you're doing.
I'm loling that I'm being reprimanded for playing games, when I can GUARANTEE you're also looking for your own clues as to whether the person you're on a date with is worthy of a second date. We ALL play games, you just have to be honest with yourself that this is what you're doing.
This is the thing about being divorced though. My tolerance for bullshit the second time around was low. If I said, I'm only looking for someone to hang with, I don't want serious, I meant it.
I dated this one guy who I liked, but his attention to me was lacking. He'd call, IM, text, buy me gifts, but the quality time was small. So, I stopped seeing him. I told him "You know, I'm really sad this never went anywhere." It was very matter of fact (like this should surprise anyone). He was like "Damn. That was cold." I told him well, I couldn't gauge his interest level based on his behavior, so therefore that's the answer he got.
So, nope. I wasn't having it when I was single. Again, I didn't have time to be bothered with foolishness.
I'm loling that I'm being reprimanded for playing games, when I can GUARANTEE you're also looking for your own clues as to whether the person you're on a date with is worthy of a second date. We ALL play games, you just have to be honest with yourself that this is what you're doing.
I don't think anyone is arguing that. It seems like people think that offering to pay half and then when a guy takes you up on offer--and then judging them based on taking you up on it--seems like a dishonest judgment of the person's character. They probably took you at face value.
The whole idea of setting up a guy with this scenario makes me wrinkle my nose. It feels like entrapment.
I'm loling that I'm being reprimanded for playing games, when I can GUARANTEE you're also looking for your own clues as to whether the person you're on a date with is worthy of a second date. We ALL play games, you just have to be honest with yourself that this is what you're doing.
This is the thing about being divorced though. My tolerance for bullshit the second time around was low. If I said, I'm only looking for someone to hang with, I don't want serious, I meant it.
I dated this one guy who I liked, but his attention to me was lacking. He'd call, IM, text, buy me gifts, but the quality time was small. So, I stopped seeing him. I told him "You know, I'm really sad this never went anywhere." It was very matter of fact (like this should surprise anyone). He was like "Damn. That was cold." I told him well, I couldn't gauge his interest level based on his behavior, so therefore that's the answer he got.
So, nope. I wasn't having it when I was single. Again, I didn't have time to be bothered with foolishness.
It might have been cold but it was honest feedback that when he thinks about it, it will help him in his next relationship IF he chooses to take your advice . You helped him!
This is the thing about being divorced though. My tolerance for bullshit the second time around was low. If I said, I'm only looking for someone to hang with, I don't want serious, I meant it.
I dated this one guy who I liked, but his attention to me was lacking. He'd call, IM, text, buy me gifts, but the quality time was small. So, I stopped seeing him. I told him "You know, I'm really sad this never went anywhere." It was very matter of fact (like this should surprise anyone). He was like "Damn. That was cold." I told him well, I couldn't gauge his interest level based on his behavior, so therefore that's the answer he got.
So, nope. I wasn't having it when I was single. Again, I didn't have time to be bothered with foolishness.
It might have been cold but it was honest feedback that when he thinks about it, it will help him in his next relationship. You helped him!
Homeboy is still single. We're FB friends. I imagine nothing has changed. He claimed to be "shy." Child please. You make time for things that are important to you.
Post by foundmylazybum on Oct 17, 2015 17:25:19 GMT -5
@nitax, I think your advice is good . It's all about mindset. I don't think it would necessarily be an easy pill to swallow (when is looking in the mirror and accepting our flaws--especially from someone dumping us easy?) but your feedback was clear and honest. No games or guessing. Maybe someday he'll get there--or not lol.
@nitax, I think your advice is good . It's all about mindset. I don't think it would necessarily be an easy pill to swallow (when is looking in the mirror and accepting our flaws--especially from someone dumping us easy?) but your feedback was clear and honest. No games or guessing. Maybe someday he'll get there--or not lol.
My dating stories are legend. LOL One of my friends said that guys didn't last 90 days with me. I just knew what Red Flags to avoid. If you showed any of them, I peaced out.
Having been married to a Serial Cheater, I was not one to play games. The On Again Off Again Guy I dated who couldn't handle the Friend Zone and me dating other guys, I flat out told him that we couldn't be friends and we couldn't date because I was grown and this is not high school. "I had an on again, off again marriage. I'm not doing that with a boyfriend."
My H like dating divorced women because "there were no games. I found divorced women to be clear in what they needed and wanted." This is why he and I get along fabulously. He's a good dude. But if I spent time playing around and wasting my time, I would have missed him.
Look, make-up is expensive (please see the MUB board). Doing my hair is a time expenditure. Clothes/accessories/shoes? All expenses, and chances are I'm going to wear my nicer stuff to the date.
The dude is maybe using hair gel, doing a quick shave, and putting on deoderant. I think if you toss in the expense for gas and the meal, that's pretty even and not a bad investment for the opportunity to interview each other... because that's what it is.
But I would also never push a bill across to the dude. I wouldn't want to pursue that shit, so why would he? If he doesn't take the initiative to pay the thing in full, I'll pay my half and bid him goodnight.
