I specifically asked you, specifically and clearly, if you sang "stabbing their ears and mutilating their genitals with a blender? Cutting them in half and using their own blood as lube for anal penetration?" Your response was "yes, the words were exactly the same."
You are missing the point here that perpetuation of rape culture is not a small thing and that you are motherfucking defending it because you feel that it was the essence of your childhood or some shit.
This is why I said that I'm personally struggling with it. Because generally I'm very against the perpetuation of rape culture so it's sort of a personal conundrum here.
I can ask H if the words were exactly the same to the S&M man song. It's done in a call and response kind of way, so they take turns singing out the verses and then the group chimes in with the chorus. I think I misunderstood when you asked about the words because there are two songs in the OP.
I'm missing the conundrum here. What POSSIBLE defense is there to continue singing these songs?? I mean, it's not like MAAAAYBE these could be interpreted as rapey. They are outright sickening.
Post by heliocentric on Apr 8, 2014 15:49:48 GMT -5
Damn. Those lyrics are worse than I imagined. WTF? How is that possibly OK?
I am not a team or group bonding person, but I can sort of understand having a silly song over which you bond, but I cannot fathom how these songs are considered fun or help with bonding. Unless your idea of fun is to bond with other misogynistic assholes. In that case you've found your anthem(s).
I am sickened that there are people who think this shit is OK.
Y'know, Jimmy Crack Corn is an old traditional song, too.
I have never until this moment thought anything was hinky about those lyrics. I assume it's due to the fact that I haven't heard the song in over 30 years, but holy shit.
College is... college. I did some things I'm not proud of in college. Hopefully not that perpetuated misogyny, but I can't remember everything at the moment.
But going to a rugby reunion and singing THOSE songs as a late-20 or 30-something adult and not saying, "Hold the fuck up, here, people"? No.
The sad thing is that now you will all have a very negative opinion of rugby - and rightly so when you see the song.
But there are good things to it, like it was a walk on sport that anyone could join. It encourages women to be fierce and physical. I learned how to tackle. I learned how to ruck. I learned that I could have a great group of women who would be there for me no matter what.
And you're right, it is sad if there was a member of my team who had been assaulted and then heard the men sing the S&M man song. And with 50 women on the team I am sure there was one of them out there, although I didn't necessarily know of it. And now I feel badly about that.
LOL. I have a very negative opinion of YOU right now. I cannot believe that a woman is trying to throw out support for such hateful, evil bullshit. You should truly be ashamed of yourself.
1 out of every 6 American women has been the victim of a sexual assault, and I know far too many women who have been that woman. My mother. My sister. My best friend. My cousin. Me.
Fucking disgraceful. Shame on you. I had a much harsher reply in mind, but my blood pressure is rising right now. I'm done.
I'll bow out now. I realize I am not doing myself any favors here.
You didn't and since you have been quoted to here and back may I gently suggest you stay away from these topics from now on? I can see this being brought up for the rest of your GBCN career.
OK - in defense of the song "the S&M man". That is a classic rugby drinking song.
For those of you that aren't familiar with what happens after the rugby game, both games get together and sing dirty songs while drinking. It is gobs of fun.
the men's rugby team at my college always sang the S&M man song.
We sang lots of obscene songs, too, as the women's rugby team.
As a women's rugby team, we sang that "yoho yoho" song. Except that the lyrics were changed to be from a women's perspective - like a woman wanting sex. "he put his dick into my mouth, yoho, yoho"
"and then he came into my mouth, yoho, yoho" "i said <spit your beer on everyone>" get in get out quit fucking about yoho yoho yoho
So yeeah, I'm not going to get upset about the drinking songs.
At the risk of responding too early into my reading of the thread, I just have to stop here and say:
what the fuck is wrong with you?
Girl don't worry about it because the rest of the thread pretty much consists of your sentiment in addition to her explaining why the song is cool beans. Sweet Jesus!
And you're right, it is sad if there was a member of my team who had been assaulted and then heard the men sing the S&M man song. And with 50 women on the team I am sure there was one of them out there, although I didn't necessarily know of it. And now I feel badly about that.
Look, I'm not good at math, but 1/4 of 50 women is not one person. It's way more than one person. Who were forced to sing a rape song to fit in with the rest of the group. You should feel badly.
Take your man around the corner where the lights are way down low Put one hand up on his shoulder and the other down below When he starts to shake and shiver and he gives a little cry Tell him that's the secret handshake of the dear old delta tri.
And in retrospect I'm embarrassed about THAT one but it seems tame now.
LoveTrains I am really shocked. I was seeing the responses but didn't see who was being quoted and I was shocked to see it was you. Not singing rape songs would not have lessened your college experience, not a bit, and I'm sad you think it would have.
I am really glad though that I stayed away from Georgia tech parties.
Post by EloiseWeenie on Apr 8, 2014 19:11:54 GMT -5
I'm really glad my college crew team didn't sing rapey songs. Actually, we didn't sing any songs. It's bullshit that the songs are an integral part of the team.
I will add that we had a frat get kicked off campus (well several at different points). The most notorious was Kappa Alpha, which is a very strong Southern frat (they had a portrait of Robert E Lee behind bullet proof glass) and they had a cannon. (Fake but still) it was pointed across the street. At the Alpha house. I think there was a confederate flag involved too. This was the year before I started so the details were hazy.
But yeah, the KA boys were all about "tradition" too and their asses still got kicked off.
Group think among fraternities can be a really powerful thing. Frats nowadays are basically about drinking and hooking up with some philanthropy and sports thrown in. I can see how it would be hard to be a pledge or whatever and say "that song is fucked up. Rapebait is a fucked up term" and so on. But it makes me sad and angry that NO ONE questioned it from what we know. It was all a joke. That's just an awful commentary on our society.
Post by EloiseWeenie on Apr 8, 2014 19:24:03 GMT -5
I can't get over that lovetrains isn't willing to call out a freaking 20 year old on a despicable tradition. Dude, aren't alumni supposed to be older and wiser? Take an opportunity to guide the young rugbylings. If that's too scary, tell me where you went and I'll email the chancellor.
I will add that we had a frat get kicked off campus (well several at different points). The most notorious was Kappa Alpha, which is a very strong Southern frat (they had a portrait of Robert E Lee behind bullet proof glass) and they had a cannon. (Fake but still) it was pointed across the street. At the Alpha house. I think there was a confederate flag involved too. This was the year before I started so the details were hazy.
But yeah, the KA boys were all about "tradition" too and their asses still got kicked off.
Group think among fraternities can be a really powerful thing. Frats nowadays are basically about drinking and hooking up with some philanthropy and sports thrown in. I can see how it would be hard to be a pledge or whatever and say "that song is fucked up. Rapebait is a fucked up term" and so on. But it makes me sad and angry that NO ONE questioned it from what we know. It was all a joke. That's just an awful commentary on our society.
KA, the southern gentleman of the frat community. They were the good guys on my campus.