You know, now that I think back, when I was on Ma.tch.com back before meeting DH, those dates were all halfsies. I was OK with that because I figured we were each going on lots of dates, and I didn't think that would be fair to the dudes to pay 100% for 100% of the dates. Though now I question if maybe the site gives dudes a discount for their membership if they assume they would pay for dates... hmmm. All the questions.
@ladydisdain said part of what I'm thinking. Women tend to spend more time and money on their pre-date prep (makeup, clothes, nails, hair, shoes, shaving/waxing, etc.). I know it can be expensive for men to date (XH said he wasn't doing online dating because he couldn't afford it, which make me LOL).
I also have the standards I have now because of XH. I prefer that the man pay for the first couple of dates at least. Once it looks like it's going somewhere and we're exclusive, I do more. Splitting or paying for both, cooking, baking, etc. But I try not to give too much too soon and instead want to see that the man is willing to make the effort to invite me out and pay. Also, if it's an "I'd love to take you out" invite and then he expects me to pay, that's a bait and switch IMO.
Example of what I'm okay with: last night's date to a hockey game. He bought the tickets and the first round of beers. I bought myself food (he wanted none) and the second beers. He bought the third round of beers. Not a problem. Except for him not wanting to eat and not considering that I might need to eat when I was rushing home from work to get ready and meet him at the arena. So I'll consider a second date if he puts in good effort, but if it's half-assed, no thanks. I married half assed (quarter assed, maybe) and I'm not going back there.
I'm starting to see my problem - the whole idea of being woo'd seems icky to me - I'm seeing crazy single cat lady on the horizon!
Not necessarily, I'm sure there are plenty of men out there who would rather not bother with the wooing and would be happy to date someone compatible in that way.
16 years into my relationship with DH, what I find that what I want, really, really want, is just simple love. Like super simple, uncomplicated, "I adore you" love. I want someone who lights up when I walk into the room, who looks forward to seeing me at the end of the day, who, with no reason at all, gives me a hug, who talks with me and is curious about me, who cares when I'm upset and wants to comfort me and who seeks to find ways to make me joyful. I want a partner - someone who is in the foxhole with me, who will crawl with me under the bed with the scary monsters and just be there with me, who views me as a teammate in love and parenting and joy and sadness. And I want someone who will let me be that for them. The kind of person who is capable of that, I suspect, does not in any way correlate with the kind of person who does or does not offer to pay for the meal on the first date. It correlates with the kind of person who is deeply emotionally connected to this world, has a capacity for empathy, is curious and intellectually engaged and engaging, and is not so concerned about impressing you as connecting with you.
When someone holds a door open for me, I say, "Thank you." If I were still dating and someone offered to pay for a meal, I'd say, "Thank you, let me leave the tip" and then I'd probably offer to pick up the next meal.
These kinds of interactions would do little to persuade me in one direction or the other that the person was someone I wanted to have as a life partner. It would be almost completely irrelevant to me. I don't even see these kinds of interactions anymore as having anything to do with feminism or sexism. The "rules" are confusing these days. People don't know what will be offensive (damned if you do, damned if you don't). I would just want to know what kind of person they are and I don't think, these days, that you can actually figure that out based on who pays on the first date.
Post by lurkingdobalina on Oct 18, 2015 18:44:53 GMT -5
I will eventually dip my toes into the dating pool again and you people terrify me. Glad I'm not into dating women. But, I know so many people with restaurants I almost always get comped when eating out. THAT'S going to be awkward...no, you can't pay for me, I know the chef...I'm cringing already.
But if I do the asking I do the paying. I will create no false expectations or play any silly games. I have enough money to support myself, so maybe that's the reason I don't need to be "woo'ed." I already have the power of self determination and don't need to try and gain any upper hand other than "Hey, do I enjoy spending time with this person?"
I'm loling that I'm being reprimanded for playing games, when I can GUARANTEE you're also looking for your own clues as to whether the person you're on a date with is worthy of a second date. We ALL play games, you just have to be honest with yourself that this is what you're doing.
This is the thing about being divorced though. My tolerance for bullshit the second time around was low. If I said, I'm only looking for someone to hang with, I don't want serious, I meant it.
I dated this one guy who I liked, but his attention to me was lacking. He'd call, IM, text, buy me gifts, but the quality time was small. So, I stopped seeing him. I told him "You know, I'm really sad this never went anywhere." It was very matter of fact (like this should surprise anyone). He was like "Damn. That was cold." I told him well, I couldn't gauge his interest level based on his behavior, so therefore that's the answer he got.
So, nope. I wasn't having it when I was single. Again, I didn't have time to be bothered with foolishness.
Yep. I dated a lot between my cheating ex-husband and current boyfriend, because after what I'd been through and learned, I wasn't about to settle. Plus being single has its advantages and isn't the worst thing in the world. I'd much rather be single and fulfilled in other non-romantic ways than be with a dud, or even someone mediocre.
When I was casually dating, I did not suffer fools. I stopped dating one dude because he was weird about not wanting my boots on his bed (like, before we were about to bang). Lady boner killer. In itself it wasn't a big deal, but it was symptomatic of a level of uptightness that I am not at all compatible with.
But I always tried to go halfsies on the check, especially on a first date. I don't see why the man should necessarily pay. I'm a grown woman. Or like, you buy a round, I'll buy the next one.
This thread encouraged me to ask one of the guys I'm dating out for this coming week. He's picking the location this time and I'm planning to pay since I did the asking. Though I haven't told him that part yet.
I will eventually dip my toes into the dating pool again and you people terrify me. Glad I'm not into dating women. But, I know so many people with restaurants I almost always get comped when eating out. THAT'S going to be awkward...no, you can't pay for me, I know the chef...I'm cringing already.
But if I do the asking I do the paying. I will create no false expectations or play any silly games. I have enough money to support myself, so maybe that's the reason I don't need to be "woo'ed." I already have the power of self determination and don't need to try and gain any upper hand other than "Hey, do I enjoy spending time with this person?"
No need to be scared! LOL I did actually enjoy dating, it's just that there's no need to fool yourself or deal with foolishness. You set the terms for what you want. You'll fumble a little, but you'll get to a point where you say - you know what - these are the things I need. After that, your suitors will begin to reflect those needs because of what you set out. If they don't match up - no harm, no foul, move to the next.
That said, I dated some really nice guys. Those same guys - like myself - eventually all got married to the perfect match for them. The same way I married the match for me.
What I did was take inventory of the guys I dated. What did I like about them and what I didn't. I made note of all the qualities I liked and when I met my H, all my little boxes were checked. Likewise, I fulfilled the things on his list.
I just think overall people make dating more cumbersome than it is because they don't take people at face value. Don't ignore red flags and be clear on YOUR needs. You're in control. People can only do what you allow them to do.
Yep. I dated a lot between my cheating ex-husband and current boyfriend, because after what I'd been through and learned, I wasn't about to settle. Plus being single has its advantages and isn't the worst thing in the world. I'd much rather be single and fulfilled in other non-romantic ways than be with a dud, or even someone mediocre.
When I was casually dating, I did not suffer fools. I stopped dating one dude because he was weird about not wanting my boots on his bed (like, before we were about to bang). Lady boner killer. In itself it wasn't a big deal, but it was symptomatic of a level of uptightness that I am not at all compatible with.
But I always tried to go halfsies on the check, especially on a first date. I don't see why the man should necessarily pay. I'm a grown woman. Or like, you buy a round, I'll buy the next one.
See, he might have been a good match for me because shoes don't belong on the bed ever. LOL
I should've clarified... It was before any shoes even ended up on the bed. Like, we were making out on the couch and then went up to his bedroom, and when we got there he warned me not to get my boots on the bed. Okay dude, I was going to take them off first but I can see you're thinking about your bedspread and not the chick you're about to bang, gotcha.
Nothing but boots on could be hot as hell. Sheets can be washed yo
Clearly 1234FIF! would never ride off into the sunset with me.
Not boots you've been walking all outside in ughhhh . I don't even like shoes in my bedroom. Plus, no street clothes on the sheets. Basically, strip down at the door, spray down with Lysol and then head to the shower THEN meet me in the bedroom. LOLLLLLLLLLLLLLL
That's a lot of work for sex. #lazydirtysexpartner
Nothing but boots on could be hot as hell. Sheets can be washed yo
Clearly 1234FIF! would never ride off into the sunset with me.
Not boots you've been walking all outside in ughhhh . I don't even like shoes in my bedroom. Plus, no street clothes on the sheets. Basically, strip down at the door, spray down with Lysol and then head to the shower THEN meet me in the bedroom. LOLLLLLLLLLLLLLL
I've already admitted to not dating for a long time, but if a guy made me go through all that - even without the lysol - to get busy for the first time...well, I'd think he wasn't all that into me.
I have gone on so many first dates recently...and ever time I go, I intend on paying my half. If the dude wants to waive off my card, that's fine. But I'm not holding it against the the guy who lets me pay half. If I connect with the person, and I want to see them again, I will, because there are a whole lot of other things I would consider as "desirable traits" before the question of chivalry comes up.
But I think everyone has a "thing" for some, I think I am rather critical when it comes to feeling a spark. Some women are perfectly happy to accept second dates with someone they don't have that instant chemistry with because it can happen later. For me, and where I am right now, I don't waste my time on second dates if I don't feel excited by the prospect. We all have a thing.
Post by sugarglider on Oct 20, 2015 8:18:26 GMT -5
I met xH a week after I graduated college and BF at the end of my 1L year, 8 months post-divorce. So...despite having 6 years of real salaries, I've never gone on a first date when I wasn't a starving student.
So, I guess I've never paid on a first date that I can recall.
Ultimately, don't be rude or defensive. I don't mind paying for half; I just don't want to be guilted into doing so.
I often try to grab the bill from BF. He does all the grocery shopping and 95% of the cooking, so paying when we're out makes sense to me.